<br />[size=12pt]Wait, I have homework? Why just me?[/size]<br /><br />I didn't see that before I posted that novel. Hmm, ok, I shall do my best.<br /><br />Anyone wanna help? :smiley-vault-misc-150:<br />
<br />Wait, I have homework? Why just me?<br /><br />I didn't see that before I posted that novel. Hmm, ok, I shall do my best.<br /><br />Anyone wanna help? :smiley-vault-misc-150:<br />
<br /><br />Hahahaha :thjajaja121: :thjajaja121:<br /><br />bec has a homework!!!!
I, too, believe that 'ideally' they'd want ALL the paramedics in on it. However, proving they were ALL in on it is much harder to do (God knows we've tried lol). First, we only had 2 of them testify...which, even with having their testimonies, we still can't figure out if they (at least) both were in on it. Blount being from a different shift is 'curious'....but that, too, doesn't automatically mean he was in on it or that he wasn't.<br /><br />Using the ambulance photo to figure it out is tough to do as well. Sure, we can assume that IF Blount, or some other paramedic, wasn't in on it...they would've spoken up. But that would just be an assumption....maybe they would've, maybe not (especially if they were told after the fact that they shouldn't speak up). We do know that Blount supposedly told the stalker fan that it didn't look like MJ. If we take that as 'fact' (that he actually did say that)...then there's two possibilities:<br /><br />1) he wasn't in on it<br />- if he wasn't in on it, why would he lie? He would've been telling the 'fan' what he thought/saw...and that was that it didn't look like Mike....which does tie in with his description of a hospice, frail, old man looking patient (i.e. NOT MJ looking). If this is the case (that Blount's NOT in on it)...then the Live MJ, dummy, nothing and living double theories are out.<br /><br />2) he was in on it <br />- if he was in on it, why would he lie? If Blount was in the know...and therefore was following script...which called for the public to believe that it WAS Mike who was laying on the stretcher and dying...why would he AGREE with the stalker fan that it didn't look like Mike? You'd think he'd want to reassure the 'fan' or anyone else questioning the 'official' story that they were incorrect and that it WAS MJ. <br /><br />Blount then changed his story on the stand to say he recognized it WAS MJ. This could suggest that on June 25th, he wasn't in on it...but at some point later HAD to be brought in (hence the change in his 'recollection'). Of course, it's not 'foolproof'....like with everything else, very difficult to prove. <br /><br />Edited to add: Just trying to 'disprove' my own thinking...IF Blount wasn't in on it and for whatever 'unknown' reason showed up that day, why wouldn't 'they' have given him a less 'hands-on' role, than the one he did get? I do recall this line of questioning during the trial...him being asked about how their 'duties' and/or 'roles' are determined/assigned...but I'd have to go back and re-listen to what he said. IF he wasn't in on it, maybe it was beyond their control as to which 'role' he had? Or maybe him having a hands-on role didn't even matter (i.e. if it was a corpse)?<br /><br />With L.O.V.E. always.
<br />Wait, I have homework? Why just me?<br /><br />I didn't see that before I posted that novel. Hmm, ok, I shall do my best.<br /><br />Anyone wanna help? :smiley-vault-misc-150:<br />
<br /><br /><br />I'm at work so my time isn't my own, otherwise I'd help but you might be able to get at least a couple of points off some earlier posts of mine in this thread. If you haven't posted the list when I get home from work, I'll see what I can do!
<br />" After I give my replies, others may continue to investigate on this thread as long as they wish; but I probably will not be posting here much if at all after that, at least not before BAM."<br /><br />Could bam be this Friday 30th November?<br /><br />TS - You mentioned you will go through update 7 could Michael bam straight after since we will know hows and whys of michaels hoax?<br />
<br />I have read all of the posts up to this point, and unfortunately I don't have enough time make a reply to every post.<br /><br />So in the interest of finishing in the next couple of days: I would request bec, in the next day or so, to compile a list of up to about a [size=12pt]dozen reasons against the DWD and/or corpse theory—and also up to about a dozen reasons for the live MJ and/or dummy theory (or whatever other theory you want to include)[/size]. You may use new reasons, and/or review previous reasons posted by yourself and/or others. Please number each point, so that I can reply to each point directly by number.<br /><br /> :argue:<br /><br />After I give my replies, others may continue to investigate on this thread as long as they wish; but I probably will not be posting here much if at all after that, at least not before BAM.<br /><br /> :affraid:<br />
<br /><br />against the DWD/corpse and FOR live MJ...very interesting TS, why FOR live MJ? so, is it that what happened...and also by what TS posts, the BAM seems to be closer than we expect...
@everyone, please let's help bec put together a really good list for TS for respond to. If anyone's taken note of anything they feel is a particularly strong point recently (or longer ago I guess), please PM bec. This could be our best/last chance to get some direct answers!
[size=14pt] Elvis, for example, has traveled around quite a bit during his "dead" life.[/size]
<br />Do you happen to know this from your own research/investigation like we all know, as hoaxers OR you have this piece of info from some SURE source ? :affraid: :icon_bounce: PLS answer ! I'm dying to know! :bowdown:<br /><br /><br />
on 1354033025:
After I give my replies, others may continue to investigate on this thread as long as they wish;
I can't wait for those replies :icon_bounce: :icon_bounce:<br /><br />
on 1354033025:
but I probably will not be posting here much if at all after that, [size=14pt]at least not before[/size] [size=18pt]BAM[/size]. :affraid:
[move] :moonwalk_: [size=30pt]B A M [/size][size=24pt]in December 2012 ![/size][/move]<br /> :icon_bounce: :affraid: :bowdown: :woohoo2: :icon_bounce: :Michael_Jackson_dancing_smile :michael-jackson: :multiplespotting: :beerchug: :penguin: :abouttime:
<br />Wait, I have homework? Why just me?<br /><br />I didn't see that before I posted that novel. Hmm, ok, I shall do my best.<br /><br />Anyone wanna help? :smiley-vault-misc-150:<br />
<br /><br />Poor bec :icon_lol: I'm guessing that this is one of the "perks" for being the most vocal. I'm sure many are willing to help though. God knows there have been lots of arguments and implications pro and con posted in the last few days already.
What I suggest is that Bec makes a 1st list with the major points she can think of for each theory, then after she posts this 1st list anyone can add something and if it is deemed okay it can be added in the 2nd and final list by bec. It will also give time for TS to start working on some points from the 1st list. <br /><br /> :icon_question:
<br />What I suggest is that Bec makes a 1st list with the major points she can think of for each theory, then after she posts this 1st list anyone can add something and if it is deemed okay it can be added in the 2nd and final list by bec. It will also give time for TS to start working on some points from the 1st list. <br /><br /> :icon_question:<br />
<br /><br />It's probably easier to PM bec so she can compile a master list. Anyone can send her anything they can think of that would debunk the DWD/corpse theory and support live MJ (and/or dummy) theory. It's ok if it's already been said on the thread, the argument needs to be put together properly so TS can make his counterpoints for things some of us have been saying for a long time now.
<br />What I suggest is that Bec makes a 1st list with the major points she can think of for each theory, then after she posts this 1st list anyone can add something and if it is deemed okay it can be added in the 2nd and final list by bec. It will also give time for TS to start working on some points from the 1st list. <br /><br /> :icon_question:<br />
<br /><br />It's probably easier to PM bec so she can compile a master list. Anyone can send her anything they can think of that would debunk the DWD/corpse theory and support live MJ (and/or dummy) theory. It's ok if it's already been said on the thread, the argument needs to be put together properly so TS can make his counterpoints for things some of us have been saying for a long time now.<br />
Though it almost seems like an exercise in futility, we should definitely get a clearer picture of what really happened and how DWD fits, by TS's rebuttals to Bec's points against. I'll pm you if I think of anything left out. :icon_bounce: <br />You can do it, Bec! I'm looking forward to it! You and TS! :compute: :argue: :smiley_abuv:<br /><br />Bec<br />
So we have 3 images of what's clearly MJ on the stretcher/gurney in all 3 locations in question on 6/25/09 (ambulance, UCLA, coroner) and if not all the players are in on it, why is not one single person piping up to say, "hey, that's not the patient I worked on"? What are the chances?...<br /><br />The paramedic team needed to be prearranged, as the 911 call did not come in through the usual channels and so therefore someone at LAFD needed to be in on it to enter that info into the computer (yet not enter it into official call logs for that day). Someone had to send these guys out on call.
<br />This is clearly the crux of the matter. Either MJ’s dead or the DWD patient miraculously looked similar to MJ—perhaps make-up and surgery to help. And we've basically known this from day one. I am shocked/amazed at the good job of acting on the part of Blount and Sennef in their testimony--it's almost hard to believe they and the others could be lying--that genuine. :suspect:<br /><br />Paula<br />
And by that escape in an ambulance if it could have done at any other time, the night before the June 25 or the sunrise of that day there was much activity in Carolwood as you can see in the videos from the security cameras ( of very poor quality ), that's rare, a safety video should have better sharpness.
<br />But to have a control comparison, we should have a security footage of a normal night. Ben Evenstad said that MJ would go out in the middle of the night often a couple of times, since he had trouble sleeping.<br /><br />Sim, yeah!! Double Bam! :woohoo2:<br /> :elvis-1405: :moonwalk_:<br /><br />This kinda reminds me of Revelation 11:1-13 with it's 2 heroes, and hoaxy numbers 1260 days and 3 1/2 years.<br />
3 And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth....<br />9 And they of the people and kindreds and tongues and nations shall see their dead bodies three days and an half, and shall not suffer their dead bodies to be put in graves.<br />10 And they that dwell upon the earth shall rejoice over them, and make merry, and shall send gifts one to another; because these two prophets tormented them that dwelt on the earth.<br />11 And after three days and an half the spirit of life from God entered into them, and they stood upon their feet; and great fear fell upon them which saw them.
<br />I have read all of the posts up to this point, and unfortunately I don't have enough time make a reply to every post.<br /><br />So in the interest of finishing in the next couple of days: I would request bec, in the next day or so, [size=12pt]to compile a list of up to about a dozen reasons against the DWD and/or corpse theory—and also up to about a dozen reasons for the live MJ and/or dummy theory [/size](or whatever other theory you want to include). You may use new reasons, and/or review previous reasons posted by yourself and/or others. Please number each point, so that I can reply to each point directly by number.<br /><br /> :argue:<br /><br />
<br /><br />Yes - interesting that the lists are to be against the DWD/corpse theory and for the live MJ and/or dummy theory. I will be waiting with great anticipation to see TS responses to both lists.<br /><br />@bec - if I think of anything I will PM you , however considering I am one of the members in support of the DWD theory that might be hard for me to think of anything :icon_lol: - but I will definitely give both lists some thought. Good luck!<br /><br /><br />
After I give my replies, others may continue to investigate on this thread as long as they wish; but I probably will not be posting here much if at all after that, at least not before BAM.<br /><br /> :affraid:<br /><br />
<br /><br />Update #7 is meant to be after the BAM - at least most likely after the BAM is what TS said - so I will be interested how Update #7 goes if TS said he won't be here much, if at all, after his reply to the lists. :icon_e_ugeek:<br /><br />EDIT: also I just remembered too that TS said all three 7's would be finished by the end of 2012 - Update 7, level 7 and Sign 7 :icon_albino: <br /><br />I'm trying not to get too excited...... which is difficult!
I've been curious about November 30th since last year's november 30th... (http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/forum/index.php/topic,21545.msg375902.html#msg375902) however if nothing happens then I think it will be December 2012... maybe the 21st. But then again Sign #6 is titled "The end comes suddenly" so it may be a random date! But seeing ALL the numerology involved in this hoax, I would imagine it being a special date. :michael_jackson-1135:
Whilst we are all eagerly awaiting the lists & TS replies...and also what is possibly to come in the next few days or weeks, I thought this picture posted today on the Official MJ Facebook was great:<br /><br /><br /><br />Enjoy yourself everybody!!!! the BIG one from the Jacksons is coming! :icon_lol: :beerchug: :fresse: :icon_cool:
Adi... I hope so! The Big One :icon_mrgreen:<br /><br />I decided to post a short list of my thoughts here -may help or not and I'll pm Bec if I think of anything else. :icon_geek:<br /><br />DWD/Corpse<br /><br />- If someone was not in the hoax...a dummy would've raised more suspicion, but with a body chances are they'd ASSUME it’s MJ even if there’s hardly a resemblance because everyone else involved is not taking notice of this.<br />- LAPD weren’t called, instead they have a doctor on site along with the FBI to carry out transporting the corpse to the hospital.<br /><br />Dummy<br /><br />-Enough ppl and FBI were involved in the hoax to protect the dummy from being discovered. <br />-BAD25 reference to annie the resuscitation dummy as a clue that MJ was not there.<br />-Assisted suicide against the law in California.<br />-A photograph for the media.<br />-The helicopter scene – I can’t see a real body being used for this kind of public display, not ethical for the purpose of a hoax.<br />-If it was a dummy on the stretcher they’d probably use it all the way through to the coroner or they’d need a plan to hide it afterwards.<br />-Would give MJ the chance to leave the house before sunrise. <br /><br />Live MJ<br /><br />-All paramedics were in on hoax, and a few hospital staff so that he could be in the ambulance on the stretcher, then prepared for the helicopter display, left from the coroner’s van.<br />-FBI presence and alarm going off to divert attention.
And now (drum roll) … we are at the final level—level number 7! (7 represents completion). Now it’s time to take everything that we have learned so far (in the previous levels, etc), and put the last few pieces of the puzzle into place.<br /><br />This is the final frontier for the hoax; the “when’s” and “why’s” have already been thoroughly established, especially through the numerology—and more than a year has gone by, without anyone even making a serious attempt to claim the $999 reward. Therefore, the only frontier left is the “how’s” of the hoax, which is exactly what we have been going through in the levels; and this is the last of the levels, therefore we are now entering the conclusion of the final frontier—THIS IS IT!<br /><br />The previous levels were not a waste, because without them we would not be where we are now. Much of the research has already been done, and some of the pieces have already come together (just like the picture above); but we still have a few major areas that need completed (just like the picture above). As I have said already, the minor details on the “how’s” are not very important (and may never been fully understood); however, for more than one reason, the major aspects of the “how’s” should be resolved.<br /><br />For example, level 3 never really got resolved (who or what, if anything, went to UCLA in the ambulance?). I am confident that this will be resolved, though, before the end of level 7. Another major area, that keeps popping up unresolved, is the idea that the ambulance was at Carolwood and UCLA on some day other than 6-25-09; and closely related is the fairly common idea that two or more ambulances were used (supposedly different lettering, reflector, wrong shadows, etc).<br /><br />There are quite a few such theories floating around, and they all need to be thoroughly debunked for once and for all—so that we can see the simplicity of doing everything as real as possible, other than the very few things that required otherwise (such as the ambulance photo). There would be no need whatsoever to be running ambulances and firetrucks around town, on one or more days before 6-25-09, like kids playing with their toys. It would only create numerous opportunities to raise suspicions, at the least. Also, to NOT have the ambulance at Carolwood and then UCLA on 6-25 would be another sure fire way to raise major suspicions.<br /><br />The ambulance photo needed to be staged in advance, because of the great difficulty getting a good picture through the window “on the fly”; and if you missed the one chance, you would not get another. But staging that photo in advance would not raise public suspicion, if it was done indoors.<br /><br />Also, some seem to think that the ambulance picture was generated from nothing, in good-old “Photoshop”; but the reality is, no matter how good you are at Photoshop, you don’t just start from nothing and end up with a high resolution photograph (like the ambulance photo). Staging the ambulance photo gives you the basic picture(s) to work from; and then you can modify it with Photoshop (such as adding the car reflection, by taking a separate photo of the car, and then layering it in Photoshop with some transparency).<br /><br />So I want to start this level by debunking all the false theories about the ambulance (such as more than one ambulance, or it went to UCLA on a different day, etc). There is little point in discussing who or what went to UCLA on June 25 in the ambulance, if we’re not even sure whether the ambulance itself went to UCLA on June 25 2009! I need your help bringing all these theories to this thread, whether you believe in them or not; but please read all the posts in this thread before posting one of these theories, and make sure that it’s not a repeat of the same basic theory already discussed and debunked. Also, anyone can help out in the debunking process as well; this will help us get to the end faster.<br /><br />8-)<br /><br />Once that is done (level 7a), we’ll move on to level 7b; I probably won’t start a new thread, but I will post a picture in this thread of another puzzle piece put into place. Level 7b will be who or what went to UCLA on June 25, 2009. When that is resolved, I will post another step in the puzzle pieces coming together; and we will finish this level with 7c, which will be any further details about the FBI, sting, and court. When level 7c is done, I will post a picture of the completed puzzle.<br /><br />penguin/<br /><br />At this point, I’m going to give you a couple of real good pointers, which should help you as we go through this final level. Start with the fewest people possible in on it, which would actually be zero and no hoax (MJ really died); and then work backwards from that point—changing nothing from the no hoax scenario, except what is NEEDED to be changed in order to accomplish the hoax. I already gave you an example with the ambulance: if MJ really died, then the ambulance came to Carolwood and went to UCLA on June 25, 2009. Don’t change that for the hoax, unless there is a need for it to happen on a different day. And use this same principle, in putting all the pieces together.<br /><br />Last but not least, here is a real good statement from bec, which she posted in my recent thread about the timing of the 911 call (12:20 or 12:21?). Keep this concept in mind, because it applies to far more than just the 911 call. “One good reason I can think of doing an actual call that day (not 911, just a call) is for realism later. [size=12pt]It’s very easy to keep up appearances if what you are talking about actually happened. Alvarez’s testimony and statements, Murray’s statements on this documentary, they can be describing an actual staged scene as opposed to just a figment of imagination. Recalling an actual event would give their statements a sense of realism, instead of them simply reciting lines.”[/size] {http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/smf2.0/index.php?topic=21289.msg370203#msg370203}.
<br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br />It is true if in reality someone died there is no need to be recalling things to say and reduces the number of people in the deception by which all the events happened in reality. <br />
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