Graphology - Elvis/Jesse & Linda's Evidence

edited January 1970 in News
Okay after reading the Mo's thread on Eliza and the DNA I went back to Linda Hood Sigmon's website on Jesse/Elvis. I do believe that it is possible that Elvis faked his death but I have some reservations about whether Linda's site is providing unequivocal evidence of that. One of things that she uses to support her claim that Jesse is Elvis, is handwriting analysis by a Graphologist, Shirley Mae Mason.

From Linda's website:

Interview with the Graphologist
In this 2004 update regarding Elvis/Jesse and Dr. Hinton, FOX 8 in Cleveland aired this report which included the interview with the graphologist, Ms. Shirley Mason. In this interview you will see and hear all of Ms. Mason's credentials and the very impressive history of her professional life.

You will see and hear Ms. Mason state unequivocally that the handwriting in the letter which Jesse wrote to the Attorney General of Missouri (in defense of Dr. Hinton in Dec. 2002) was absolutely written by the same person as the letters written by Elvis Presley prior to August 16, 1977.

You will see, in no uncertain terms, that Ms. Mason states, without reservation, that Jesse is Elvis Presley.

Please take note that the forensic expert who FOX 8 hired to examine Jesse's letters stated that her results were non conclusive...she states that she cannot say for sure that the letters written by Jesse were a match for the letters written by Elvis Presley. BUT she also states that she "...certainly couldn't say that they were not the same writer". In my opinion, this lady was not willing to admit to the conclusive evidence that Jesse and Elvis are one and the same...so she chose to give no definitive answer. This could have been because it was such a highly controversial topic and could have reflected badly on her career if she gave the wrong answer.

Please take note that Jesse wrote this letter to the Attorney General of Missouri in December, 2002. The Attorney General brought in Ms. Mason to certify that the letter to him actually was written by none other than Elvis Presley. The Attorney General admitted Ms. Mason's report into evidence in his decision on the charges against Dr. Hinton. The Attorney General's investigation resulted in all fraud charges being dropped against Dr. Hinton.

[youtube:370eu7il]
http://www.lindahoodsigmontruth.com/page4

Shirley Mae Mason is deceased now and from her obituary it states:
Shirley was a retired school teacher. She tutored, home schooled as well as taught in both private and public schools for over 37 years. She had a masters degree in helping the mentally disturbed and learning disabled children. The Restoration Hymnal Committee and for the Book of Mormon Research. In later years she took a course in Science of Graphology. She became a international graphologist and worked for the Kansas City Bureau of Investigation for 10 years. Her expertise in handwriting or brain writing analysis, would hold up in a court of law.
http://www.examiner.net/obituaries/x1991992448/Shirley-Mae-Mason

What is Graphology?

Graphology
Graphology is the pseudoscientific study and analysis of handwriting especially in relation to human psychology. In the medical field, it can be used to refer to the study of handwriting as an aid in diagnosis and tracking of diseases of the brain and nervous system. The term is sometimes incorrectly used to refer to forensic document examination.

Graphology has been controversial for more than a century. Although supporters point to the anecdotal evidence of thousands of positive testimonials as a reason to use it for personality evaluation, most empirical studies fail to show the validity claimed by its supporters.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Graphology

Graphology
Graphology or handwriting analysis is based upon the interpretation of certain signs and symbols to be found in a specimen of handwriting. In the view of a graphologist, the complicated mental, physical, and psychic machinery known as human beings betray so much detail about themselves in their handwriting because the actual process of handwriting begins in the mind, with thought. All handwriting is first an idea that becomes a desire to communicate that thought to paper. Graphologists perceive handwriting analysis as a doorway to the subconscious. As such, not only conscious but subconsciously formed habit patterns and personality traits show up in an individual's handwriting.

Because handwriting reveals the inner person through his or her subconscious, graphologists believe that there are universal symbols that are evident in handwriting, beginning as early as a child's first attempts at writing.

Graphologists are convinced that handwriting analysis can reveal an individual's innermost thoughts, motivations, and desires. The handwriting of individuals with an advanced psychosis and extreme neurosis would differ from that of an "average" person. In psychosis, the analyst would see traits that are considered normal, but they would be exaggerated, amplified, carried to such lengths that they would become, then, undesirable traits.
http://www.unexplainedstuff.com/Prophecy-and-Divination/Graphology.html

Pseudoscience
Pseudoscience is a claim, belief, or practice which is presented as scientific, but which does not adhere to a valid scientific methodology, lacks supporting evidence or plausibility, cannot be reliably tested, or otherwise lacks scientific status. Pseudoscience is often characterized by the use of vague, exaggerated or unprovable claims, an over-reliance on confirmation rather than rigorous attempts at refutation, a lack of openness to evaluation by other experts, and a general absence of systematic processes to rationally develop theories. The term "pseudoscience" is inherently pejorative, because it suggests that something is being inaccurately or deceptively portrayed as science. Accordingly, those labeled as practicing or advocating pseudoscience normally dispute the characterization.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pseudoscientific

What is Graphology used for?

Applications of Graphology
Employment profiling
A company takes a writing sample provided by an applicant, and proceeds to do a personality profile, matching the congruency of the applicant with the ideal psychological profile of employees in the position. A graphological report is meant to be used in conjunction with other tools, such as comprehensive background checks, practical demonstration or record of work skills. Graphology supporters state that it can complement but not replace traditional hiring tools. Research in employment suitability has ranged from complete failure to guarded success. The most substantial reason for not using handwriting analysis in the employment process is the absence of evidence of a direct link between handwriting analysis and various measures of job performance. The use of graphology in the hiring process has been criticized on ethical grounds and on legal grounds.

Business compatibility
This is an additional service offered by some handwriting analysts. The focus of these reports can be one, or more of the following:
Company-wide - This is a report the describes how compatible the individual is, with each employee in the company.
The average company employee.

Division wide -This is a report that describes how compatible the individual is, with each employee in the division.
The average division employee.

Unit wide - This is a report the describes how compatible the individual is, with each employee in the unit.
The average unit employee.

The unit manager/Co-worker - This explores the differences in personal style between a manager/co-worker and potential employee. The end result is on how each can maximize productivity and minimize personal friction.

Composite reports - This explores the difference in personal style between every employee in a group. The idea is for each member of the group to learn not only their own strengths and weakness, but also those of their co-workers, and how they can more harmoniously work together.

Psychological analysis
These reports can range from a ten item check off list to a 25 page report on the makeup of an individual from the perspective of Freudian Psychoanalysis, Transactional Analysis, or another personality theory.

Marital compatibility
In its simplest form only sexual expression and sexual response are examined. At its most complex, every aspect of an individual is examined for how it affects the other individual(s). The basic theory is that after knowing and understanding how each other is different, any commitment that is made will be more enduring. Typically done for couples, it is not unknown for a polyamorous group to obtain a report prior to the commitment ceremony of a new individual.

In cultures where arranged marriages are common, graphology can be used as an additional checkpoint on the compatibility of the couple prior to the elders giving their consent for the marriage to take place.

Medical diagnosis
Medical graphology is probably the most controversial aspect of handwriting analysis. Strictly speaking, such research is not graphology as described throughout this article but an examination of factors pertaining to motor control. Research studies have been conducted in which a detailed examination of handwriting factors, particularly timing, fluidity, pressure, and consistency of size, form, speed, and pressure are considered in the process of evaluating patients and their response to pharmacological therapeutic agents. The study of these phenomena is a by-product of researchers investigating motor control processes and the interaction of nervous, anatomical, and biomechanical systems of the body.

Jury screening
A graphologist is given handwriting samples of a prospective jury and determines who should be struck, based upon their alleged personality profile. After the trial has begun, the graphologist advises counsel on how to slant their case, for the most favorable response from the jury.

Graphotherapy
This is the practice of changing a person's handwriting with the goal of changing features of his or her personality. It was pioneered in France during the nineteen-thirties, spreading to the United states in the late fifties. The therapy consists of a series of exercises which are similar to those taught in basic calligraphy courses, sometimes in conjunction with music or positive self-talk. There have been anecdotal reports of these exercises curing everything from drug addiction to anorexia nervosa, and back to borderline personality disorder.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Graphology#Applications_of_graphology

So you can see that Graphology is not used to identify individuals but used to evaluate the personality characteristics of the individual through their handwriting. It is mainly used in employment situations.

Is Graphology Accepted in Courts?
The answer is NO.

Daubert standard for expert witnesses
The U.S. Supreme Court case Daubert v. Merrell Dow Pharmaceuticals defined several criteria that expert testimony must meet to be admissible as evidence.

* Be verifiable, refutable, and testable;
* Be valid and reliable;
* Subject to published peer review;
* Held to standards within the field;
* Be generally accepted in the scientific community;

Depending upon the specific system of graphology that is used, it fails between two and five criteria.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Graphology#Legal_considerations

Graphology - Courts
Although handwriting analysis may provide valuable leads that in some cases may lead to the discovery of the perpetrator of a crime and that person's subsequent arrest, the testimony of graphology by itself has not been accepted by appellate courts in the United States. In spite of the claims made by graphologists, the courts have ruled that it does not meet the requirements of the kind of science that may be relied upon in a court of law. In those instances where a person's employment may have hinged upon a graphoanalytical evaluation, plaintiffs may sue an employer who used graphology in an employment decision.
http://www.unexplainedstuff.com/Prophecy-and-Divination/Graphology.html

So what type of analysis is used to determine authorship of a document?

Questioned document examination (QDE)
Questioned document examination (QDE) is the forensic science discipline pertaining to documents that are (or may be) in dispute in a court of law. The primary purpose of questioned/forensic document examination is to answer questions about a disputed document using a variety of scientific processes and methods. Many examinations involve a comparison of the questioned document, or components of the document, to a set of known standards. The most common type of examination involves handwriting wherein the examiner tries to address concerns about potential authorship.

A document examiner is often asked to determine if a questioned item originated from the same source as the known item(s), then present their opinion on the matter in court as an expert witness. Other common tasks include determining what has happened to a document, determining when a document was produced, or deciphering information on the document that has been obscured, obliterated or erased.

The discipline is known by many names including forensic document examination, document examination, diplomatics, handwriting examination, or sometimes handwriting analysis, although the latter term is not often used as it may be confused with graphology. Likewise a forensic document examiner (FDE) is not to be confused with a graphologist, and vice versa.

Many FDEs receive extensive training in all of the different aspects of the discipline. As a result they are competent to address a wide variety of questions about document evidence. However, this "broad specialization" approach has not been universally adopted.

In some locales, a clear distinction is made between the terms forensic document examiner and a forensic handwriting expert/examiner. In such cases, the former term refers to examiners who focus on non-handwriting examination types while the latter refers to those trained exclusively to do handwriting examinations. Even in places where the more general meaning is common, such as North America or Australia, there are many individuals who have specialized training only in certain relatively limited areas. As the terminology varies from jurisdiction to jurisdiction, it is important to clarify the meaning of the title used by any given individual professing to be a "forensic document examiner".
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Questioned_document_examination

So if Linda actually wanted to prove that those letters and documents were written by Elvis, she would have to have them examined by a Certified Forensic Document Examiner. Fox News, did just that and the FDE said that the results were inconclusive, they could NOT determine if Elvis had written the letter to the Attorney General.

I want to point this out also: It has been reported that Jesse has had plastic surgery. Neither Linda nor Dr. Hinton have actually met Jesse. All communication has been through phone conversations and letters. These letters are therefore the major piece of concrete evidence for Linda/Hinton that the person contacting them is actually Elvis. BUT these documents have not been forensically verified, graphology is not an accepted type of analysis in the scientific community nor in the legal realm. The analysis DOES NOT PROVE that the person in contact with Linda is actually Elvis.

Linda has now come out, on Jesse's behalf, AGAINST Eliza's case. So we have two woman, who say they are in contact with Jesse/Elvis, one says that Jesse/Elvis is supporting their paternity case, the other says he is not. We have no way of knowing if the Jesse, who is in contact with Linda, is the same Jesse that is in contact with Eliza (Eliza has never met him either). We have no confirmation that any letter Jesse has written to Linda, Dr. Hinton or the Attorney General was actually from Elvis. There could be more than one Jesse in this situation or we could have one Jesse, purposely creating this controversy, for a yet to be determined reason.

No matter what, Linda's evidence is just as shaky as Eliza's DNA (chain of custody issues)...

So where does that leave us?
«1

Comments

  • MJonmindMJonmind Posts: 7,290
    <!-- s:shock: -->:shock:<!-- s:shock: -->
    This goes very well with Mo's discovery.
    This is almost it:
    Repeat after me: "I CAN think for myself"
    Thanks Serenity_Dream!
  • curlscurls Posts: 3,111
    Serenity, you ask 'Where does that leave us?' Well, personally, it leaves me thinking that no matter who links themselves to The Man (in either case, Elvis or MJ) after their death, there should always be doubt, or maybe caution would be a better word, surrounding them. Look to the man himself.
  • SouzaSouza Posts: 9,400

    Exactly what my point was, why were people blindly believing Linda? I go for the 2 Jesse's. I do think Linda had always contact with the real deal though and I think that handwriting could very well be real, but my gut tells me that she might have been fooled lately. It is her nervous and strange posts lately that make me think this, but it is just a gut feeling.

    I still say we need to wait it out. Court date is December 14, we can wait those 3 weeks, right?

    "For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places."

  • SarahliSarahli Posts: 4,265
    Indeed the best thing to do is to wait and see what is going to happen. In reality all this is very thrilling. The suspens is at its height!!

  • Exactly what my point was, why were people blindly believing Linda? I go for the 2 Jesse's. I do think Linda had always contact with the real deal though and I think that handwriting could very well be real, but my gut tells me that she might have been fooled lately. It is her nervous and strange posts lately that make me think this, but it is just a gut feeling.

    I still say we need to wait it out. Court date is December 14, we can wait those 3 weeks, right?

    LOL, I don't know about you guys but waiting has sort of become my thing <!-- s:lol: -->:lol:<!-- s:lol: --> <!-- s:lol: -->:lol:<!-- s:lol: --> <!-- s:lol: -->:lol:<!-- s:lol: -->
  • paula-cpaula-c Posts: 7,221
    If it is necessary to wait, but I fear that this case of Eliza is not going to solve favorably for her.
  • MissGMissG Posts: 7,403
    Serenity, you ask 'Where does that leave us?' Well, personally, it leaves me thinking that no matter who links themselves to The Man (in either case, Elvis or MJ) after their death, there should always be doubt, or maybe caution would be a better word, surrounding them. Look to the man himself.


    Yes. Once one is dead, who can prove anything? Is a lost case for Eliza and for us if we are thinking about a MJ return.
    If Michael decides to stay hidden, legally we will never know if our thoughts of him being alive will be corroborated.

    I refuse to stay in the darkness of the doubt as Elvis fans <!-- s:evil: -->:evil:<!-- s:evil: -->
  • paula-cpaula-c Posts: 7,221
    Gema wrote:

    curls wrote:
    Serenity, you ask 'Where does that leave us?' Well, personally, it leaves me thinking that no matter who links themselves to The Man (in either case, Elvis or MJ) after their death, there should always be doubt, or maybe caution would be a better word, surrounding them. Look to the man himself.


    Yes. Once one is dead, who can prove anything? Is a lost case for Eliza and for us if we are thinking about a MJ return.
    If Michael decides to stay hidden, legally we will never know if our thoughts of him being alive will be corroborated.

    I refuse to stay in the darkness of the doubt as Elvis fans

    Elvis fans are waiting 33 years Gema <!-- s:lol: -->:lol:<!-- s:lol: --> .. 33 years .... <!-- s:? -->:?<!-- s:? --> <!-- s:roll: -->:roll:<!-- s:roll: -->
  • MissGMissG Posts: 7,403
    That should be painful, my gosh, 33 years waiting.

    Any way, I have my back door ready. If MJ does not come back, I will know that i am a certified crackpot and will not trust myself anymore <!-- s:lol: -->:lol:<!-- s:lol: --> but in my delution I will wisper "Michael didn´t die on June 25th 2009" and I will tell that story to my grandkids.
  • trustno1trustno1 Posts: 654
    <!-- s:lol: -->:lol:<!-- s:lol: --> <!-- s:lol: -->:lol:<!-- s:lol: --> <!-- s:lol: -->:lol:<!-- s:lol: --> <!-- s:lol: -->:lol:<!-- s:lol: -->

    Gema you always crack me up! For me to wait 33 years (which is as long as I've lived so far) is incomprehendible, I hope one day the Elvis fans will have their definite proof.
  • MissGMissG Posts: 7,403
    I wish Elvis fans to find clousure as well.
  • chappiechappie Posts: 529
    I am a Elvis fan.....but i am not waiting 33 years for the man to return... <!-- s;) -->;)<!-- s;) -->
    If he is really dead....so be it....
    If he is still alive...he had damned good reasons to fake his death.....

    Chappie
  • MJonmindMJonmind Posts: 7,290
    Christians have been waiting almost 2000 years. The first believers literally enthusiastically thought Jesus the Messiah was coming in their lifetime, as did/has each generation ever since. <!-- s:shock: -->:shock:<!-- s:shock: --> <!-- s:( -->:(<!-- s:( --> <!-- s:) -->:)<!-- s:) --> <!-- s8-) -->8-)<!-- s8-) -->
  • :lol: <!-- s:lol: -->:lol:<!-- s:lol: --> <!-- s:lol: -->:lol:<!-- s:lol: --> <!-- s:lol: -->:lol:<!-- s:lol: -->

    Gema you always crack me up! For me to wait 33 years (which is as long as I've lived so far) is incomprehendible, I hope one day the Elvis fans will have their definite proof.


    Well I hope I dont have to wait 33 years <!-- s:roll: -->:roll:<!-- s:roll: --> (much to long <!-- s:lol: -->:lol:<!-- s:lol: --> Im 56 now) so that would make me 89!!! <!-- s:shock: -->:shock:<!-- s:shock: --> oh my, will I still be here <!-- s:o -->:o<!-- s:o -->

    Oh well, just have to wait and see, and yes I remember when Elvis died also.


    Blessings to all on this great adventure, persistence and perseverence is the key I think <!-- s:? -->:?<!-- s:? -->

    <!-- s:D -->:D<!-- s:D -->

  • Thank you Serenitys_Dream for your investigation and posting the results here to share with all of us.

    Now with the 'shaky' DNA and 'shaky' handwriting, what is left of "the strongest scientific proofs that he really did fake his death—and in fact, he is still alive to this very day"?

    Eliza says Elvis wants to set the record straight before he is really gone. It beats me, but why would Elvis need a rickety court case to set the record straight?

    There can be one Jesse, there can be two Jesse's, and there even can be no Jesse at all but...of course we're all going to wait and see..... <!-- s:roll: -->:roll:<!-- s:roll: -->
  • SarahliSarahli Posts: 4,265
    But Mo? What more can we do? <!-- s:cry: -->:cry:<!-- s:cry: -->
  • But Mo? What more can we do? <!-- s:cry: -->:cry:<!-- s:cry: -->

    I'm sorry Sarahli, but I can't tell you what to do...
  • GINAFELICIAGINAFELICIA Posts: 6,506
    I refuse to stay in the darkness of the doubt as Elvis fans <!-- s:evil: -->:evil:<!-- s:evil: -->
    You refuse? OK, so what are you going to do if Michael does not come back for a few years?
  • The information you provided Serenity is something I have read before when it comes to the "wording" of basically the same thing. The lady Ms. Mason called herself a graphologist but, she was esentially doing the same thing as a Forensic Document examiner "title".

    It is all in the wording. If you look at the actions they are the same. I agree the one hired by Fox 8 (media) didn't want their reputation to go down if they were wrong. But, Ms. Mason put her reputation on the line and said it was. Why would she do that? My opinion because she had truth on her side and knew it beyond a shadow of doubt.

    Regarding only focusing on one small piece of the puzzle and now this qualifies as enough evidence to throw out everything else and call Jesse/Elvis not the real deal?

    Focusing on one piece of the puzzle now says Linda is not in contact with Elvis/Jesse?

    How can you forget the Numerology?
    <!-- m -->http://www.lindahoodsigmontruth.com/page33<!-- m -->

    These are clues left in Elvis' music, movies, etc. These are clues Jesse tells Linda to look for and she finds them. There are clues Jesse wrote in his book to say who he is. This is the evidence that only Elvis would know.

    It also is the same type of evidence Michael will use to prove he is who he says he is. The numerology used in the planning of this hoax by Michael is what TS has told us as evidence the info is geniune and coming only from Michael himself. No one else could explain the clues in numerology or codes except the creator. Then the info provided by TS is backed up by examining videos, movies, etc. from Michael himself before his "death". I can use common sense here and after I put all the pieces together and watch evidence left by Michael that backs up what TS said I have no doubts.

    I am not saying that the investigation into this is wrong but, it is narrowed down to only one piece.

    Peace
  • The information you provided Serenity is something I have read before when it comes to the "wording" of basically the same thing. The lady Ms. Mason called herself a graphologist but, she was esentially doing the same thing as a Forensic Document examiner "title".

    It is all in the wording. If you look at the actions they are the same. I agree the one hired by Fox 8 (media) didn't want their reputation to go down if they were wrong. But, Ms. Mason put her reputation on the line and said it was. Why would she do that? My opinion because she had truth on her side and knew it beyond a shadow of doubt.

    Graphology and Forensic document examination are not the same thing at all and it is not simply in the wording.

    Graphology looks at different aspects of writing to reveal psychological and personality characteristics of the writer of a document. This is not an accepted form of writing analysis by the scientific or the legal community. Graphology fails in at least 2 legal requirements to be considered "expert" analysis and in some cases fails all 5 of the requirements.

    Forensic Document examiners analyze and compare documents to determine authorship of the document. This is a recognized science is accepted by the legal community and courts.
    Regarding only focusing on one small piece of the puzzle and now this qualifies as enough evidence to throw out everything else and call Jesse/Elvis not the real deal?

    Focusing on one piece of the puzzle now says Linda is not in contact with Elvis/Jesse?

    I am not focusing on a small piece at all. The documents and graphology are the very foundation that Linda and Dr, Hinton use to support their claim that the person in contact with them, is Elvis. Until the documents are analyzed and found to be conclusively written by Elvis, by a reputable and recognized Forensic examination, they prove nothing. For all we know this "Jesse" could be an impostor.
    How can you forget the Numerology?
    <!-- m -->http://www.lindahoodsigmontruth.com/page33<!-- m -->

    These are clues left in Elvis' music, movies, etc. These are clues Jesse tells Linda to look for and she finds them. There are clues Jesse wrote in his book to say who he is. This is the evidence that only Elvis would know.

    Jesse didn't write a book; Dr. Hinton did. The clues from movies, music, numerology etc have always been there. We do not know if someone else found them and now is revealing them to Linda. We do not know that the man in contact with Linda is Elvis. The point is, that it has not been proven beyond a shadow of a doubt, that Elvis is in contact with Linda.
    It also is the same type of evidence Michael will use to prove he is who he says he is. The numerology used in the planning of this hoax by Michael is what TS has told us as evidence the info is geniune and coming only from Michael himself. No one else could explain the clues in numerology or codes except the creator. Then the info provided by TS is backed up by examining videos, movies, etc. from Michael himself before his "death". I can use common sense here and after I put all the pieces together and watch evidence left by Michael that backs up what TS said I have no doubts.

    I am not saying that the investigation into this is wrong but, it is narrowed down to only one piece.[/b]

    I never mentioned TS nor Michael in my post. It is only about Graphology and that this is not Forensic Document Examination. The document analysis is the cornerstone of Linda's evidence, that is why I focused on it and it is lacking in it's support for Linda's assertion that Jesse is Elvis. Though both the Michael and Elvis cases have undeniable similarities, they are two separate cases.

    The point of my post is that we have to think for ourselves and believe what we choose but to do so with an informed mind. We have people using Linda's updates to her site, to discredit Eliza. Yet, both of these women's evidence is just as shaky so neither can really discredit the other and we should not just be believing one over the other either. They may be both in contact with Elvis, one may be in contact with Elvis and the other is being fooled or neither of them may actually be in contact with Elvis. This situation is not so cut and dried.

    I also think you missed the part where I said that I believe it is possible that Elvis faked his death. This is my opinion, even after looking into graphology but it has nothing to do with Linda's site or the information there. I believed it was possible before I ever heard of Linda, her website, Dr. Hinton, TS, or even the Michael Jackson Death Hoax.

    When I read about graphology on Linda's site, I dug deeper, I wanted to know what this was about because so much is riding on this analysis. I could have never said anything but that would mean that I wasn't being honest to myself and the rest of the forum members. I have an obligation, to disclose everything I find and allow people to decide for themselves, what they choose to believe. This is not a reflection on TS, Michael or the hoax, I still believe in all three. For all we know TS/Michael wanted us to find these issues, with both Linda and Eliza's evidence. This could all be part of the ARG, Human Nature, acceptance, belief and faith issues. Think bigger, outside the box and not just from one perspective...
  • MissGMissG Posts: 7,403
    I refuse to stay in the darkness of the doubt as Elvis fans <!-- s:evil: -->:evil:<!-- s:evil: -->
    You refuse? OK, so what are you going to do if Michael does not come back for a few years?

    I answered that aready.
  • MissGMissG Posts: 7,403
    The moral of "Jesse" wanting to tell the world that "he, elvis" faked his death before he died it is understandable.

    However, what I see about this case is that Fox supporterd Eliza´s investigation. Who knows! may be they wanted to increase audience? or to increase sales on the Elvis records? to put Elvis back on the business?

    Still, the similarities beween Elvis death and MJ death are too many.
    Even Pricilla was suspicious about Michael wanting to know too much.

    TS pointed to that case, but looks like we are not clear about his reasons. Another redirect or a post finally clearing all this up would be very, very helpful <!-- s:| -->:|<!-- s:| -->
  • SouzaSouza Posts: 9,400
    The point of my post is that we have to think for ourselves and believe what we choose but to do so with an informed mind. We have people using Linda's updates to her site, to discredit Eliza. Yet, both of these women's evidence is just as shaky so neither can really discredit the other and we should not just be believing one over the other either. They may be both in contact with Elvis, one may be in contact with Elvis and the other is being fooled or neither of them may actually be in contact with Elvis. This situation is not so cut and dried.

    Amen! That is what I tried to say, but you worded it better. Judgement and accusations based on assumptions is not thinking for yourself, but investigating and making up your own mind is.

    "For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places."

  • Serenity,

    I understand the definition of the use of the words. Graphology is not accepted as a scientific standard for use in a court of law. I understand what it looks at. I also understand what the Scientific people say are accepted points. In my view point is how I should have worded everything I stated. From now on I guess I should always use IMO.

    Everything I wrote was based on how I see it and my opinion. I didn't attack anything you stated. I don't understand how come everyone gets so sensitive and defensive to my posts as if I am accusing people of not thinking for themselves because I used TS and numerology as my basis for believing in Linda and Jesse/Elvis. If you choose not to believe based on what you found that is fine.

    Peace
  • Serenity,

    I understand the definition of the use of the words. Graphology is not accepted as a scientific standard for use in a court of law. I understand what it looks at. I also understand what the Scientific people say are accepted points. In my view point is how I should have worded everything I stated. From now on I guess I should always use IMO.

    Everything I wrote was based on how I see it and my opinion. I didn't attack anything you stated. I don't understand how come everyone gets so sensitive and defensive to my posts as if I am accusing people of not thinking for themselves because I used TS and numerology as my basis for believing in Linda and Jesse/Elvis. If you choose not to believe based on what you found that is fine.

    Peace
    I am not defensive, I am answering your comment and IMO your response seems some what sensitive and defensive. This is the way of the written word but it also appears that you are reading what you want to read.

    I never said I didn`t believe anything. I actually said that I did believe that it is possible that Elvis faked his death and have stated that for the third time now. I also said that I believed in TS, Michael and Michael`s hoax. You have assumed that because I looked into whether or not graphology is the proper analysis to use to establish authorship of a document and whether or not it is recognized by the scientific and legal communities and I found that it isn`t on both questions, that I therefore don`t believe Linda. But I never said whether I believed her or not. Whether I believe Linda or not has no bearing on my inquiry into graphology (it`s uses, it acceptance in as a science and in the legal realm etc).

    As I previously stated, I feel I have an obligation to provide any and all information, that I discover, to the members of this site. Whether it be good, bad, ugly, or beautiful, it doesn`t matter. We all deserve to have all the information available on a subject, to be able to have an informed opinion on that subject. If you take issue with that and feel I am attacking your beliefs because of this, you are mistaken. I am only providing the information and that is all. What the reader decides to do with that information is up to them.
Sign In or Register to comment.