Is it illegal to fake your death??

missdanipytmissdanipyt Posts: 412
edited January 1970 in General Hoax Investigation
So obviously you all know that I'm a strong beLIEver, and it seems to me that the 2 most opposing excuses us believers hear are "he wouldn't do this to his family and his fans" which we all know the response to, but the other one is "it's illegal to fake your death and if Michael comes back he'll be arrested"
And when people tell me this, although I don't believe that he'll be arrested when he comes back, I dont really know what to say in response to this, and then all the non believers gang up on me like "Yeah! That's true!"

So can you guys help me out with this one? This is probably a very simple topic for most of you but I'm not very well educated about these types of goverment-issues and what not haha, so how do we respond to this?

Comments

  • mjj_fanmjj_fan Posts: 311
    i asked an attorney about witness protection , my concern was why doctors or high official would risk their jobs by signing fake papers and his reply was that ,It is not against the ethics or law for anyone to do anything so long as the law has an exception and one is merely complying with the law. Hence, the law permits doctors and coroners to sign fake papers to protect the life of someone. Hence, when doctors and coroners are signing fake papers, they are complying with the state or the federal law. Remember, an ambulance does not have to comply with the speed limit because the law provided for it as an exception to the rule.
    hope this helps, take care, have a nice day
    Godbless
  • _Dangerous__Dangerous_ Posts: 362
    I think we've discussed this thousands of times <!-- s:roll: -->:roll:<!-- s:roll: -->
  • nefarinefari Posts: 1,227
    And I'm still trying to work out in my own mind how just maybe this can all possibly be a big huge movie, with everything we see or think we see being both illusion and hired actors or hired individuals let's say and also Michael and I think at least a couple of the Jackson Brothers playing other people as well.
  • mjj_fanmjj_fan Posts: 311
    i know we discussed this many times , he /she must be new to the forum , or log in after a long time , i think its good to clear up his/ her doubt .
    take care
  • missdanipytmissdanipyt Posts: 412
    I think we've discussed this thousands of times <!-- s:roll: -->:roll:<!-- s:roll: -->

    Yeah you probably have but I just joined this forum last Thursday, if I had been part of those discussions I obviously wouldn't be asking for help now <!-- s;) -->;)<!-- s;) -->
    The only thing I've seen on here related to this is that I heard it was illegal to fake your death to escape paying off debts, not just to fake your death period.

    and mjj_fan thanks <!-- s;) -->;)<!-- s;) -->
  • 2ndStarTheRight2ndStarTheRight Posts: 34
    According to the research I have done faking your death is not illegal. The illegality come in when you do so to commit a crime i.e. insurance fraud, tax evasion or obtaining tax/death benefits, and evading justice. None of these have been done in this case. Some argue that fraud could arise becasue such a great amount of merchandise was sold after his death adding money to the estate, but I don't believe this could be proved with out a doubt in court. Michael was beloved throughout the world and it coud not be proven that revenue was solely in relation to the "death." Also nothing from the estate has been marketed based on his passing. An example of this is that no death date or mention of Michael's passing was included on the "This is It" movie or dvd and no compilations have come out referring to or mentioning his death.

    Another argument some make is that the documents released like the death certificate and autopsy reports would constitute fraud if Michael would return. This is unlikely though because these documents have a wide array of errors and inconsistencies in them and could easily be shown as invalid to begin with. An example of this is the story of P.T. Barnums Cardiff case where it was ruled that there is no crime in presenting a "fake of a fake" see a brief but good summary of this at: http://www.historybuff.com/library/refbarnum.html By the way Barnum was a huge inspiration to Michael and he spoke of him often!! In short this has been well planned and executed, just like anything else that Michael has ever done. It does not appear that there would be any legal issues involved when he returns.
  • missdanipytmissdanipyt Posts: 412
    Thank you very much!
  • ChristianaChristiana Posts: 626
    Is it illegal to fake your death?

    Easy answer: none of us knows for sure.

    Many people in this community, and others, have speculated on this topic for the last year. Many people think they have the answer or know what's true and what's not. But the simple fact is that people speculate based on information that they interpret and paraphrase to fit their own theory.

    If Michael did hoax his death, and IF he comes back, that is how and when we will all know the answer for sure. Everything else is pure speculation or supposition, unless you happen to have a law degree and specialize in this particular area...or know someone else who does, and who has stated implicitly and in no uncertain terms that it either IS or ISN'T illegal to fake one's death, along with the criteria that determines it either way.
  • 2ndStarTheRight2ndStarTheRight Posts: 34
    To clarify my position, I have researched this particular question with a lawyer specializing in probate and estate law. There are many facets in these types of cases and we may not have all the information at this time, but from the information we currently have this is the conclusion that the lawyer arrived at. I always try to investigate things involving the legalities in this case beyond the chatrooms.
  • mjisnotdeadduhhmjisnotdeadduhh Posts: 26
    I think the only way he'll be able to get away with it is because on the death certificate it says Michael Joseph Jackson when his llegal name is Michael Joe Jackson. so technically he didnt die <!-- s:P -->:P<!-- s:P --> lol thats my opinion
  • Unknown
    His death is registered with the Department of Social Security.

    jackson+2.jpg
  • mjj_fanmjj_fan Posts: 311
    @ dangerously bad does it means he has gone???
  • Unknown
    According to the research I have done faking your death is not illegal. The illegality come in when you do so to commit a crime i.e. insurance fraud, tax evasion or obtaining tax/death benefits, and evading justice. None of these have been done in this case. Some argue that fraud could arise becasue such a great amount of merchandise was sold after his death adding money to the estate, but I don't believe this could be proved with out a doubt in court. Michael was beloved throughout the world and it coud not be proven that revenue was solely in relation to the "death." Also nothing from the estate has been marketed based on his passing. An example of this is that no death date or mention of Michael's passing was included on the "This is It" movie or dvd and no compilations have come out referring to or mentioning his death.

    It could be proven in a court. All they would have to do is look at sale figures before and leading up to the death and the figures of after the death to prove that the 800 million his estate made wouldn't have happened to fast if the death never happened. Also, Jermaine also said his brother passed away at the hospital during the brief press conference.

    Bundled with the fact that people committed suicide when the news broke of Michaels passing and you have a bunch of civil, international law suits at hand if it turns out he faked his death.
  • palmprepalmpre Posts: 181
    Google will answer that question for you
  • CCCC Posts: 2,136
    According to the research I have done faking your death is not illegal. The illegality come in when you do so to commit a crime i.e. insurance fraud, tax evasion or obtaining tax/death benefits, and evading justice. None of these have been done in this case. Some argue that fraud could arise becasue such a great amount of merchandise was sold after his death adding money to the estate, but I don't believe this could be proved with out a doubt in court. Michael was beloved throughout the world and it coud not be proven that revenue was solely in relation to the "death." Also nothing from the estate has been marketed based on his passing. An example of this is that no death date or mention of Michael's passing was included on the "This is It" movie or dvd and no compilations have come out referring to or mentioning his death.

    It could be proven in a court. All they would have to do is look at sale figures before and leading up to the death and the figures of after the death to prove that the 800 million his estate made wouldn't have happened to fast if the death never happened. Also, Jermaine also said his brother passed away at the hospital during the brief press conference.

    Bundled with the fact that people committed suicide when the news broke of Michaels passing and you have a bunch of civil, international law suits at hand if it turns out he faked his death.

    JERMAINE CLEARLY SAY: MY BROTHER, MICHAEL JACKSON THE LEGENDARY KING OF POP (OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT), AND JOE SAY SOMETHING LIKE "THE WORLD HAS LOST THE GREATEST STAR (OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT) SO.... I HAVE TO SAY THAT THE KING OF POP PROBABLY DIED. HE NEVER WILL PERFORME AGAIN AND THAT IS WHY I DON´T THINK WE HAVE SOMETHING ILEGAL HERE. IF MJ ANNOUNCE HIS LAST CONCERTS (LIKE HE DID) ALL THE WORLD WILL BE GOING WILD! AND IF HE SAY HE NEVER WILL DO A RECORD AGAIN ALL THE WORLD WILL GO RUNNING TO BUY HIS CD´S... LIKE NOW... THE KING OF POP DIED, THE SALES OF CDS AND DEALS ABOUT UNRELEASED TRACKS GO UP AND UP!!!
  • tiparethtipareth Posts: 24
    I do not see any future problem in court, in relation with fraud issues.

    The only thing that might be problematic - are those not returned money for the tickets for This is It concerts. Some fans chose the option of letting the money to the AEG/Estate and ask only the ticket as souvenir.

    So with those money it can be argued that they chose the option, under high stress circumstances. So they were tricked to gave up on those sums, instead of asking them back. And that it would be not correct if AEG made money on base of a trick/hoax. Basically it's fraud and trickery.
  • DancingTheDreamDancingTheDream Posts: 4,923

    It could be proven in a court. All they would have to do is look at sale figures before and leading up to the death and the figures of after the death to prove that the 800 million his estate made wouldn't have happened to fast if the death never happened. Also, Jermaine also said his brother passed away at the hospital during the brief press conference.

    Bundled with the fact that people committed suicide when the news broke of Michaels passing and you have a bunch of civil, international law suits at hand if it turns out he faked his death.

    Why would sales figures be a problem???

    People are buying his records because they want his music. No one has forced them to or tricked them into it. I dont get your point there.. because that isnt fraud.

    People committed suicide.. well this hasnt been proven.. and im sorry, but no one forced anyone to kill themselves over MJ. That was their decision and you cant blame anyone else for suicide. That is an individual decision and im pretty sure those people had other issues and problems besides MJs death.

    And i think.. if MJ does return.. he wont return to the USA anyways.. so those in the States who want to bring stupid law suits like they always do can just go and spin.
  • CCCC Posts: 2,136
    And i think.. if MJ does return.. he wont return to the USA anyways.. so those in the States who want to bring stupid law suits like they always do can just go and spin.

    LOL DTD!
    WE MISS YOU!
    <!-- s;) -->;)<!-- s;) -->
  • DancingTheDreamDancingTheDream Posts: 4,923
    And i think.. if MJ does return.. he wont return to the USA anyways.. so those in the States who want to bring stupid law suits like they always do can just go and spin.

    LOL DTD!
    WE MISS YOU!
    <!-- s;) -->;)<!-- s;) -->


    Lol.. im on a mission today!

    I MISSED YOU TOO! xx <!-- s:D -->:D<!-- s:D -->
  • 2ndStarTheRight2ndStarTheRight Posts: 34
    I do not see any future problem in court, in relation with fraud issues.

    The only thing that might be problematic - are those not returned money for the tickets for This is It concerts. Some fans chose the option of letting the money to the AEG/Estate and ask only the ticket as souvenir.

    So with those money it can be argued that they chose the option, under high stress circumstances. So they were tricked to gave up on those sums, instead of asking them back. And that it would be not correct if AEG made money on base of a trick/hoax. Basically it's fraud and trickery.

    I have thought of this too, but as you said they did have a choice of a refund or commemorative ticket. Also, I have wondered if those special tickets might not get you into a concert(s) at the O2 when he returns. There was some talk of the stage sets going to London after the "death" It was also reported they were in Las Vegas too so who knows. It could be a possibility though that concerts could be done to satisfy the problem, or when the time comes they could pay back fans outright if it came to that to avoid legal issues. It seems like they would have some options.
  • 2ndStarTheRight2ndStarTheRight Posts: 34
    UTisNUM1
    It could be proven in a court. All they would have to do is look at sale figures before and leading up to the death and the figures of after the death to prove that the 800 million his estate made wouldn't have happened to fast if the death never happened. Also, Jermaine also said his brother passed away at the hospital during the brief press conference.

    Bundled with the fact that people committed suicide when the news broke of Michaels passing and you have a bunch of civil, international law suits at hand if it turns out he faked his death.[/quote][/quote]

    They could try to make that case, but I don't think from what I have seen with legal precedents in these types of cases that it could be proven without a doubt. It is easy to make a claim but much harder to get a conviction. Michael has a wide and active fanbase that has continuously bought his records throught his career. The prosecution could show that sales spiked, but it would be hard to say that the only reason people bought records was because of his death. His lawyers could contend that people merely rediscovered talent and responded by buying his merchandise in much the same way as they might have if he had peformed the O2 shows. It would be hard to prove the mindset of every person that bought an album or download. Plus it is important to note that the estate has not put a death date on any album released. It seems that they have thought this problem through.
  • 2 Bad2 Bad Posts: 289
    DancingTheDream wrote:" And i think.. if MJ does return.. he wont return to the USA anyways.. so those in the States who want to bring stupid law suits like they always do can just go and spin."

    LOL! I am an American and I wouldn't blame him if he never came back.
    Bravo!

    I think this is all good info to keep out in the open. This question is asked by non-believers anyway so it's good to keep it fresh in our minds. If we don't have answers to questions then how much can be believed.

    DTD did you go to LA? I thought I saw you were going.
  • aliciaa671aliciaa671 Posts: 29
    It is not against the ethics or law for anyone to do anything so long as the law has an exception and one is merely complying with the law. Hence, the law permits doctors and coroners to sign fake papers to protect the life of someone. Hence, when doctors and coroners are signing fake papers, they are complying with the state or the federal law.

    This makes sense.

    A question I have, I know it was someone who runs a MJ fan site that said people committed suicide as a result of MJ's death, has this been confirmed elsewhere? When I heard about this, I tried to find other news reports about it, but couldn't find anything that wasn't quoting him.
  • HassanHassan Posts: 22
    His death is registered with the Department of Social Security.

    jackson+2.jpg

    Still wrong middle name !!
Sign In or Register to comment.

© 2024 Michael Jackson Death Hoax Investigators | All Rights Reserved