Two important factors to consider, please read & discuss.

EyeHeartMJ

I have two important topics to discuss in the one post, here goes:


Firstly: the legal side.

I mentioned to my mum that some people think Michael's still alive, and they have evidence, and about Dave Dave. It went down like a lead balloon, in less than about 30 seconds flat. She said "BS", and the coroner and government have to actually verify a person's death. So my question is this: how could he fake his death (especially being so famous) without the government and coroner knowing? I assume it is illegal and Michael would be thrown into jail the moment the coroner/government realise. I do not see any topics in this forum about the LEGAL side of it, the possible consequences of his faked death. Is he that powerful that he could coerce the government/coroner/whoever into going along with it? It's one thing having his family, friends etc on his side but the government/coroner, seriously? Perhaps his massive celebrity status could be an advantage and he could use valid reasons to convince the government/coroner to go along with it, such as fame has destroyed his freedom.

Don't get me wrong; I am about 90% sure there's something odd surrounding his "death" and some of the theories here sit so well with me. Dave Dave on LKL is strong evidence for most, me included. I was wondering if it is also illegal to pose as somebody else (Dave Dave) and that is why he used the NAME Dave Dave instead of Dave Rothenberg (thus it's technically not lying). The analysis of his "final curtain call" speech I also just read, and it seems a very reasonable explanation.


Secondly: the short film Ghosts


I surely can't be the only one who's analyzed the dozens of symbolism and metaphors in it.

The scene which may be relevant to all this is where he asks "Do you me to leave?" and the kids all say "No" and the Mayor says "Yes! Yes!" in an aggressive voice. Michael then says "Fine, I'll go" and he crashes his head and hands on the concrete - his face (identity?) turning to dust and then his whole body then turns to dust too. Everyone but the Mayor is upset; the Mayor says "good riddance" and says "let's go" about 3 times. He opens the door to leave and unexpectedly Michael's huge face humorously says "hellooo!!!". The Mayor runs for his life, breaking the window (SEVEN years bad luck) and earlier when the mirror comes out of the Mayor's gut, he drops the mirror, smashing it (SEVEN years bad luck, are you with me?)

The MOST IMPORTANT interpretation of this scene is that right when everyone thought he turned to dust (died), he showed up and terrified the crap out of the Mayor (media?) This may only be saying that although the media likes to believe they've killed/destroyed him and his popularity, in actual fact they haven't, the kids still love him and there he is, popping up when the Mayor opens the door to leave. But is it something more?

I think the overall idea of Ghosts is brilliantly expressing that although the media try to scare and control him, HE is the one in control (hence the Mayor dancing AS MJ, like a puppet), and remember all the monsters/zombies dancing with him? There is one little monster who is actually a joker (I'm sure you know which one I mean). He even flicks his joker's hat with a smile, suggesting Michael (and/or his staff) is/are playing tricks on THEM (media). The monsters in Ghosts probably symbolise his staff because when Michael as a skeleton screams out they all stop and to see what he wants them to do next. In reality his staff did just about whatever he asked; he controlled everything right?

I've read in Randy Taborelli's book also that Michael discovered in the Thriller era that he's actually the one who controls the media, NOT vice-versa. Ghosts therefore is absolute genius in my opinion, in terms of symbolism and metaphors.

Perhaps I am taking it too literally, but do you think Ghosts has a relation to his real life "death" somehow?

Souza

The legal issues are definitely discussed here. First of all he died as Michael Joseph Jackson, while his legal name is Michael Joe Jackson. That makes the Death Certificate a fake of a fake (thus not fraud).

The coroner hasn't said a thing in 18 months, no doctor has spoken and everyone that has spoken are mostly actors. You must not forget that this is Hollywood and that a lot of things are possible for the sake of film. You only need a few key-people in on this.

Just see this through the eyes of a filmmaker and you will get what I mean because as serious as the message behind it is, he is pulling it off in the most entertaining way possible, innovative and getting the concept of 'movie' to a new level, doing something no one has ever even tried. How do you top Thriller? This is how you top Thriller, big time!

EyeHeartMJ

Isn't the mere fact the death certificate is said to be fake illegal in itself? And the majority of the world think he's literally dead. I just don't know if the law would allow him to mislead most of the world for entertainment's sake...as extraordinarily awesome as that would be! I just don't know if the government would make exceptions and bend the law just because he wants them to. Is the fact that the media themselves lie the only reason to allow him to mislead us too?

Does that make sense <!-- s:? -->:?<!-- s:? -->

Souza

Isn't the mere fact the death certificate is said to be fake illegal in itself? And the majority of the world think he's literally dead. I just don't know if the law would allow him to mislead most of the world for entertainment's sake...as extraordinarily awesome as that would be! I just don't know if the government would make exceptions and bend the law just because he wants them to. Is the fact that the media themselves lie the only reason to allow him to mislead us too?

Does that make sense <!-- s:? -->:?<!-- s:? -->

No, the DC being completely made up is not fraud, because it does not say that Michael Joe Jackson died, the actual legal person. If his personal data would be right, it would be another story, but it's not, which makes it a fake of a fake. You can't call it forgery if there is no original that is faked.

Also his life insurance was never paid out, it was cashed in (which means you get the money back you already paid) so there is no fraud in that as well.

According to documents, the estate is also not in probate.

There are legal loopholes everywhere and I am sure he covered them all. See all the documents as props for a movie. I remember Harvey once said on TMZ live that there were special circumstances in California if you make a documentary, but when I asked him what that would mean exactly, he didn't answer the question. That is still something that needs some investigation.

As for misleading: it's up to everyone to believe the story or not. If we can see that there is something fishy going on with his death, everyone should be able to. That's also a big point in this hoax: people believe anything they are being told without questioning and without investigation.

EyeHeartMJ

I know what you'e saying about the DC. But how do we know the "fake" DC the media has shown us is not one the media themselves fabricated? And if the DC isn't technically legal, won't MJ still get into trouble since every reporter in the world is saying yes he died?

Or is that lie illegal on the media's part, or is it okay because the media lie anyway, and the law won't take their lies seriously? Or is it okay because they're only reporting what they're told? Would the media be in on it or not?

Sorry for all the questions. I'm not denying MJ would be very capable of this, and he is extremely smart so I imagine he has it all worked out perfectly. If you watched the Lisa Marie interview on Oprah recently, she says about 3 times how he's a "master manipulator". I found it interesting how merely 2 weeks earlier his parents and kids spoke to Oprah. His parents said there was no file for divorce (I'm sure there was) and that they "don't fight". I think his mother is so lovely but could she, too be in on this? Wouldn't it go against her religion?

AnaMarcia

When you think that Michael was threatened with death, you can see everything clearly?
If he was threatened like everyone's talking about (family and friends), he should have legal protection, so the government knows and maybe even offer practical help Michael (CIA or FBI). That's my theory.
Clearly this is a plan developed by a genius, and even if it has not been for 20 years, but at least six months he spent preparing everything.
Regarding D. Katherenine, I'm still in doubt but he may just be protecting her beloved son.

truthprevails

I know what you'e saying about the DC. But how do we know the "fake" DC the media has shown us is not one the media themselves fabricated? And if the DC isn't technically legal, won't MJ still get into trouble since every reporter in the world is saying yes he died?

Or is that lie illegal on the media's part, or is it okay because the media lie anyway, and the law won't take their lies seriously? Or is it okay because they're only reporting what they're told? Would the media be in on it or not?

Sorry for all the questions. I'm not denying MJ would be very capable of this, and he is extremely smart so I imagine he has it all worked out perfectly. If you watched the Lisa Marie interview on Oprah recently, she says about 3 times how he's a "master manipulator". I found it interesting how merely 2 weeks earlier his parents and kids spoke to Oprah. His parents said there was no file for divorce (I'm sure there was) and that they "don't fight". I think his mother is so lovely but could she, too be in on this? Wouldn't it go against her religion?

I think Souza answered some of your questions. The movie angle is a possibility, but even if that's not the case... Depending on the purpose of the hoax, MJ could have government agencies working with him. He had connections in HIGH places!

MJ can't be held responsible for what reporters say. Reporters and journalists lie about lots of stuff anyway... And there have been other "death hoaxes" in the media, i.e. reports that certain people have died (when they didn't) and no one ever got prosecuted for that, as far as I know.

Not sure how religious Katherine really is... And I believe love for her son surpasses that, to the point that she would lie for Michael. (I certainly would, and I'm a stranger to Michael.) That woman has been through a lot, and I believe she's pretty tough.

Re: "Ghosts": I like your analysis, it's pretty much how I interpret the video too. And yes, I find the whole story brilliant - and Michael is certainly in control there. "Thriller" was a different era in his life, though... circa 1983. The media hadn't yet turned against MJ!

Souza

I know what you'e saying about the DC. But how do we know the "fake" DC the media has shown us is not one the media themselves fabricated? And if the DC isn't technically legal, won't MJ still get into trouble since every reporter in the world is saying yes he died?

If the media fabricated it, MJ could never be held accountable for it, so if that is the case, there is no problem about that at all. MJ is not responsible for lies that are being spread by reporters.

Or is that lie illegal on the media's part, or is it okay because the media lie anyway, and the law won't take their lies seriously? Or is it okay because they're only reporting what they're told? Would the media be in on it or not?

Not all the media is in, that would be impossible and not his intention IMO. I think in: TMZ and Larry King.

Sorry for all the questions. I'm not denying MJ would be very capable of this, and he is extremely smart so I imagine he has it all worked out perfectly. If you watched the Lisa Marie interview on Oprah recently, she says about 3 times how he's a "master manipulator". I found it interesting how merely 2 weeks earlier his parents and kids spoke to Oprah. His parents said there was no file for divorce (I'm sure there was) and that they "don't fight". I think his mother is so lovely but could she, too be in on this? Wouldn't it go against her religion?

I think her son is more important to her than anything else, so yes I think she could be in on it.

suspicious mind

I have two important topics to discuss in the one post, here goes:


Firstly: the legal side.

I mentioned to my mum that some people think Michael's still alive, and they have evidence, and about Dave Dave. It went down like a lead balloon, in less than about 30 seconds flat. She said "BS", and the coroner and government have to actually verify a person's death. So my question is this: how could he fake his death (especially being so famous) without the government and coroner knowing? I assume it is illegal and Michael would be thrown into jail the moment the coroner/government realise. I do not see any topics in this forum about the LEGAL side of it, the possible consequences of his faked death. Is he that powerful that he could coerce the government/coroner/whoever into going along with it? It's one thing having his family, friends etc on his side but the government/coroner, seriously? Perhaps his massive celebrity status could be an advantage and he could use valid reasons to convince the government/coroner to go along with it, such as fame has destroyed his freedom.

Don't get me wrong; I am about 90% sure there's something odd surrounding his "death" and some of the theories here sit so well with me. Dave Dave on LKL is strong evidence for most, me included. I was wondering if it is also illegal to pose as somebody else (Dave Dave) and that is why he used the NAME Dave Dave instead of Dave Rothenberg (thus it's technically not lying). The analysis of his "final curtain call" speech I also just read, and it seems a very reasonable explanation.


Secondly: the short film Ghosts


I surely can't be the only one who's analyzed the dozens of symbolism and metaphors in it.

The scene which may be relevant to all this is where he asks "Do you me to leave?" and the kids all say "No" and the Mayor says "Yes! Yes!" in an aggressive voice. Michael then says "Fine, I'll go" and he crashes his head and hands on the concrete - his face (identity?) turning to dust and then his whole body then turns to dust too. Everyone but the Mayor is upset; the Mayor says "good riddance" and says "let's go" about 3 times. He opens the door to leave and unexpectedly Michael's huge face humorously says "hellooo!!!". The Mayor runs for his life, breaking the window (SEVEN years bad luck) and earlier when the mirror comes out of the Mayor's gut, he drops the mirror, smashing it (SEVEN years bad luck, are you with me?)

The MOST IMPORTANT interpretation of this scene is that right when everyone thought he turned to dust (died), he showed up and terrified the crap out of the Mayor (media?) This may only be saying that although the media likes to believe they've killed/destroyed him and his popularity, in actual fact they haven't, the kids still love him and there he is, popping up when the Mayor opens the door to leave. But is it something more?

I think the overall idea of Ghosts is brilliantly expressing that although the media try to scare and control him, HE is the one in control (hence the Mayor dancing AS MJ, like a puppet), and remember all the monsters/zombies dancing with him? There is one little monster who is actually a joker (I'm sure you know which one I mean). He even flicks his joker's hat with a smile, suggesting Michael (and/or his staff) is/are playing tricks on THEM (media). The monsters in Ghosts probably symbolise his staff because when Michael as a skeleton screams out they all stop and to see what he wants them to do next. In reality his staff did just about whatever he asked; he controlled everything right?

I've read in Randy Taborelli's book also that Michael discovered in the Thriller era that he's actually the one who controls the media, NOT vice-versa. Ghosts therefore is absolute genius in my opinion, in terms of symbolism and metaphors.

Perhaps I am taking it too literally, but do you think Ghosts has a relation to his real life "death" somehow?

i missed this anyone have the link?

suspicious mind

I have two important topics to discuss in the one post, here goes:


Firstly: the legal side.

I mentioned to my mum that some people think Michael's still alive, and they have evidence, and about Dave Dave. It went down like a lead balloon, in less than about 30 seconds flat. She said "BS", and the coroner and government have to actually verify a person's death. So my question is this: how could he fake his death (especially being so famous) without the government and coroner knowing? I assume it is illegal and Michael would be thrown into jail the moment the coroner/government realise. I do not see any topics in this forum about the LEGAL side of it, the possible consequences of his faked death. Is he that powerful that he could coerce the government/coroner/whoever into going along with it? It's one thing having his family, friends etc on his side but the government/coroner, seriously? Perhaps his massive celebrity status could be an advantage and he could use valid reasons to convince the government/coroner to go along with it, such as fame has destroyed his freedom.

Don't get me wrong; I am about 90% sure there's something odd surrounding his "death" and some of the theories here sit so well with me. Dave Dave on LKL is strong evidence for most, me included. I was wondering if it is also illegal to pose as somebody else (Dave Dave) and that is why he used the NAME Dave Dave instead of Dave Rothenberg (thus it's technically not lying). The analysis of his "final curtain call" speech I also just read, and it seems a very reasonable explanation.


Secondly: the short film Ghosts


I surely can't be the only one who's analyzed the dozens of symbolism and metaphors in it.

The scene which may be relevant to all this is where he asks "Do you me to leave?" and the kids all say "No" and the Mayor says "Yes! Yes!" in an aggressive voice. Michael then says "Fine, I'll go" and he crashes his head and hands on the concrete - his face (identity?) turning to dust and then his whole body then turns to dust too. Everyone but the Mayor is upset; the Mayor says "good riddance" and says "let's go" about 3 times. He opens the door to leave and unexpectedly Michael's huge face humorously says "hellooo!!!". The Mayor runs for his life, breaking the window (SEVEN years bad luck) and earlier when the mirror comes out of the Mayor's gut, he drops the mirror, smashing it (SEVEN years bad luck, are you with me?)

The MOST IMPORTANT interpretation of this scene is that right when everyone thought he turned to dust (died), he showed up and terrified the crap out of the Mayor (media?) This may only be saying that although the media likes to believe they've killed/destroyed him and his popularity, in actual fact they haven't, the kids still love him and there he is, popping up when the Mayor opens the door to leave. But is it something more?

I think the overall idea of Ghosts is brilliantly expressing that although the media try to scare and control him, HE is the one in control (hence the Mayor dancing AS MJ, like a puppet), and remember all the monsters/zombies dancing with him? There is one little monster who is actually a joker (I'm sure you know which one I mean). He even flicks his joker's hat with a smile, suggesting Michael (and/or his staff) is/are playing tricks on THEM (media). The monsters in Ghosts probably symbolise his staff because when Michael as a skeleton screams out they all stop and to see what he wants them to do next. In reality his staff did just about whatever he asked; he controlled everything right?

I've read in Randy Taborelli's book also that Michael discovered in the Thriller era that he's actually the one who controls the media, NOT vice-versa. Ghosts therefore is absolute genius in my opinion, in terms of symbolism and metaphors.

Perhaps I am taking it too literally, but do you think Ghosts has a relation to his real life "death" somehow?

i have thought about this ghost connection due to the family saying there was closed casket due to the facial damage.although on the negative side if it is not a hoax could it be there was a badly botched surgery or one of arnie kliens treatments instead?( okay mind just don't go there) <!-- s --><!-- s -->

suspicious mind

I know what you'e saying about the DC. But how do we know the "fake" DC the media has shown us is not one the media themselves fabricated? And if the DC isn't technically legal, won't MJ still get into trouble since every reporter in the world is saying yes he died?

Or is that lie illegal on the media's part, or is it okay because the media lie anyway, and the law won't take their lies seriously? Or is it okay because they're only reporting what they're told? Would the media be in on it or not?

Sorry for all the questions. I'm not denying MJ would be very capable of this, and he is extremely smart so I imagine he has it all worked out perfectly. If you watched the Lisa Marie interview on Oprah recently, she says about 3 times how he's a "master manipulator". I found it interesting how merely 2 weeks earlier his parents and kids spoke to Oprah. His parents said there was no file for divorce (I'm sure there was) and that they "don't fight". I think his mother is so lovely but could she, too be in on this? Wouldn't it go against her religion?

ultimately the motivation would be the difference in whether there would be an issue i would think. Jesus healed on the Sabbath which was a no no at the time.( kind of funny isn't it that the Pharisees were more concerned about when he did it than that he did it , you know they couldn't do it <!-- s;) -->;)<!-- s;) --> )

EyeHeartMJ

I know what you'e saying about the DC. But how do we know the "fake" DC the media has shown us is not one the media themselves fabricated? And if the DC isn't technically legal, won't MJ still get into trouble since every reporter in the world is saying yes he died?

Or is that lie illegal on the media's part, or is it okay because the media lie anyway, and the law won't take their lies seriously? Or is it okay because they're only reporting what they're told? Would the media be in on it or not?

Sorry for all the questions. I'm not denying MJ would be very capable of this, and he is extremely smart so I imagine he has it all worked out perfectly. If you watched the Lisa Marie interview on Oprah recently, she says about 3 times how he's a "master manipulator". I found it interesting how merely 2 weeks earlier his parents and kids spoke to Oprah. His parents said there was no file for divorce (I'm sure there was) and that they "don't fight". I think his mother is so lovely but could she, too be in on this? Wouldn't it go against her religion?

I think Souza answered some of your questions. The movie angle is a possibility, but even if that's not the case... Depending on the purpose of the hoax, MJ could have government agencies working with him. He had connections in HIGH places!

MJ can't be held responsible for what reporters say. Reporters and journalists lie about lots of stuff anyway... And there have been other "death hoaxes" in the media, i.e. reports that certain people have died (when they didn't) and no one ever got prosecuted for that, as far as I know.

Not sure how religious Katherine really is... And I believe love for her son surpasses that, to the point that she would lie for Michael. (I certainly would, and I'm a stranger to Michael.) That woman has been through a lot, and I believe she's pretty tough.

Re: "Ghosts": I like your analysis, it's pretty much how I interpret the video too. And yes, I find the whole story brilliant - and Michael is certainly in control there. "Thriller" was a different era in his life, though... circa 1983. The media hadn't yet turned against MJ!

Your reply helped a lot, thanks. But the media had definitely turned against him after Thriller! I remember seeing a repeat of the music show Countdown (I'm Australian) from the same year Billie Jean was out and Molly Meldrum was on it (guy with the cowboy hat who interviewed MJ a few times and liked him a lot). Billie Jean was played and this other stupid host came on after bagging him (can't remember the exact words) making jokes about his mannequins and "life at the top" isn't so good after all, or something like that. Molly was sitting right next to him but of course didn't say a word against MJ. It is well known the media have attacked him ever since Thriller (he said it himself in a racism speech once).

The interesting thing though is he and Frank Delio actually made the elephant man and the oxygen chamber stories up themselves. MJ wanted the actual words weird, bizarre to be used. I'm not just pulling it out of my butt, it's all in Randy Taborelli's book and I am fairly sure he is reliable. Look up the book if you're not familiar with it, it's a great book which he updated after MJ "died" so now it's this giant thick book lol. Really well written.

EyeHeartMJ

When you think that Michael was threatened with death, you can see everything clearly?
If he was threatened like everyone's talking about (family and friends), he should have legal protection, so the government knows and maybe even offer practical help Michael (CIA or FBI). That's my theory.
Clearly this is a plan developed by a genius, and even if it has not been for 20 years, but at least six months he spent preparing everything.
Regarding D. Katherenine, I'm still in doubt but he may just be protecting her beloved son.

Yes this is something I had thought of, I mean I did consider maybe he told the govt or whoever his freedom, health or life was at risk living his famous lifestyle but I forgot about the apparent death threats. Lisa Marie also said it recently on Oprah he was afraid someone would kill him, take his catologue. That makes perfect sense. But wouldn't MJ have to prove there were actual threats made?

EyeHeartMJ

I have two important topics to discuss in the one post, here goes:


Firstly: the legal side.

I mentioned to my mum that some people think Michael's still alive, and they have evidence, and about Dave Dave. It went down like a lead balloon, in less than about 30 seconds flat. She said "BS", and the coroner and government have to actually verify a person's death. So my question is this: how could he fake his death (especially being so famous) without the government and coroner knowing? I assume it is illegal and Michael would be thrown into jail the moment the coroner/government realise. I do not see any topics in this forum about the LEGAL side of it, the possible consequences of his faked death. Is he that powerful that he could coerce the government/coroner/whoever into going along with it? It's one thing having his family, friends etc on his side but the government/coroner, seriously? Perhaps his massive celebrity status could be an advantage and he could use valid reasons to convince the government/coroner to go along with it, such as fame has destroyed his freedom.

Don't get me wrong; I am about 90% sure there's something odd surrounding his "death" and some of the theories here sit so well with me. Dave Dave on LKL is strong evidence for most, me included. I was wondering if it is also illegal to pose as somebody else (Dave Dave) and that is why he used the NAME Dave Dave instead of Dave Rothenberg (thus it's technically not lying). The analysis of his "final curtain call" speech I also just read, and it seems a very reasonable explanation.


Secondly: the short film Ghosts


I surely can't be the only one who's analyzed the dozens of symbolism and metaphors in it.

The scene which may be relevant to all this is where he asks "Do you me to leave?" and the kids all say "No" and the Mayor says "Yes! Yes!" in an aggressive voice. Michael then says "Fine, I'll go" and he crashes his head and hands on the concrete - his face (identity?) turning to dust and then his whole body then turns to dust too. Everyone but the Mayor is upset; the Mayor says "good riddance" and says "let's go" about 3 times. He opens the door to leave and unexpectedly Michael's huge face humorously says "hellooo!!!". The Mayor runs for his life, breaking the window (SEVEN years bad luck) and earlier when the mirror comes out of the Mayor's gut, he drops the mirror, smashing it (SEVEN years bad luck, are you with me?)

The MOST IMPORTANT interpretation of this scene is that right when everyone thought he turned to dust (died), he showed up and terrified the crap out of the Mayor (media?) This may only be saying that although the media likes to believe they've killed/destroyed him and his popularity, in actual fact they haven't, the kids still love him and there he is, popping up when the Mayor opens the door to leave. But is it something more?

I think the overall idea of Ghosts is brilliantly expressing that although the media try to scare and control him, HE is the one in control (hence the Mayor dancing AS MJ, like a puppet), and remember all the monsters/zombies dancing with him? There is one little monster who is actually a joker (I'm sure you know which one I mean). He even flicks his joker's hat with a smile, suggesting Michael (and/or his staff) is/are playing tricks on THEM (media). The monsters in Ghosts probably symbolise his staff because when Michael as a skeleton screams out they all stop and to see what he wants them to do next. In reality his staff did just about whatever he asked; he controlled everything right?

I've read in Randy Taborelli's book also that Michael discovered in the Thriller era that he's actually the one who controls the media, NOT vice-versa. Ghosts therefore is absolute genius in my opinion, in terms of symbolism and metaphors.

Perhaps I am taking it too literally, but do you think Ghosts has a relation to his real life "death" somehow?

i missed this anyone have the link?

The analysis is the last reply on the page: <!-- l -->viewtopic.php?f=31&t=11461&hilit=pepper<!-- l -->

It makes a lot of sense.

Souza

When you think that Michael was threatened with death, you can see everything clearly?
If he was threatened like everyone's talking about (family and friends), he should have legal protection, so the government knows and maybe even offer practical help Michael (CIA or FBI). That's my theory.
Clearly this is a plan developed by a genius, and even if it has not been for 20 years, but at least six months he spent preparing everything.
Regarding D. Katherenine, I'm still in doubt but he may just be protecting her beloved son.

Yes this is something I had thought of, I mean I did consider maybe he told the govt or whoever his freedom, health or life was at risk living his famous lifestyle but I forgot about the apparent death threats. Lisa Marie also said it recently on Oprah he was afraid someone would kill him, take his catologue. That makes perfect sense. But wouldn't MJ have to prove there were actual threats made?

That has been proven, it's in his FBI files that were released last year.

truthprevails

I know what you'e saying about the DC. But how do we know the "fake" DC the media has shown us is not one the media themselves fabricated? And if the DC isn't technically legal, won't MJ still get into trouble since every reporter in the world is saying yes he died?

Or is that lie illegal on the media's part, or is it okay because the media lie anyway, and the law won't take their lies seriously? Or is it okay because they're only reporting what they're told? Would the media be in on it or not?

Sorry for all the questions. I'm not denying MJ would be very capable of this, and he is extremely smart so I imagine he has it all worked out perfectly. If you watched the Lisa Marie interview on Oprah recently, she says about 3 times how he's a "master manipulator". I found it interesting how merely 2 weeks earlier his parents and kids spoke to Oprah. His parents said there was no file for divorce (I'm sure there was) and that they "don't fight". I think his mother is so lovely but could she, too be in on this? Wouldn't it go against her religion?

I think Souza answered some of your questions. The movie angle is a possibility, but even if that's not the case... Depending on the purpose of the hoax, MJ could have government agencies working with him. He had connections in HIGH places!

MJ can't be held responsible for what reporters say. Reporters and journalists lie about lots of stuff anyway... And there have been other "death hoaxes" in the media, i.e. reports that certain people have died (when they didn't) and no one ever got prosecuted for that, as far as I know.

Not sure how religious Katherine really is... And I believe love for her son surpasses that, to the point that she would lie for Michael. (I certainly would, and I'm a stranger to Michael.) That woman has been through a lot, and I believe she's pretty tough.

Re: "Ghosts": I like your analysis, it's pretty much how I interpret the video too. And yes, I find the whole story brilliant - and Michael is certainly in control there. "Thriller" was a different era in his life, though... circa 1983. The media hadn't yet turned against MJ!

Your reply helped a lot, thanks. But the media had definitely turned against him after Thriller! I remember seeing a repeat of the music show Countdown (I'm Australian) from the same year Billie Jean was out and Molly Meldrum was on it (guy with the cowboy hat who interviewed MJ a few times and liked him a lot). Billie Jean was played and this other stupid host came on after bagging him (can't remember the exact words) making jokes about his mannequins and "life at the top" isn't so good after all, or something like that. Molly was sitting right next to him but of course didn't say a word against MJ. It is well known the media have attacked him ever since Thriller (he said it himself in a racism speech once).

The interesting thing though is he and Frank Delio actually made the elephant man and the oxygen chamber stories up themselves. MJ wanted the actual words weird, bizarre to be used. I'm not just pulling it out of my butt, it's all in Randy Taborelli's book and I am fairly sure he is reliable. Look up the book if you're not familiar with it, it's a great book which he updated after MJ "died" so now it's this giant thick book lol. Really well written.

I know the Molly Meldrum guy! <!-- s:) -->:)<!-- s:) --> I know the media turned against MJ after Thriller - and that's exactly what I meant, that it happened after Thriller came out and not before. I haven't read Taraborelli's book(s), on purpose. I just don't trust Taraborelli much. What makes you believe he's fairly reliable? And even if 80-90% of what he says is true, how do you know which pieces of info are true and which aren't? I think that MJ, in his youthful enthusiasm and BIG dreams, might have overestimated his powers a little bit with respect to the media... And the Internet was not well-developed in the early 1980s. That is a big factor to consider, in my opinion, because the Internet changed a lot. I do think things got out of control later, for MJ.