<br />Some say we keep Sunday instead of Sabbath because Jesus raised from the dead on a Sunday.<br />
<br /><br />Yes, but that's totally made up hundreds of years later and nowhere in the Bible does Jesus say we should observe Sunday to remember his resurrection. Actually, Jesus raised from the dead on Sunday, because he RESTED on the Sabbath, even AFTER the cross, which is another indication that the Sabbath was not done away with by Jesus´ death.
"For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places."
Thanks for posting the prayer Do.<br /><br /> I had the main points but I couldn't remember it. I couldn't remember the part about the beaker being the everlasting covenant. <br /><br />I think this is what Jesus told his apostles to do at the last supper. It was an agreement so we would always remember him. <br /><br />Love<br /><br />
<br />Some say we keep Sunday instead of Sabbath because Jesus raised from the dead on a Sunday.<br />
<br /><br />Yes, but that's totally made up hundreds of years later and nowhere in the Bible does Jesus say we should observe Sunday to remember his resurrection. Actually, Jesus raised from the dead on Sunday, because he RESTED on the Sabbath, even AFTER the cross, which is another indication that the Sabbath was not done away with by Jesus´ death.<br />
<br />I know. But traditions are very difficult to change. And Jesus gave to the apostles/the church/priests a lot of power on earth .<br /> Matthew 18:18<br />New International Version (NIV)<br /><br /> 18 “Truly I tell you, whatever you bind on earth will be[a] bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven. <br /><br />I can't figure out if this means the apostles and the apostolic church had the right authority to change the resting day.<br />For the moment I say to keep both the Sabbath and the Sunday if we are not sure which one is the right one.
[size=10pt]MJonmind said: Finally, Do, I want to thank you for your lovely response to my post! I was basically sending off my last post and ran (for work), and so I missed your post just before mine until now. Also the things you added are all some of the many things Michael sings/says that stick in one’s mind as strange, but with the bigger picture actually make better sense, though controversial[/size].
<br />hmmm....I was reading opinions last evening. <br />Some say the mark of the beast won't be something physical like a real mark on our right hand or the forehead, but it will be about accepting it in our souls. i don't know what to believe about it.<br />Anyway, it makes sense because if it is [size=12pt]something material implanted under the skin[/size] for example - [size=12pt]nobody will accept it because it would be obvious it is the mark of the beast the Bible talks about.[/size]<br />Maybe it already happened and we don't know about it.<br /><br />edit: now I see some say that not keeping the Sabbath but the Sunday is in fact accepting the mark of the beast. Some accept it on the forehead because they accept it out of conviction, some on the right hand because they accept it out of fear. <br />
[size=14pt]Residents Of The U.S. Required To Have An RFID Chip Implanted Under Their Skin By March 23rd 2013[/size] <br /><br />[size=10pt]Law Of The Land, Another Hidden Provision In ObamaCare – RFID Subdermal Implants<br /><br />ObamaCare will require an RFID chip implanted in all of us. This chip will not only contain your personal information with tracking capability but it will also be linked to your bank account. <br /><br />And get this, Page 1004 of the new law (dictating the timing of this chip), reads, and I quote: “Not later than 36 months after the date of the enactment.” It is now the law of the land that by March 23rd 2013 we will all be required to have an RFID chip underneath our skin and this chip will be link to our bank accounts as well as have our personal records and tracking capability built into it.<br /><br />H.R. 3200 section 2521, Pg. 1001, paragraph 1.<br /><br />The Secretary shall establish a national medical device registry (in this subsection referred to as the ‘registry’) to facilitate analysis of postmarket safety and outcomes data on each device that— ‘‘is or has been used in or on a patient; ‘‘and is— ‘‘a class III device; or ‘‘a class II device that is implantable, life-supporting, or life-sustaining.” <br /><br />Federal Food, Drug, and Cosmetic Act —<br /><br />A class II implantable device is an “implantable radio frequency transponder system for patient identification and health information.” The purpose of a class II device is to collect data in medical patients such as “claims data, patient survey data, standardized analytic files that allow for the pooling and analysis of data from disparate data environments, electronic health records, and any other data deemed appropriate by the Secretary.” [/size]
<br /><br />There are many articles about the obliged implantation of the chip on the net and there are also many people who have the chip already (mandatory and voluntary). <br /><br />If you can only withdraw money from your account by using this chip, then you are indeed obliged to take the chip. And not only American citizens will have to accept the chip, also citizens of other countries. <br /><br />The link below is how the Dutch government is acting on this. It's not very recent though. Maybe you have to translate the page, I tried but I don't know if it worked by copying the link.<br /><br />This is a small part of the article:<br />
[size=10pt]In the mainstream media there are hardly messages about it: the subcutaneous chip. With the biometric personal proof and the central storage of your physical characteristics per 21 september, the basic condition for massive imports of this chip has met. The chip itself is only a technical extension. No one realizes that the few times that this subject is in the news, they presents the implanted verichip as a ' cool ' tender or ideal medical invention. The Government finds the subject hardly worth debating and refers to privacy questions invariably to the personal data protection act, which would reflect the fine on developments. These developments are unnoticed very far advanced. The possibilities are already more than we ever thought possible. Especially military branches of the Government and encourage the research and the megacorporations finance and implementation of applications ' for your safety "that since the attacks on 9/11 no obstacle in the way. The implantation of chips in the brain is part of a much wider programme that should lead to improvement of the human race: you surely are also for improvements[/size]?
<br />hi all haw are you. i am reading this chapter and i dont aderstand why all are afraid that the end is caming. is not the end is a new begining for human nation. <br />21/12/2012 is anly a day were 1000 years of one raound of the san is end and is begining a new one. <br />i just believe that like i believe in ather things. <br />i dont now why bat i believe that.<br />the end is near yes bad no one now the exact day.<br />GOD SAIDS:I WILL CAME LIKE THE THIVE IN THE NIGHT<br />SOW dont wayst your time in minless thoughts that make you sad.<br />thing that life is fool of saprises.<br />GIVE all the love you all have in your hard in your lovesones, in your nayboors give a smile in strangers. look around you the sun is raising the birds are singing the most butiful song ever for you. the flowers are gave to you ther owsom parfum only for you. <br />WITH ALL MY LOVE TO YOU ALL<br />KISSES )<br />
<br /><br /> bearhug Your so right,<br /><br />What a very sweet post Ovelias , it's so important to treasure the most common things in life like, birds singing, and flowers in bloom. <br /><br />Love to you<br /><br /><br />
<br />Im_convinced, I'm sorry I didn't respond earlier, I didn't see your post until now. I'll try and add some more info to make this even clearer, although I think I've said quite a bit. No, I do not think not keeping the Sabbath is taking the Mark of the Beast at all; in fact almost the contrary. Christians are not required to keep the Sabbath according to the Bible. And whether or not it is the "Mark of the Beast" (I'll use abbreviation MOB) depends upon what you believe, simply because Jews keep the Sabbath and therefore it would be MOB, whereas Christians do not and therefore, it would not be the MOB. Also, I doubt atheists think anything is the MOB given they don't even believe in God. I think people should be cautious before accepting that a law like this will even be passed, much less tolerated. Until we see proof this will come into fruition, paranoia is unnecessary and unhelpful.<br /><br />Yes we are living according to the Roman calendar, and thus Sunday is our day of "rest". This did originate from Pagan worship of the Sun, but since we are not required to keep Sabbath any day, especially Sunday, than no Christian is taking the MOB. You stated that the saints will be saved for they will not receive the mark if they have faith and follow God's commandments. Well, isn't that what I've been saying? We are to have faith and follow God's commandments of LOVE, see Jono's posts. This does not require keeping Sabbath, as that law was fulfilled and done away with. Jesus referred to the Jews as the "synagogue of Satan" for a reason; they chose to deny him and even killed him in order to stay bound by the Old Covenant. So although the fourth commandment commands the observing of the 7th day as a sabbath rest, it must be kept in mind that the Ten Commandments were part of the law given to the nation of Israel at Mount Sinai. This law covenant was a sign of *their* relationship with God in order to commemorate their deliverance, not to us. (Deut. 5:15; Ex. 31:16)<br />
<br /><br />Suzy7- I really think you don't grasp the concept of what the mark of the beast law aka sunday law is. This has nothing to do with whether or not someone is a Christian or Jew. It does not matter if someone believes in God or not. This has to do with Revelation 13 and below is the scripture pointing out what the mark of the beast means for EVERYONE. This is not about Jews keeping the Sabbath and therefore they receive the mark of the beast because they are. This has nothing to do with Christians and them not keeping the Sabbath and therefore they don't receive the mark of the beast. The Sabbath is technically supposed to be kept on Saturday and when the mark of the beast law is enforced people will be forced to keep the Sabbath on the wrong day, Sunday. Now if we refuse to go along with the law and refuse to go to church on sunday then we will not receive the mark of the beast. If someone goes along with it because they will not be able to buy or sell, etc. then they will be taking the mark of the beast. <br /><br />I never once said that the mark of the beast makes a distinction between Jews or Christians. I am neither of those because those are titles that have to do with religious names. I never said anything about saints. The info I copied and pasted said that and also the Bible says so.<br /><br />One other thing about this mark of the beast law, it is not related to Jesus' sacrifice on the cross for us in the way you are connecting it. Yes I know that Jesus died for our sins. Through his blood we are given grace from God and offered salvation. I do know about salvation and it doesn't depend on works to receive it. The subject of that is seperate from what I am pointing out. I have said before this information I am providing is for the sole purpose of it being evidence and after that it is up to the people to study it or not. I have said my last comment on this subject just now and I respect your choice in how to believe so please respect my choice. I am not even saying that anyone should or should not keep the Sabbath. I don't but I know I should because the Bible has God's word saying so.<br /><br />I do not just think this way independantly from not studying and not reading scriptures in the Bible. I have formed my understanding of this issue from study of the Bible in regards to revelations and I have read other info and watched youtube videos. This is not just my opinion. This information is not to make people scared or paranoid but to give them an opportunity to know what is ahead in the near future. The evidence is there for all to see and the proof will be in prophesies fulfilled.<br /><br />http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=revelation 13:15-18&version=NIRV<br />
15 The second beast was allowed to give breath to the statue so it could speak. He was allowed to kill all who refused to worship the statue. 16 He also forced everyone to receive a mark on the right hand or on the forehead. People great or small, rich or poor, free or slave had to receive the mark. 17 They could not buy or sell anything unless they had the mark. The mark is the name of the beast or the number of his name. 18 Here is a problem that you have to be wise to figure out. If you can, figure out what the beast's number means. It is man's number. His number is 666.
<br />
The National Sunday Law if it goes into effect would be a law that would force everyone even athiest into going to church and worshipping on sunday the day for satan. There will be punishments for not going along with the law, for example the fact that we wouldn't be able to buy or sell, wouldn't be able to buy food, clothes, medicine, etc. So basically if I stand my ground and refuse to obey the law I will face punishments. The Sunday law would force people to bow down to satan. Therefore if people follow the law they will be worshipping satan and receive the mark of the beast.
^^My comment from my last post. I also would like to point out that the subject of the ark of the covenant was in TS' post and that does have to do with the Ten Commandments.
<br />Jesus referred to the Jews as the "synagogue of Satan" for a reason; they chose to deny him and even killed him in order to stay bound by the Old Covenant.
<br /><br />Technically, he was not talking about Jews when he said that. The bible refers to the "synagogue of Satan" in two places only: Revelation 2:9 and 3:9. <br /><br />[size=14pt]Revelation 2:9[/size]<br />New International Version (NIV)<br /><br />[size=8pt]9[/size] I know your afflictions and your poverty—yet you are rich! I know about the slander of those who say they are Jews and are not, but are a synagogue of Satan.<br /><br /><br />[size=14pt]Revelation 3:9[/size]<br />New International Version (NIV)<br /><br />[size=8pt]9[/size] I will make those who are of the synagogue of Satan, who claim to be Jews though they are not, but are liars—I will make them come and fall down at your feet and acknowledge that I have loved you.<br /><br /><br /><br />If this is talking about a future time, they sound more like the Political Zionists/Khazars to me, not your typical Jew. Or am I misunderstanding the context? I remember seeing a topic about them once upon a time, back when we first started investigating the illuminati (perhaps I came across the information myself; my memory is a little fuzzy). Their main concern is political, not spiritual. I don't recall the specific video, but no torah-observing Jew would shout such racist and hateful things to people on the street. Torah observing Jews are not too happy about what these "fake" Jews are doing. Even though I am not Jewish myself, it bothers me that they are ruining the world's perception of the Jewish people. I feel the same way about hypocrites in any group, just like nations who have Christian leaders that don't make very Christ-like decisions (or a group that always gets associated with Christianity, yet they're a poor reflection of the religion). <br /><br /><br />@Gina: Jesus made it very clear that man-made traditions mean nothing (Mark 7:8[size=1pt]'[/size]), his believers should not conform to the world (Romans 12:2), but follow him, be imitators of the Messiah (1 Corinthians 11:1), not imitators of the world (Deuteronomy 18:9), to be "friendly" with the world's ways is to be an enemy of God (James 4:4). I suppose the latter means, if you "trust" or "look to" the world instead of what he has to say on the matter, you're his enemy. I think anyone claiming to believe in the biblical God would be wise to look to the actual text itself, instead of tradition, no matter what side of the argument they're on.<br /><br /><br />@RK: just wanted to say thanks for the video; it made me reassess some assumptions. I never really thought about how Noah distinguished clean from unclean all the way in Genesis, or the bit about circumcision. What I gathered is that there isn't enough substantial evidence to say that Christians are mandated to observe the Sabbath according to the terms of the new covenant (essentially a new contract), yet no one can deny that the Sabbath is the seventh day.
<br />hmmm....I was reading opinions last evening. <br />Some say the mark of the beast won't be something physical like a real mark on our right hand or the forehead, but it will be about accepting it in our souls. i don't know what to believe about it.<br />Anyway, it makes sense because if it is [size=12pt]something material implanted under the skin[/size] for example - [size=12pt]nobody will accept it because it would be obvious it is the mark of the beast the Bible talks about.[/size]<br />Maybe it already happened and we don't know about it.<br /><br />edit: now I see some say that not keeping the Sabbath but the Sunday is in fact accepting the mark of the beast. Some accept it on the forehead because they accept it out of conviction, some on the right hand because they accept it out of fear. <br />
[size=14pt]Residents Of The U.S. Required To Have An RFID Chip Implanted Under Their Skin By March 23rd 2013[/size] <br /><br />[size=10pt]Law Of The Land, Another Hidden Provision In ObamaCare – RFID Subdermal Implants<br /><br />ObamaCare will require an RFID chip implanted in all of us. This chip will not only contain your personal information with tracking capability but it will also be linked to your bank account. <br /><br />And get this, Page 1004 of the new law (dictating the timing of this chip), reads, and I quote: “Not later than 36 months after the date of the enactment.” It is now the law of the land that by March 23rd 2013 we will all be required to have an RFID chip underneath our skin and this chip will be link to our bank accounts as well as have our personal records and tracking capability built into it.<br /><br />H.R. 3200 section 2521, Pg. 1001, paragraph 1.<br /><br />The Secretary shall establish a national medical device registry (in this subsection referred to as the ‘registry’) to facilitate analysis of postmarket safety and outcomes data on each device that— ‘‘is or has been used in or on a patient; ‘‘and is— ‘‘a class III device; or ‘‘a class II device that is implantable, life-supporting, or life-sustaining.” <br /><br />Federal Food, Drug, and Cosmetic Act —<br /><br />A class II implantable device is an “implantable radio frequency transponder system for patient identification and health information.” The purpose of a class II device is to collect data in medical patients such as “claims data, patient survey data, standardized analytic files that allow for the pooling and analysis of data from disparate data environments, electronic health records, and any other data deemed appropriate by the Secretary.” [/size]
<br /><br />There are many articles about the obliged implantation of the chip on the net and there are also many people who have the chip already (mandatory and voluntary). <br /><br />If you can only withdraw money from your account by using this chip, then you are indeed obliged to take the chip. And not only American citizens will have to accept the chip, also citizens of other countries. <br /><br />The link below is how the Dutch government is acting on this. It's not very recent though. Maybe you have to translate the page, I tried but I don't know if it worked by copying the link.<br /><br />This is a small part of the article:<br />
[size=10pt]In the mainstream media there are hardly messages about it: the subcutaneous chip. With the biometric personal proof and the central storage of your physical characteristics per 21 september, the basic condition for massive imports of this chip has met. The chip itself is only a technical extension. No one realizes that the few times that this subject is in the news, they presents the implanted verichip as a ' cool ' tender or ideal medical invention. The Government finds the subject hardly worth debating and refers to privacy questions invariably to the personal data protection act, which would reflect the fine on developments. These developments are unnoticed very far advanced. The possibilities are already more than we ever thought possible. Especially military branches of the Government and encourage the research and the megacorporations finance and implementation of applications ' for your safety "that since the attacks on 9/11 no obstacle in the way. The implantation of chips in the brain is part of a much wider programme that should lead to improvement of the human race: you surely are also for improvements[/size]?
<br /><br />Nice connection between the mark of the beast and chipping. I don't think this is something people should just dismiss - if we are chipped, we are their cattle. They will own us and know our every action and thought, and you can't do anything about it because the chip connects you to everything. Don't believe that it will be good for you whatever you're told.
The Book of Revelation or Apocalypse of John, in Greek means 'revelation to John', and is the last book of the New Testament <br /><br /> <br /><br />Revelation 13:15-18 says the book of the New Testament.<br /><br />"And he had power to give breath to the image of the beast, so that the image could speak and cause to kill everyone who refused to worship. <br />And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand or in their foreheads: And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark or the name of the beast or the number of his name. <br />Here is wisdom. He that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is man's number. And his number is Six hundred threescore and six "<br /><br />Interesting passage, but for many of us, a symbolic text does not, a priori, nothing at all. I'm not well versed in the Bible, or the symbols are present. I have serious doubts about the authorship, originality and authenticity of the final document , currently regarded as the Bible , and reading this passage, like any other, but I do not suggest anything except that the tangible reality inevitably leads me to it . It's been a couple of months ago I published a translation of an interesting conversation between Aaron Russo , a documentary film director, who in his later years before his death very closely committed to the claim of the conspiracy behind the attack on the twin towers and the reporting of other plots in the world of global politics, and Nicholas Rockefeller , a member of the series Rockefeller openly admitted that Russo that the ultimate goal of the global elite was none other than having the entire world population with a microchip under the skin and take on the "servants" absolute control.<br /><br /><br /><br />Russo died weeks after that interview and the news spread on the Internet dramatically, but again, this would be a news story, like many others in the network impossible to verify if it was not because the Internet brings us the information and reality in a way previously unimaginable. We've all heard of the subcutaneous microchip technology, implanted to allow medical monitoring of people with heart problems and other medical uses against those who, in general, just have to say.<br /><br /><br /><br /><br />Also at the time we read news about the family "Chipson", an American family where all members have a subcutaneous chip since 2002 and feels the sea of proud. But not many thought would be a few years ago that the goal of anyone outside a chip implanted under the skin of every citizen, the plan was too shocking and unnecessary.<br /><br /><br /><br /><br />However, as often these things happen gradually, "cup to cup", by the method of supporting an initiative to go here and there, some well regarded by most of society, while slip news " rare "or" cute "by other media, and all supported by millions of dollars in advertising and marketing, human mind is transformed, it will" brainwash "the population and creating a favorable opinion to this kind of initiatives and projects, and this is the exact point where we are today.<br /><br /><br />If we go into corporate Web site can read the VeriChip company:<br /><br />"VeriChip, the first subdermal personal identification technology, announces a special program to register. Firm and to be among the first in the world 'Chip'. We invite you to fill out the form to be among the first 100,000, and receive a bonus of $ 50. "<br /><br /><br />It is an advertisement of the firm Applied Digital Solutions , which launched a chip the size of a rice that is placed under the skin of the arm containing the basic information for identifying a person. The chips are made by the company VeriChip , a subsidiary of Applied Digital Solutions of Palm Beach (Florida) in October 2004 received the consent of the Food and Drug Administration (FDA) to market the product.<br /><br /><br /><br /><br />Your initial use, as we have said, has been personally identifying or medical store, but its uses are expanding into unexpected aspects until recently.<br /><br /><br />The company began selling Solusat VeriChip in Mexico in July last year. The cost plus the cost of implementation is approximately $ 200, plus the $ 50 annual fee for maintenance of the database. The handheld scanner costs about $ 1,200. The attorney general of Mexico and 170 other officials were the "vanguard" in Mexico and placed under the skin the "identificatory chips." Several Latin American countries are queuing at the door of the company's Palm Beach (Florida), to design a special device to track people in case of kidnapping.<br /><br /><br /><br /><br />The company still claims on its website that the chip provides a unique identifier and the system is absolutely "safe." The bio-chip measures 7mm to 12 mm long and about 1 mm wide, more or less the size of a grain of rice.<br /><br /><br />Contains a "transponder", a system of information storage and retrieval by remote control and rechargeable lithium battery. The battery is recharged by a thermocouple circuit that produces an electric current with fluctuations in body temperature, why implanted in the right hand or head.<br /><br /><br /><br /> <br /><br />Invested more than $ 1.5 million in studies, only with the specific aim of knowing what was the best place to put this biochip in the human body and concluded that these two places on the body were the most appropriate and efficient<br /><br /><br />However, technology is talk of a "safe" when the truth is that the battery that contains spilled inside the body would produce ulcers and sores in the tissues that remove the chip without medical supervision can cause irreparable damage in the body as well as the individual's death. More than 250 corporations in 20 countries are involved distributing Mondex the world and many nations were "privileged" to use the system, including: UK, Canada, USA, Australia, New Zealand, Israel, Hong Kong, China, Indonesia, Macau, Malaysia, Philippines, Singapore, Thailand, India, Taiwan, Sri Lanka, Costa Rica, Guatemala, Nicaragua, Panama, Honduras, El Salvador and Brazil. Motorola is manufacturing billion Mondex biochips year.<br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br />Other systems are being used for Smartcard for this, especially since MasterCard bought a 51% backing the company.<br /><br /><br /><br />[size=10pt]We could think that, as in many other areas related to technology, in Spain this one take years to enter our country, but again it would be wrong.<br /><br /><br /><br />In Barcelona a very successful club, Baja Beach, led by former Big Brother Conrad Chase , an American citizen, was the first in Europe to enter the subcutaneous chip clients and VIPS for anyone looking to implement it. Apparently, this club has expansion plans for new clubs in Holland and Germany[/size]<br /><br /><br /> <br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /> Conrad Chase subcuténeo chip implanted<br /><br />The chip is used today as a purse in these clubs so that the credit or debit card and cash would be eradicated completely obsolete. As Hollywood films futuristic are already beginning to see, the "hero" VIP should not make the gesture of taking the wallet to pay, but their mere presence and slight of hand would pass that through a payment gateway, the business will be charged the total of their client.<br /><br />Interview with Conrad Chase<br /><br /> In another radio interview, this guy, Conrad Chase , confessed to the interviewer that the CEO of VeriChip, Mr. Bolton , had told him that there was a plan to use VeriChip ID system as a global implantable and that in the future would be required to take the chip to access your club.<br /><br /> <br /><br />He also told the interviewer that he thought the slogan used to promote this type of chip was precisely that "there'd be a VIP acceptable in this world if they did not chip implanted under the skin", a slogan that Conrad was "brilliant" . Conrad, the former big brother, which overly muscled otherwise consider a current-mill type, appears to be a representative of VeriChip in Spain, so that interest can not only be offering new "advantages" technology to its customers but also a lot of money advertising this technology in Spain and Europe to expand its uses and reduce the level of initial rejection in the population.<br /><br /><br /><br />He told the interviewer that in the near future, all legal gun carriers, should have a microchip implanted in his hand to qualify for the license and that the Italian Government was preparing to implement the chip to all public employees.<br /> <br /><br />This, on the other hand, there would be new as they have reported many cases of employees of private companies, as well as the one above in Mexico, public entities, where this initiative has been launched. Conrad told the interviewer that he is a great way to completely replace credit cards to carry out all types of purchase and sale transactions.<br /><br /><br /><br /><br />The interviewer asks him where he got all these ideas so novel, Conrad said that talks with VeriChip and he knew that they were producing these chips on a large scale plants in Beijing VeriChip . That is, basically, in a very short time, begin to see how we sell this as the latest fashion. And after reading this, now re-read chapter 13 of Revelation.<br /><br /><br /><br />"And he had power to give breath to the image of the beast, so that the image could speak and cause to kill everyone who refused to worship. <br />And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand or in their foreheads: And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark or the name of the beast or the number of his name. <br />Here is wisdom. He that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is man's number. And his number is Six hundred threescore and six "<br /><br />Can you make your hair stand on end as me?. And now I ask you again very seriously what the Bible and who wrote it . It is something that millions of people are apparently clear, but to me all this fills me with doubt. And what is it 666?<br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br />"Apparently, these chips may have 34 billion unique combinations of individual identification codes, more than enough to allow a unique code assigned to every human being on Earth, using three entries of six digits (666)."<br /><br />Which would lead directly to the number of the Beast 666 that appears in the Bible. The number 666 has become very prominent in our day, probably to make people become familiar with this number and operate from its symbolism, eliminating evil connotations that owns the number. Below some of the places where we can find, according to references I've found, especially the United States where we know that Satanism is super-extended.<br /><br /><br /><br />Companies Koehring and Clark equipment used as part of the 666 product identification number on certain models<br /><br />the stickers distributed at DuPont plants say. "To contact with questions about how to call" Mom "to 666)<br /><br />The company's products Bliss-Hastings contained the number 666<br /><br />The annual festival border number 85 (8 + 5 = 13) held in Cheyenne, Wyoming was promoted under the slogan "Rodeo Day 666"<br /><br />The logo of the National Bank cards Australia contain a configuration of 666<br /><br />In August 1980, the telephone company Chesapeake and Potomac Virginia notifying customers that the phone number of the U.S. Weather Service had changed from 936-1212 to 666-1212<br /><br />The men's shirts made in China and sold in the United States had the number 666 on the label forming the mark of Kerman Scott Ltd.<br /><br />At the official reopening of the Suez Canal on June 5, 1975, the first Egyptian warship entered the channel leading to the then President Anwar Sadat had the number 666 on his helmet.<br /><br />The code number of the World Bank was 666<br /><br />Some credit cards in the U.S. had a number prefix of 666<br /><br />The P6060 Olivetti computer system used processing numbers began with 666<br /><br />Computers Sears, Belk, JC Penney and Montgomery Ward had a prefix for its transactions began with 666 as was established by programming their computers<br /><br />The shoes manufactured in Italy had 666 on the label. It consisted of a circle divided in half with a lamb with horns on top and the number 666 on the bottom. Later it was put in all Common Market products<br /><br />IBAM teams in supermarkets had the number 3x666 in them<br /><br />Visa credit cards represent the number 666: the Roman numeral for 6 is VI, No. 6 in ancient Greece took the sixth letter of the alphabet, the letter Sigma which looks like the "S" and in our Babylonian sexagesimal system the letter A represented 6. So VI (6) S (6) A (6)<br /><br />Computers manufactured by Lear Siegler Inc. in the U.S. and Israel had sent a seal on one side with the number 666 which was subsequently discontinued.<br /><br />The number of employees of the division of the Federal Government Medical Service was 666<br /><br />The tax collection service ATF (Alcohol, Snuff and Firearms) had the number 666 in their employees' identification badges<br /><br />In 1977, the IRS began requiring the number 666 as a prefix in the tax models in Individual Retirement Accounts. The codes are 666.3 to 666.4 for sickness and death. After much protest it was removed in 1978 and 1979 but restored in 1980 and 1981<br /><br />L as IRS instructions for W2 Employees nonprofit corporations require the prefix 666<br /><br />Some states had the number 666 in the documentation requirements<br /><br />The security forces of President Carter had secret IDs with the number 666 on them<br /><br />Chrysler Corporation manufactured tanks for the power of secret services portfolio that had the number 666 on one side<br /><br />A contest sponsored by the Department of Education of Israel in 1980, was a game that allowed to make money if you scratch and got the numbers 666<br /><br />The textile company introduced McGregor Clothing clothing collection for men 666<br /><br />A phone company Midwest had credit cards encoded with the number 666<br /><br />The identification cards of Japanese-made parts for Caterpillar in Illinois had 666 on them as part of the product code<br /><br />Men's Gloves FLXO Boss Clove Co. manufactured were stamped with 666 as the number of brand<br /><br />The company 's Hybrid Corn Co. Crow Iowa seed offering "666" as their most productive hybrid<br /><br />The company sold a fertilized improved Scotty called 6666<br /><br />Credit cards Telco Bell had the 666 prefix and then the social security number of each person<br /><br />Metric rules in 1979 distributed across the country had 666 on each<br /><br />The identification cards of cars manufactured by General Motors in Flint, Michigan, had the number 666 on them<br /><br />L as Selective Service Card USA had the number 666 as part of its code<br /><br />The telephone operator number from Israel to call overseas countries was 666<br /><br />After the 1973 Arab-owned vehicles in Jerusalem had the prefix 666 in their tuition in order to identify the enemy in wartime<br /><br />An album of heavy metal band "Black Sabbath" was called "666"<br /><br />Mastercard started wearing the number 66 in his statements in 1980,<br /><br />Etc etc .... Is not it amazing? We will have to tread very eye to these signals. Consider a device with these characteristics will not only access information but also, of course, send information, data, and therefore, orders the microchip.<br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /> <br /><br />Does anyone would think that a millionaire investments as being made are made only to make us "life easier"?<br /><br /> <br /><br />And above is of course a form of control of our identity, our decisions, our tastes, our way of life ... in line with all control initiatives that are being implemented in a rush (video surveillance, control of mobile devices , checks at airports, waste control, mind control, education, etc ... ... and so on., etc.). Once a primitive version of subcutaneous chip has been implemented we will be prisoners of a system that allows chips to extract will (remember the danger of their breaking into or defective exhaust) so it would be obliged to implant a chip version of increasingly technologically advanced, more complex functions that allow a not so distant future completely control all our decisions, thoughts, desires and actions. Without neglecting any danger to the humanity (and there is a long list), it certainly seems the most ruthless, a life dominated by slogans sent to billions chip by means of remote control from the organs of power. And it's really surprising that a book, write who wrote hundreds of years, say so clearly what is to come, almost without symbolism, literally as it was envisaged.<br /><br /><br /><br />http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/ciencia/ciencia_implants09.htm<br /> <br />
I am not going to lie, the news about the RFID chip is scaring me. I live in the US. There is no way I'm getting a chip and I don't want my family getting it either. Besides losing all of your freedom and privacy it sounds dangerous. We all have to fight this.
<br />I am not going to lie, the news about the RFID chip is scaring me. I live in the US. There is no way I'm getting a chip and I don't want my family getting it either. Besides losing all of your freedom and privacy it sounds dangerous. We all have to fight this. <br />
<br /><br />I'll go live in the backwoods before I let them chip me. and people thought I was crazy for always having a zombie apocalypse plan.
Wow....there's a ton to catch up on in this thread alone! Thanks to everyone for all the great posts...there's a lot of info to process and try to make sense of. No matter the topic, there is always different perspectives...different interpretations, and in the end we have to go with the one we 'feel' is the right one after having looked a wide array of 'evidence'. IMO, though, as our friend Murray once said lol...as long as we keep God (love) in our heart...we will be fine. <br /><br />As for Ron Wyatt...I came across this while doing some research (not sure if it's been posted already---I haven't caught up on every post yet). It's a statement by a scientist who spoke with Ron about the blood findings and based on what he's been told (by Ron)...he is supporting the findings from a geneticist/scientific perspective. I know nothing about Dr. Dunkley and don't understand all the 'science' involved...so I don't know how 'trustworthy' his opinion is but wanted to include this here since there isn't much out there in support of Ron's findings (I'm finding there's a ton more negative 'opinions' than positive ones about Ron).<br /><br />
<br />A Scientist Analyzes Mr. Wyatt's Chromosome Theory<br /><br />Dr. Eugene Dunkley, Geneticist<br />August 1999, England<br /><br /> In regards to the statements made by Ron Wyatt and his chromosomal analysis: I do not believe that any of Ron's findings or conclusions will effect the Seventh Day Adventists or their faith. I don't believe that he had a crusade against the denomination or any denomination for that matter. <br /><br />Re his findings-you must remember that Ron was NOT a scientist, he was an anesthetist. This is not to excuse mistakes in his details, but to understand more accurately where he was coming from. I sat with Ron and Derek at D's house in Oxford and Ron explained to me what was done. I filled in the details in my own mind, knowing that there were holes in what he said, but not done to deceive, just a lack of knowledge. <br /><br />Karyotypes are performed all the time. It is a technique in which the chromosomes are arrested in metaphase by a drug and then stained with either Giemsa or a reverse stain, and then in this stage are separated and counted and characterized. There is also a banding pattern associated with each chromosome pair so that identification of the chromosome is unmistakable. White blood cells are the only blood cells that can be used for such an "experiment". Russell's criticism is inaccurate because he omitted what would have had to happen for the experiment to take place. First, the blood sample was scrapped from the altar. The cells were resuspended in PBS (a buffer), which allowed the cells to re-hydrate. Then, the cells were cultured. Only cells with DNA would be able to grow in culture, so there is no need to "separate" red blood cells, platelets, etc., because they simply wouldn't be present in a freshly growing culture. These cells were simply white blood cells in culture (a routine procedure). Next, the cells (or some of them) would be taken, arrested when the cells were in metaphase (when the chromosome condense and are visible by microscopy) and stained. Some of the stains allow light microscopy, but others allow fluorescent microscopy. I imagine that Ron didn't know one type of microcope from another; he could use an electron microscope to see the chromosomes, but certainly not to count them or characterize them. However, that would not detract from the finding. The karyotype would have been made, and the chromosomes placed in their proper pairs. <br /><br />Ron was convinced that the blood of the altar was in fact the divine blood of Jesus because the chromosome count was 24. If Jesus was ONLY human we would expect 46. In fact, if he found 46 chromosomes I would have my doubts because the argument would be that it was simply the blood of a human being (except of course that the white blood cells were re-vitalized after almost 2000 years....). Russell is wrong about the frequency of chromosomal diseases in humans: a number of conditions involving either 47 or 45 chromosomes have been well characterized, besides Turner's, such as Klinefelters, Down's syndrome, Pateau's syndrome, Cri-de-Chat syndrome, XYY, XXY, etc. and in fact there was a case in which a young man was found alive with only 24 chromosomes. <br /><br />You must remember that Ron's inaccuracies in describing this finding are due to the fact that he did not personally do the experiments or prepare the cells, because it is not his field of expertise. He simply got the data and presented it with the understanding that he had. Russell may be correct about other aspects of the research (I am not an archaeologist), but he himself is not accurate about the cells and the chromosomes, and his critique suggests that he is being subjective. <br /><br />Of course, I only have the description of what Ron said to me, so I too have no hard data. However, if there is a need to explain this data I would be happy to do so in defense of the findings. In fact, there are several more experiments that could be done to further prove what Ron stated. However, I do not believe that they would be necessary, and in fact would cause a few problems (especially in this age of cloning, one would conceivably want to clone the divine chromosome and modify themselves). I do remember that Ron was reluctant to say anything about the finding, but he felt moved during his talk at our church, having met with me earlier, to say what he had found. He knew that I would have some knowledge of the field, and if in fact he thought it was dodgy he would NOT have said anything because he knew that I would be one of the few people able to pick it apart. He said it in his sermon knowing that I would understand it, and I feel to this day that God moved on him to do so that the finding would be spoken of and would stand the test. This convinces me that Ron is right.... <br />
@RK: just wanted to say thanks for the video; it made me reassess some assumptions. I never really thought about how Noah distinguished clean from unclean all the way in Genesis, or the bit about circumcision. What I gathered is that there isn't enough substantial evidence to say that Christians are mandated to observe the Sabbath according to the terms of the new covenant (essentially a new contract), yet no one can deny that the Sabbath is the seventh day.<br />
<br /><br />I'm glad someone listened to it. I have to admit, I always get plenty of food for thought from Chuck's teaching. <br />
Prophetic Implications<br /><br />From the standpoint of Bible prophecy, however, there are some provocative enigmas which also emerge from the Seventh Day issue. The Sabbath is an intrinsic part of the creation, specifically for man.50 It isn’t intrinsically limited to the Mosaic Covenant. Sabbaths will continue as a basis for worship in the Millennium: For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the LORD, so shall your seed and your name remain. And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one Sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the LORD. - Isaiah 66:22, 23
<br /><br />Yes....no one can deny that the sabbath is the 7th day.<br /><br />
<br />I'll go live in the backwoods before I let them chip me. and people thought I was crazy for always having a zombie apocalypse plan. <br />
<br /><br />I agree. Never ever ever ever. I'd die first.<br />
<br /><br />I don't want that crazy control-chip either. But what if they deny acces to my banksavings, if I can't go to a hospital or doctor anymore, if I can't travel anymore, can't get my retirement-savings (which we are obliged to pay in The Netherlands), if I can't get any insurancepayment anymore or can't buy food in the supermarket, then WHAT can we do??? <br />Initially, it might just store our medical data, but over time they will be adding more and more features and we may be entirely dependent on the chip. And there are unfortunately not many backwoods in The Netherlands!<br />Maybe I can live with you Bec? <br />
I just thought of all the poor kitties and doggies they chip !!! Well, they had to start somewhere....but kind of makes you wonder what kind of experimenting has been going on with our beloved four legged friends. Now they "chip" our bank cards and have us convinced that it provides better security. <br /><br />The more reason to pray for Gods' Kingdom to come on EARTH as it is heaven. That is my only hope anyways.
On finding safety from even such a situation as the Big Brother chip to control us like robots, TS does mention that the truth of the Ark is our safety somehow, just like Noah's ark was safety for the 8. So I guess we will learn more with the other signs what we must do to protect ourselves. Also MJ/TS always remind us that we needn't fear or worry, only trust God and Michael. Good point about the fact that the Christians just before 70 AD and Jerusalem being destroyed, were warned to flee, which they did, long before the Sabbath. <br /><br /><br />The Sign<br />
[size=medium]God wants us to see the ark by faith.[/size][size=medium]But not blind faith, gullibly believing everything that anyone tells us; no, we should have intelligent faith that is based upon plenty of evidence. [/size][size=medium]Also, video of the ark and the tables of stone will be made public in the near future, shortly after the mark of the beast law is passed.[/size]
<br /><br /><br />Also we should not assume that he is ONLY meaning the "mark of the beast" to be the National Sunday Law. I think we only assumed this because Ron Wyatt was a Seventh Day Adventist and they believe that worshiping on Sunday IS the Mark of the Beast. I believe TS/The Sign is only endorsing Ron Wyatts discoveries, and not the particular SDA faith-group's teachings. Perhaps there will be a law passed that every human on earth has to receive the implanted chip, for national security, medical purposes and for our financial transactions. I can see the possibilities for both, but for practical purposes I think the chip is more realistic. Although perhaps TSL may also be implemented somehow as well, who knows. Usually things are far more complicated than we realize.<br /><br /><br />Paula-c, your post reminds me of the movie which I saw, "In Time", in which people had a large computer device under the skin of their wrist, but the currency was Time to live. For instance a meal might cost a week. Evil powers in the rich area, who had thousands of years to live, were ever raising the prices of things for those in the poor areas, so that the poor were living with often minutes to spare, stealing Time from each other, dying on the streets, and living basically in hell. It was depressing and unrealistic, but it could give a picture of living with the micro-chip.
I am actually far from reading all of the posts. I just started on page 8 where I left off but I saw some posts that really got my attention and I felt compelled to respond and make a reference to them. I will keep reading but I have a lot to catch up on. <br />
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<br />The 'thing' with Ron that I think is really 'tripping' me up/out...is that he just so happened to find everything he went looking for. Stuff that people had searched forever for...and then this guy shows up...always at the right time, right place...and BAM there it is. Either he was truly led by God and had His help in locating these artifacts....or he's a scammer..<br />
<br /><br />just to play devils advocate and no pun intended here, but just want to point out that evil side can make man accomplish, discover and achieve feats too (as per what we have all read in the bible) - ...<br /><br />here are some examples, to refresh our memories:<br /><br />-magic practicing priests in pharaohs time were able to duplicate some of gods miracles<br />-satan used a snake to talk to eve<br />-star that guided astrologers to baby jesus - stopped by herod first (the person out to kill baby jesus) and (unsure if i should open this can of worms)<br />-people under demonic influence can heal the sick<br />-some who practice satanism can fortell the future.<br /><br />satan uses supernatural schemes and tactics to overcome his victim. he is a supernatural being with great power to deceive (Job 1:7) <br /><br />the bible also indicates the antichrist and false prophet will also perform miracles. and the bible also speaks about counterfit signs and wonders...<br /><br />revelation16:13-14 And I saw three evil spirits that looked like frogs leap from the mouth of the dragon, the beast, and the false prophet. These miracle-working demons caused all the rulers of the world to gather for battle against the Lord on that great judgment day of God Almighty.<br /><br />another interesting scripture is where Paul also wrote in the letter to the Corinthians that the miraculous gifts of God’s holy spirit would end. He said: “Whether there are gifts of prophesying, they will be done away with; whether there are tongues, they will cease; whether there is knowledge, it will be done away with.”—1 Corinthians 13:8<br /><br />powers, knowlege of god (one on one) and miracles ceased. meaning that those who continue to do such things or posess such gifts MAY be doing so NOT under the influence of god but the influence of evil, WITH THE motive of distracting people away from god - or with out motive as they could be being used by the devil (as per bible)<br /><br />does someone being 'led by god' as in this case constitue a 'miracle' or 'prophecying' or 'knowledge' - ??? hmm, dont know. dont have the answer... just saying and putting it out there. interesting question for those that believe in god and read the bible... (incl me)<br /><br />please note I AM NOT SAYING THAT THIS IS THE CASE, in this particular instance...<br /><br />however for those who are 'god believers / bible readers - really the two possible scenarious in this situation that have been posted in this thread, being "chosen/sent/directed/influenced by god" or "scammer/fraud/faker" are not absolute, as there is a third possible explanation.<br /><br />again, not saying i believe this IS the reason, just saying that if we credit the bible for what it says, we have to do so in this instance also and the third explanation is just as plausible as any other.<br /><br />not trying to be contrary or cause debate, but just thought it would be food for thought... by the way - I HAVE no opinion of this particular situation we are looking at (not yet anyway, thats why i am on the sideline til i understand it better and before i can not only choose but understand what i choose to beleive) <br /><br /><br /><br />any opinions or civil comments regarding the notion of my post?<br />
<br /><br />True about false prophets, but I do have comments on what you quoted.<br /><br />
"-people under demonic influence can heal the sick"
<br /><br />Not true. Only God can truly heal, or those appointed by Him (like the disciples). Satan only destroys. Do you have scriptural reference for this statement?<br /><br />
"-some who practice satanism can fortell the future."
<br /><br />Same for this: do you have scriptural reference?<br /><br />
"satan uses supernatural schemes and tactics to overcome his victim. he is a supernatural being with great power to deceive (Job 1:7)"
<br /><br />He is already doing that for hundreds of years. People throwing away God's Holy Sabbath as if it's not important and worshipping Sunday and 'strange gods'. The catholic church is the worst, but there are flaws in every denomination. Some examples:<br /><br />"For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled. Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven. For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven."<br />Matthew 5:17-19<br /><br />This verse CLEARLY states that ALL ten commandments should be kept, even the ones that might seem unimportant to people, till heaven and earth pass. We all know THAT didn't happen yet, lol. Yet the catholics are very much breaking a lot of them: <br /><br />"Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth. Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me; And shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments."<br /><br />So the catholics do this and break the second commandment:<br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br />And they worship this:<br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br />But some probably aren't even aware, because the catholic church is trying to get rid of the second commandment: http://www.catholicbible101.com/thetencommandments.htm<br /><br /><br />Oh and they worship this too, which in my opinion is breaking the first commandment as well, since the papacy claims it can play God, forgive sins, change God's Holy Laws etc:<br /><br /><br /><br /><br />Then they work on Saturday or mown the lawn, and worship SUNday, breaking the fourth commandment.<br /><br /><br /><br />Oh and for teaching false doctrine they break of course also the ninth commandment. Many are also breaking the 7th and the 10th, but I shall not go into that. So Satan is doing a VERY good job deceiving MILLIONS of catholics already.<br /><br />The Jehova's Witnesses are doing a better job, but they somewhere forgot about the fourth commandment, because to them any day can be holy. Not true, only the Sabbath (seventh day) is holy, not just every day, or no day at all. By going door to door, teaching this (and more) false doctrines, they are also breaking the ninth.<br /><br />The Jews seem have them all ten in order, but they have a little problem: they don't accept Jesus as their saviour which also makes them break the ninth every time they teach some one their religious beliefs.<br /><br />I could go on and on, but you get my point. Satan IS already deceiving for hundreds or even thousands of years (Adam/Eve/Apple anyone?). <br /><br /><br />
"the bible also indicates the antichrist and false prophet will also perform miracles. and the bible also speaks about counterfit signs and wonders...<br /><br />revelation16:13-14 And I saw three evil spirits that looked like frogs leap from the mouth of the dragon, the beast, and the false prophet. These miracle-working demons caused all the rulers of the world to gather for battle against the Lord on that great judgment day of God Almighty."
<br /><br />This verse refers to the beasts from Revelation 13 (5th and 6th beasts) and Revelation 17 (8th beast, which is the same as the 5th):<br /><br />"And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy. And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority." (Revelation 13:1-2)<br /><br /><br />"And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon [FALSE PROPHET]. And he exerciseth all the power of the first beast before him [IMAGE OF FORMER BEAST], and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the first beast, whose deadly wound was healed." (Revelation 13:11-12)<br /><br /><br />"So he carried me away in the spirit into the wilderness: and I saw a woman sit upon a scarlet coloured beast, full of names of blasphemy, having seven heads and ten horns. And the woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet colour, and decked with gold and precious stones and pearls, having a golden cup in her hand full of abominations and filthiness of her fornication: And upon her forehead was a name written, MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH. And I saw the woman drunken with the blood of the saints, and with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus: and when I saw her, I wondered with great admiration. And the angel said unto me, Wherefore didst thou marvel? I will tell thee the mystery of the woman, and of the beast that carrieth her, which hath the seven heads and ten horns. The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is." (Revelation 17:3-6)<br /><br /><br />So the false prophet mentioned in the verse you qouted from Revelation 16, is actually a beast (world power, USA), the sixth one that is the image of the fifth/eight beast (Vatican). Ron was not a world power, far from it. He might have been an American, but if he would have been a false prophet for the image of the beasts, we all would have know him and his discoveries. But hardly anyone does: he is ridiculed and attacked and his discoveries are mocked and done away with. Also, the false prophet in Revelation 16 deceives people during the plagues, AFTER the mark of the beast. Thus this verse can in no way refer to Ron Wyatt. Plus I agree with jono about 1 John 4:2.<br /><br /><br />
"another interesting scripture is where Paul also wrote in the letter to the Corinthians that the miraculous gifts of God’s holy spirit would end. He said: “Whether there are gifts of prophesying, they will be done away with; whether there are tongues, they will cease; whether there is knowledge, it will be done away with.”—1 Corinthians 13:8<br /><br />powers, knowlege of god (one on one) and miracles ceased. meaning that those who continue to do such things or posess such gifts MAY be doing so NOT under the influence of god but the influence of evil, WITH THE motive of distracting people away from god - or with out motive as they could be being used by the devil (as per bible)<br /><br />does someone being 'led by god' as in this case constitue a 'miracle' or 'prophecying' or 'knowledge' - ??? hmm, dont know. dont have the answer... just saying and putting it out there. interesting question for those that believe in god and read the bible... (incl me)"
<br /><br />Paul wrote this nearly 2000 years ago and he is talking about the time after Christ until the end of the 1335 days of Daniel 12. There will be no more miracles, no more prophets, no more scriptural knowledge (because Satan is doing his best to deceive the whole world):<br /><br />"But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book [NO UNDERSTANDING], even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased [KNOWLEDGE WILL RETURN]. Then I Daniel looked, and, behold, there stood other two, the one on this side of the bank of the river, and the other on that side of the bank of the river. And one said to the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, How long shall it be to the end of these wonders [WHEN WILL THERE BE UNDERSTANDING OF THIS PROPHECY]? And I heard the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, when he held up his right hand and his left hand unto heaven, and sware by him that liveth for ever that it shall be for a time, times, and an half [3.5 YEARS ARE 1260 DAYS, WHICH IN BIBLE PROPHECY MEANS 1260 YEARS, BUT NO BEGINNING OR END IS GIVEN] ; and when he shall have accomplished to scatter the power of the holy people, all these things shall be finished. And I heard, but I understood not: then said I, O my Lord, what shall be the end of these things? And he said, Go thy way, Daniel: for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end. Many shall be purified, and made white, and tried; but the wicked shall do wickedly: and none of the wicked shall understand; but the wise shall understand. And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolate set up [STARTING POINT GIVEN (PAPACY), SAME ENDING POINT], there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days. Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days [BECAUSE THESE 'WONDERS' WIL END THEN]."<br />Daniel 12:8-13<br /><br />Those who did the math on Daniel know that these 1335 years are passed already about 150+ years ago. Why are those blessed who wait? Because that is when understanding of the scriptures returned; the book of Daniel was no longer sealed. And what happens at the time of the end: knowledge shall INCREASE so that the truth can prevail. So actually that verse of Paul you quoted verifies Ron and his discoveries even more. Paul was referring to the years BEFORE the end of the time prophecy in Daniel.<br /><br /><br />
<br /><br /><br />Souza: Great post about the Roman Catholic Church! I’m glad that people are finally discussing this subject. When I started my video series, I was not sure how people would take it. Since you have quoted from the book of Revelation and mentioned the ‘Whore of Babylon’ , I would like to post the first 3 episodes of my series dealing with Michael and his encoded message about this subject. I am definitely going to post my series on the new forum MichaelsArmyofLove. I would like to start a discussion about it on that other forum now that I am seeing more of us open up our minds to this information. But for now, here are the first 3 episodes of my series:<br /><br />Important Note!<br />These videos may be blocked in some countries due to copyright issues. If you cannot see the episodes because they are blocked in your country, go to hidemyass.com and paste these links in the box and click ‘hide my ass’>>>>>> <br /><br />Episode 1: />Episode 2: />Episode 3: /><br />Episode 1<br /><br /><br />Episode 2<br /><br /><br />Episode 3<br /><br /><br />And Thanks again Souza for posting that info about the Sabbath. Now as for the seventh day, I have had a really hard time with my family on this one but I’m working on it. We were brought up to keep Sunday, the false Sabbath. I have been showing them the biblical proof along with a lot of the information that you posted about the Sabbath.<br /><br />For those of you having issues with this particular subject:<br /><br />The 10 Commandments are 10 Commandments! Nothing has changed. They are Gods laws and He is adamant that we follow them. Keeping His commandments was not meant to be easy or convenient. The choice is yours to follow them of not to follow them. But there is no in-between. There is no gray. It is either black or white. That sounds harsh but it’s the truth. God does not want us to be ‘lukewarm’! He will surely spit us out if we are! <br /><br />The Mark of the Beast LAW: WOAH! Thank you for posting this info Im_convincedmjalive!! That’s the info I was wondering about when I posted on the other forum asking TS to clarify. The mark of the beast IS NOT A RFID Chip!!!! It’s Sunday worship! All that BS circulating about that RFID Chip being the mark of the beast is propaganda that has been spread by the Jesuits. <br /><br />And BTW...The belief that 'Sunday worship' is the mark of the beast is NOT a belief exclusively held by the SDA. There are non-SDAs that believe this to be the mark as well but I will not get in to that. My post is already long enough as it is. I'll let you all do your own research on the matter if you care enough to do so.<br /><br /><br />Here are the links that Im_convincedmjalive gave us again just so that people can check them out if they haven’t: <br />http://www.wyattarchaeology.com/nsl.pdf<br />http://www.markofbeast.net/page3.htm<br /><br />All of you are making amazing posts and I will continue to read on until I can catch up. I’m just really enjoying this journey. It’s been amazing! I thank God for this everyday!<br /><br />I send LOVE to all of you!
OK if I have to make a choise at this moment, I would find it easy to switch from keeping the Sunday to keeping the Saturday. In fact for many years I wasn't sure about keeping the Sunday. Some say the Old Testament is only for the jews, why would we keep the laws God made for them??<br />Still....Jesus was also a jew, wasn't he? And we still follow him, don't we? <br />Our ortodox church says we should obey the church because it has authority from Jesus (Mathew 18:18). I have a problem understanding if the authority was given only to the apostles or also to the priests who came after the apostles. Something doesn't sound right to me though in this picture. <br />
<br />I am actually far from reading all of the posts. I just started on page 8 where I left off but I saw some posts that really got my attention and I felt compelled to respond and make a reference to them. I will keep reading but I have a lot to catch up on. <br />
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<br />The 'thing' with Ron that I think is really 'tripping' me up/out...is that he just so happened to find everything he went looking for. Stuff that people had searched forever for...and then this guy shows up...always at the right time, right place...and BAM there it is. Either he was truly led by God and had His help in locating these artifacts....or he's a scammer..<br />
<br /><br />just to play devils advocate and no pun intended here, but just want to point out that evil side can make man accomplish, discover and achieve feats too (as per what we have all read in the bible) - ...<br /><br />here are some examples, to refresh our memories:<br /><br />-magic practicing priests in pharaohs time were able to duplicate some of gods miracles<br />-satan used a snake to talk to eve<br />-star that guided astrologers to baby jesus - stopped by herod first (the person out to kill baby jesus) and (unsure if i should open this can of worms)<br />-people under demonic influence can heal the sick<br />-some who practice satanism can fortell the future.<br /><br />satan uses supernatural schemes and tactics to overcome his victim. he is a supernatural being with great power to deceive (Job 1:7) <br /><br />the bible also indicates the antichrist and false prophet will also perform miracles. and the bible also speaks about counterfit signs and wonders...<br /><br />revelation16:13-14 And I saw three evil spirits that looked like frogs leap from the mouth of the dragon, the beast, and the false prophet. These miracle-working demons caused all the rulers of the world to gather for battle against the Lord on that great judgment day of God Almighty.<br /><br />another interesting scripture is where Paul also wrote in the letter to the Corinthians that the miraculous gifts of God’s holy spirit would end. He said: “Whether there are gifts of prophesying, they will be done away with; whether there are tongues, they will cease; whether there is knowledge, it will be done away with.”—1 Corinthians 13:8<br /><br />powers, knowlege of god (one on one) and miracles ceased. meaning that those who continue to do such things or posess such gifts MAY be doing so NOT under the influence of god but the influence of evil, WITH THE motive of distracting people away from god - or with out motive as they could be being used by the devil (as per bible)<br /><br />does someone being 'led by god' as in this case constitue a 'miracle' or 'prophecying' or 'knowledge' - ??? hmm, dont know. dont have the answer... just saying and putting it out there. interesting question for those that believe in god and read the bible... (incl me)<br /><br />please note I AM NOT SAYING THAT THIS IS THE CASE, in this particular instance...<br /><br />however for those who are 'god believers / bible readers - really the two possible scenarious in this situation that have been posted in this thread, being "chosen/sent/directed/influenced by god" or "scammer/fraud/faker" are not absolute, as there is a third possible explanation.<br /><br />again, not saying i believe this IS the reason, just saying that if we credit the bible for what it says, we have to do so in this instance also and the third explanation is just as plausible as any other.<br /><br />not trying to be contrary or cause debate, but just thought it would be food for thought... by the way - I HAVE no opinion of this particular situation we are looking at (not yet anyway, thats why i am on the sideline til i understand it better and before i can not only choose but understand what i choose to beleive) <br /><br /><br /><br />any opinions or civil comments regarding the notion of my post?<br />
<br /><br />True about false prophets, but I do have comments on what you quoted.<br /><br />
"-people under demonic influence can heal the sick"
<br /><br />Not true. Only God can truly heal, or those appointed by Him (like the disciples). Satan only destroys. Do you have scriptural reference for this statement?<br /><br />
"-some who practice satanism can fortell the future."
<br /><br />Same for this: do you have scriptural reference?<br /><br />
"satan uses supernatural schemes and tactics to overcome his victim. he is a supernatural being with great power to deceive (Job 1:7)"
<br /><br />He is already doing that for hundreds of years. People throwing away God's Holy Sabbath as if it's not important and worshipping Sunday and 'strange gods'. The catholic church is the worst, but there are flaws in every denomination. Some examples:<br /><br />"For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled. Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven. For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven."<br />Matthew 5:17-19<br /><br />This verse CLEARLY states that ALL ten commandments should be kept, even the ones that might seem unimportant to people, till heaven and earth pass. We all know THAT didn't happen yet, lol. Yet the catholics are very much breaking a lot of them: <br /><br />"Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth. Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me; And shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments."<br /><br />So the catholics do this and break the second commandment:<br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br />And they worship this:<br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br />But some probably aren't even aware, because the catholic church is trying to get rid of the second commandment: http://www.catholicbible101.com/thetencommandments.htm<br /><br /><br />Oh and they worship this too, which in my opinion is breaking the first commandment as well, since the papacy claims it can play God, forgive sins, change God's Holy Laws etc:<br /><br /><br /><br /><br />Then they work on Saturday or mown the lawn, and worship SUNday, breaking the fourth commandment.<br /><br /><br /><br />Oh and for teaching false doctrine they break of course also the ninth commandment. Many are also breaking the 7th and the 10th, but I shall not go into that. So Satan is doing a VERY good job deceiving MILLIONS of catholics already.<br /><br />The Jehova's Witnesses are doing a better job, but they somewhere forgot about the fourth commandment, because to them any day can be holy. Not true, only the Sabbath (seventh day) is holy, not just every day, or no day at all. By going door to door, teaching this (and more) false doctrines, they are also breaking the ninth.<br /><br />The Jews seem have them all ten in order, but they have a little problem: they don't accept Jesus as their saviour which also makes them break the ninth every time they teach some one their religious beliefs.<br /><br />I could go on and on, but you get my point. Satan IS already deceiving for hundreds or even thousands of years (Adam/Eve/Apple anyone?). <br /><br /><br />
"the bible also indicates the antichrist and false prophet will also perform miracles. and the bible also speaks about counterfit signs and wonders...<br /><br />revelation16:13-14 And I saw three evil spirits that looked like frogs leap from the mouth of the dragon, the beast, and the false prophet. These miracle-working demons caused all the rulers of the world to gather for battle against the Lord on that great judgment day of God Almighty."
<br /><br />This verse refers to the beasts from Revelation 13 (5th and 6th beasts) and Revelation 17 (8th beast, which is the same as the 5th):<br /><br />"And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy. And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority." (Revelation 13:1-2)<br /><br /><br />"And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon [FALSE PROPHET]. And he exerciseth all the power of the first beast before him [IMAGE OF FORMER BEAST], and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the first beast, whose deadly wound was healed." (Revelation 13:11-12)<br /><br /><br />"So he carried me away in the spirit into the wilderness: and I saw a woman sit upon a scarlet coloured beast, full of names of blasphemy, having seven heads and ten horns. And the woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet colour, and decked with gold and precious stones and pearls, having a golden cup in her hand full of abominations and filthiness of her fornication: And upon her forehead was a name written, MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH. And I saw the woman drunken with the blood of the saints, and with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus: and when I saw her, I wondered with great admiration. And the angel said unto me, Wherefore didst thou marvel? I will tell thee the mystery of the woman, and of the beast that carrieth her, which hath the seven heads and ten horns. The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is." (Revelation 17:3-6)<br /><br /><br />So the false prophet mentioned in the verse you qouted from Revelation 16, is actually a beast (world power, USA), the sixth one that is the image of the fifth/eight beast (Vatican). Ron was not a world power, far from it. He might have been an American, but if he would have been a false prophet for the image of the beasts, we all would have know him and his discoveries. But hardly anyone does: he is ridiculed and attacked and his discoveries are mocked and done away with. Also, the false prophet in Revelation 16 deceives people during the plagues, AFTER the mark of the beast. Thus this verse can in no way refer to Ron Wyatt. Plus I agree with jono about 1 John 4:2.<br /><br /><br />
"another interesting scripture is where Paul also wrote in the letter to the Corinthians that the miraculous gifts of God’s holy spirit would end. He said: “Whether there are gifts of prophesying, they will be done away with; whether there are tongues, they will cease; whether there is knowledge, it will be done away with.”—1 Corinthians 13:8<br /><br />powers, knowlege of god (one on one) and miracles ceased. meaning that those who continue to do such things or posess such gifts MAY be doing so NOT under the influence of god but the influence of evil, WITH THE motive of distracting people away from god - or with out motive as they could be being used by the devil (as per bible)<br /><br />does someone being 'led by god' as in this case constitue a 'miracle' or 'prophecying' or 'knowledge' - ??? hmm, dont know. dont have the answer... just saying and putting it out there. interesting question for those that believe in god and read the bible... (incl me)"
<br /><br />Paul wrote this nearly 2000 years ago and he is talking about the time after Christ until the end of the 1335 days of Daniel 12. There will be no more miracles, no more prophets, no more scriptural knowledge (because Satan is doing his best to deceive the whole world):<br /><br />"But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book [NO UNDERSTANDING], even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased [KNOWLEDGE WILL RETURN]. Then I Daniel looked, and, behold, there stood other two, the one on this side of the bank of the river, and the other on that side of the bank of the river. And one said to the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, How long shall it be to the end of these wonders [WHEN WILL THERE BE UNDERSTANDING OF THIS PROPHECY]? And I heard the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, when he held up his right hand and his left hand unto heaven, and sware by him that liveth for ever that it shall be for a time, times, and an half [3.5 YEARS ARE 1260 DAYS, WHICH IN BIBLE PROPHECY MEANS 1260 YEARS, BUT NO BEGINNING OR END IS GIVEN] ; and when he shall have accomplished to scatter the power of the holy people, all these things shall be finished. And I heard, but I understood not: then said I, O my Lord, what shall be the end of these things? And he said, Go thy way, Daniel: for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end. Many shall be purified, and made white, and tried; but the wicked shall do wickedly: and none of the wicked shall understand; but the wise shall understand. And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolate set up [STARTING POINT GIVEN (PAPACY), SAME ENDING POINT], there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days. Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days [BECAUSE THESE 'WONDERS' WIL END THEN]."<br />Daniel 12:8-13<br /><br />Those who did the math on Daniel know that these 1335 years are passed already about 150+ years ago. Why are those blessed who wait? Because that is when understanding of the scriptures returned; the book of Daniel was no longer sealed. And what happens at the time of the end: knowledge shall INCREASE so that the truth can prevail. So actually that verse of Paul you quoted verifies Ron and his discoveries even more. Paul was referring to the years BEFORE the end of the time prophecy in Daniel.<br /><br /><br />
<br /><br /><br />Souza: Great post about the Roman Catholic Church! I’m glad that people are finally discussing this subject. When I started my video series, I was not sure how people would take it. Since you have quoted from the book of Revelation and mentioned the ‘Whore of Babylon’ , I would like to post the first 3 episodes of my series dealing with Michael and his encoded message about this subject. I am definitely going to post my series on the new forum MichaelsArmyofLove. I would like to start a discussion about it on that other forum now that I am seeing more of us open up our minds to this information. But for now, here are the first 3 episodes of my series:<br /><br />Important Note!<br />These videos may be blocked in some countries due to copyright issues. If you cannot see the episodes because they are blocked in your country, go to hidemyass.com and paste these links in the box and click ‘hide my ass’>>>>>> <br /><br />Episode 1: />Episode 2: />Episode 3: /><br />Episode 1<br /><br /><br />Episode 2<br /><br /><br />Episode 3<br /><br /><br />And Thanks again Souza for posting that info about the Sabbath. Now as for the seventh day, I have had a really hard time with my family on this one but I’m working on it. We were brought up to keep Sunday, the false Sabbath. I have been showing them the biblical proof along with a lot of the information that you posted about the Sabbath.<br /><br />For those of you having issues with this particular subject:<br /><br />The 10 Commandments are 10 Commandments! Nothing has changed. They are Gods laws and He is adamant that we follow them. Keeping His commandments was not meant to be easy or convenient. The choice is yours to follow them of not to follow them. But there is no in-between. There is no gray. It is either black or white. That sounds harsh but it’s the truth. God does not want us to be ‘lukewarm’! He will surely spit us out if we are! <br /><br />The Mark of the Beast LAW: WOAH! Thank you for posting this info Im_convincedmjalive!! That’s the info I was wondering about when I posted on the other forum asking TS to clarify. The mark of the beast IS NOT A RFID Chip!!!! It’s Sunday worship! All that BS circulating about that RFID Chip being the mark of the beast is propaganda that has been spread by the Jesuits. <br /><br />And BTW...The belief that 'Sunday worship' is the mark of the beast is NOT a belief exclusively held by the SDA. There are non-SDAs that believe this to be the mark as well but I will not get in to that. My post is already long enough as it is. I'll let you all do your own research on the matter if you care enough to do so.<br /><br /><br />Here are the links that Im_convincedmjalive gave us again just so that people can check them out if they haven’t: <br />http://www.wyattarchaeology.com/nsl.pdf<br />http://www.markofbeast.net/page3.htm<br /><br />All of you are making amazing posts and I will continue to read on until I can catch up. I’m just really enjoying this journey. It’s been amazing! I thank God for this everyday!<br /><br />I send LOVE to all of you! <br />
<br />For those of you having issues with this particular subject:<br /><br />The 10 Commandments are 10 Commandments! Nothing has changed. They are Gods laws and He is adamant that we follow them. Keeping His commandments was not meant to be easy or convenient. The choice is yours to follow them of not to follow them. But there is no in-between. There is no gray. It is either black or white. That sounds harsh but it’s the truth. God does not want us to be ‘lukewarm’! He will surely spit us out if we are! <br />
<br /><br />And how do we keep the 10 commandments? Through FAITH! Remember, it is impossible for man to keep the meaning of the 10 commandments -> to be as perfect as God (please refer to my last posts).<br /><br />
<br />For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— not by works, so that no one can boast. – eph 2:8-9<br />
<br /><br />
<br />“But now apart from the law the righteousness of God has been made known, to which the Law and the Prophets testify. This righteousness is given through faith in Jesus Christ to all who believe. There is no difference between Jew and Gentile, for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, and all are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus. God presented Christ as a sacrifice of atonement, through the shedding of his blood—to be received by faith. He did this to demonstrate his righteousness, because in his forbearance he had left the sins committed beforehand unpunished— he did it to demonstrate his righteousness at the present time, so as to be just and the one who justifies those who have faith in Jesus. <br /><br />Where, then, is boasting? It is excluded. Because of what law? The law that requires works? No, because of the law that requires faith. For we maintain that a person is justified by faith apart from the works of the law. Or is God the God of Jews only? Is he not the God of Gentiles too? Yes, of Gentiles too, since there is only one God, who will justify the circumcised by faith and the uncircumcised through that same faith. Do we, then, nullify the law by this faith? Not at all! Rather, we uphold the law.” – Rom 3:21-31<br />
<br /><br />There is NOTHING we can do to make things better or worse (talking about salvation here), salvation is a gift that we receive through faith! Not works..<br />Wasn't Jesus' sacrifice good enough for us? Of course it was! <br /><br />Then my question is: What will we gain from living a legalistic life? Remember, that is exactly what the Pharisees did! And what did Jesus call the Pharisees?<br />“You snakes! You brood of vipers! How will you escape being condemned to hell?” – Matt 23:33<br /><br />There is a BIG difference between living your life out of LOVE (I am forgiven, grace) and FEAR (I got to keep his commandments or else…). If we live our lives out of LOVE we will keep his commandments:<br /><br />
<br />Jesus replied: “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind. This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’ All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.” – Matt 22:37-40<br />
<br /><br />Is keeping the Sabbath a matter of life and death/ salvation or "eternal fire"?.. Not at all.
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"For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places."