Also the English guy at the end, it seemed inappropriate and very rude he would say "was that weird for you too?" Actually it just occurred to me right now; MJ hated the English tabloids. Do you think there's a connection between that and why this would be held in London?
EyeheartMJ thank you for posting this thread. You should definately become a psychologist, I am a psychologist. This Michael in 02 is not the real Michael. He has a different voice, and also different mannerism. If you want to learn what gestures mean look at the real Michael and check it out. Blessings.
Oh it's cool that we have a psychologist on the site <!-- s:) -->:)<!-- s:) --> and yeah I don't know what to make of it now, haven't really considered it being an impersonator but if it is then it must be a damn good take-off...perhaps the real Michael taught him exactly how to act...but how could you explain the voice he had? Only when he said "Thank you all" his voice went deeper than normal. But otherwise it was MJ's voice? I mean, he couldn't have mimed it that well could he? <!-- s:? -->:?<!-- s:? -->
Thank you EyeHeartMJ!!
I am the one who wrote the "Speech in a whole new light" and was pleased to see that
you followed up with a new thread and some great body language explanations!!!!
Great analysis!! I really believe that Michael said a mouthful without really saying much. I also believe that the hoax started on that day... The day of the 02 conference!
Maybe our threads could be combined?? That would be cool!
Yeah that would be awesome! Yeah I was thinking the timing of the conference was just too close to his "death" and I think others have said he did it that way so it would not be a shock to anyone, as in, it's more convincing as people would think "oh, it's all the pressure and physical activity that caused his cardiac arrest, no wonder..." and if there were doubles in TII it also adds up. Instead of just out of the blue he has a cardiac arrest. Because also if it was out of the blue, people would be suspicious as to why Conrad Murray just happened to be with him. Whereas it's more believable if he's got upcoming "concerts", of course he'd want a doctor with him to keep him healthy etc.
@ curls Ok good to know the event was genuine. Maybe it was the front people who were actors, I do still think they seemed a bit fake.
Also I just meant the tone of the English guy's voice sounded like he was dissing him, I know he meant that he was so close, but just his voice sounded really mean. Maybe I took it the wrong way <!-- s --><!-- s -->
Not at the begining. If you close your eyes, and listen to him starting his speech that is not michael's voice. totally different. Than his voice started to be like Michael's than it went deeper. This man is not Michael. Just try it dear, and let me know.
I was talking about the host guy sounding mean but apparently he wasn't so never mind... <!-- s --><!-- s -->
But yeah I heard MJ's voice go deep when he said "Thank you all" but I thought his voice was actually deep anyway?
I think his jumping around & chanting "This is it" maybe he was either high or pretending to be high, to create the confusion and get people talking/wondering...also when he "died" people would look back and say "well he did act differently so it's no wonder he passed, if he was taking drugs..." so it would be more convincing...ahh I don't know <!-- s:roll: -->:roll:<!-- s:roll: -->
In thinking about if the O2 guy was a double or not, I got wondering about the lines on his left palm. If someone has a better shot of the O2 guy's left palm please put it up for comparison. The only one I could find is: <!-- m -->http://www.flickr.com/photos/42390966@N05/4096385371/<!-- m -->
I then found 3 pics of the real Michael's left palm:
Whenever I see this picture of the real Michael standing at the curtain watching the O2 crowd, I gotta believe that the two are not the same people. The one at the curtain sure looks like the MIchael we know much more than the O2 guy. IMHO
What is so interesting about all this is that we go round and round in circles, some being convinced it is MJ, others that it most definitely isn't, but the bottom line is we can't all be right! That makes me wonder about all the other things in life and the world that I think I know.
I'm pretty darned sure that we're experiencing a genius at work, just look at how this man can arouse our curiosity, confuse us and intrigue us, surrounding everything he does in mystery and illusion. Look at how he makes us think and question. This is Michael Jackson ... whoever he is!
I'm now stuck somewhere in the middle. It wasn't until a few people replied to this thread saying they believe it's a double that I even considered looking into it. The front audience members being set up was as far as I'd gotten. Now I'm looking at other photos of what's meant to be MJ in the past few years before his "death", and I'm looking more carefully.
Actually the one video I instantly thought was a double, before even considering the possibility of the O2 guy being one, was this video: <!-- m -->http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M_uTK_oBK2U<!-- m -->
Maybe I'm imagining things, but his eyes look like really different, almost like they're missing his usual eyeliner underneath. Also his behaviour from about 6:07 in the clip reminds me of the O2 speech somewhat, maybe he was high? I don't know...also when he walks into audience from about 6:51, would MJ normally do that? <!-- s:? -->:?<!-- s:? -->
The 02 announcement was real - my work colleague was there. She was fairly near the front and said she though MH look totally different to how she'd seen him in the past - she has been to several MJ concerts with me.
Did she how he looked different? Does she feel it was mJ or not MJ? It would be interesting to find out what someone who was there thought.
has anyone seen the This is it dvd extra's? well on one of them (i think it was called staging the return) they show a bit of the conference and a little bit of backstage behind the red curtain.. he was smiling and talking to his team and just something about him makes me think its him..like the way he moves his hands or his smile - i didnt really think it was him at the o2 conference but when i saw that clip it just changed it for me...i think it was him or he has an almost exact double... anyway , the conference was very..different?
L.O.V.E!
What great observations you have made, EyeheartMJ! The O2 has its share of controversy and mystery and with good reason IMO. Everything from the announcement and onward has been like a twilight episode. You will make a great psychologist someday and MJ is an excellent subject to study <br />
<br />You did a very good job researching the video and your past was very interesting to read as well, however, I like Gema do not believe that was Michael. Your theory would still hold up if the person was not Michael. The impersonator probably was nervous. <br /><br />Hugs and Love<br />
<br /> <br />I agree, just from his mannerism it is not Michael. I am a pshychologist and I have no choice at times to read body language, when my patient is accused of murder, to see if he is lying or not. So in that Case that impersonator, giggled, and he was fidgiting, did not know how to use the microphone, very nervous, unease not comfortable into his own skin, and that is not Michael, He was moving from one end to another, turning around making a face to the audience. Since when Michael acts like that? Those signs to me is a person with insecuraties, and a person who is afraid to be caught because he is not Michael. Blessings to all.
But Mike can do 'different'! He can do just about anything that suits his purpose. mj_bad/ <br /><br />It's quite amusing because I know we're never all going to reach agreement on this one, but for me the 'differences' I too see are far outweighed by the definite MJ mannerisms that are all over this announcement. 'Eyebrow lift' and 'mouth touching' to name just two!<br /><br />(Add to that the thumb/finger thing that the body language guy picks up on in the video!)<br /><br />Not trying to convince anyone, just stating my opinion and gut feeling.
That "swagger" is comparable to Elvis walking backstage before his last concert in Indianapolis, June 26, 1977. <br /><br />http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xexl3j_elvis-presley-his-last-concert-drin_music<br /><br />Michael's wig style is accentuating the upper part of the head (unlike his other wigs or natural hairstyles), thus giving reference to a style like the one Elvis had, a helmet, a powerful, leo like strong person or - if one allows that comparison - a British Royal Guard. Not that I assume that Michael wanted to guard the British Royalty. Yet, this hairstyle is clearly underlining masculine strength and is expressing "I am my master".<br /><br />Perfectly fits to the fist IMO.
I can't say whether or not Michael was on drugs during the announcement, I would hope he wasn't, but I do think he was either nervous or he played like he was nervous. I am leaning more of he was acting, he put on a performance to get people to question if that was really him or if there was something wrong. I think it ties in perfectly for the hoax. One of the first things that caught my attention that something wasn't right with his "death" was when they played the announcement on t.v. I was busy doing something else and when that came on it caught my attention. Anyway.....<br /><br />I think the announcement was made to get people to think. More like a "you think you know all about me, can you pick up on this" mentality.
that california raisins video would make a good tool by which to analyse the hands. i seem to not be able to get it here though. can someone else do that please.
[size=10pt]I had written a post in December, I had to attend a symposium in regards to my profession as a pshychologist. We had to listen to a Dr. from Quebec city, talking about child behaviours. <br /><br />That night I arrived a little earlier then usual, I was waiting for my friends. While I turned around I saw lots of big men surrounding someone.. I had no clue who this person was.. Well It was Michael Jackson Impersonator.. I was starring at him so much that I thought my eyes would come out from my sockets. lolol/ <br /><br />This impersonator, looked exactly like Michael, the height the face the nose everything. He is the one who approached me, asking me if I wanted his autograph. I started to laugh.. he asked me what was so funny, I said, if you were the real Michael why not.. but you aren't.. He was amazed by what I have said to him. He was insisting he was Michael, I told him to show me his hands and like an idiot he did. I told him these are not Michael hands, Michael hands are distinguished, his fingers twirl upwards, and his nails are stained. This guy had shorter hands, and chubbier.. He was very skinny, just like Michael. He told me that I know Michael very well, I said well I am a fan of his since I was 5 yrs old. I used to watch him at the Ed Sullivan show. T<br /><br />his impersonator was at the Marriot hotel in Montreal doing a concert for a charity. He also told me that he wanted to continue Michael's legacy. Anyways to make a long story short, that impersonator could have been the one on the O2 arena, he looked just like him, his voice was the same.. Just to tell you these Impersonators study Michael's voice, mannerism, way of walking, everything. That's how we get all confused. That's why I am skeptical with this O2 dude.. He is not Michael.. everything does not fit together. blessings. [/size]
OK, back to "this was not Michael".<br /><br /><br />Michael's lips do bend a little bit downwards when he smiles.<br /><br /><br /><br /><br />Heavy lipstick enlarging the lips:<br /><br /><br /><br />Same smile at rehearsals:<br /><br /><br /><br /><br />"The last performances in London" - a stained hand to prove it was real? <br /><br /><br /><br /><br />The same hand at the trial - ring finger and middle finger always stick together:<br /><br /><br /><br />Of course this was Michael (or one of the publicly appearing Michaels if you prefer to stick to the twin / brother / relative / double theory). You may alter a face, get a facelift for your teeth and photoshop all remaining wrinkles and shadows out of a photo to achieve a 10 year younger appearance, but you may never change your hands, especially when dehydration and arthritis have taken their toll. <br />(My colleague tells me all the time that elder folks should drink a LOT, I know this topic well, hahaha.)<br /><br />Still, in the non-redacted close-ups of the face, one does see the tiny nose job scars and every other trace of Michael's life book that makes his 52 year old face beautiful.<br /><br /><br />The body language videos are great.<br />Check out the ones about Michael after the trial and about Murdoch.<br />The guy is observing quite some interesting aspects.<br />
<br />I can't say whether or not Michael was on drugs during the announcement, I would hope he wasn't, but I do think he was either nervous or he played like he was nervous. I am leaning more of he was acting, he put on a performance to get people to question if that was really him or if there was something wrong. I think it ties in perfectly for the hoax. One of the first things that caught my attention that something wasn't right with his "death" was when they played the announcement on t.v. I was busy doing something else and when that came on it caught my attention. Anyway.....<br /><br />I think the announcement was made to get people to think. More like a "you think you know all about me, can you pick up on this" mentality. <br />
<br />Absolutely!<br /> <br />Grace, agreed! EVERYTHING matches! I've spent hours/more for 2 years pouring over pictures etc. And he's beautiful and genius!
I don´t care anymore crash/<br /><br />Not focusing in body language, but just in images, to me, some frames are Michael and some frames are not. How can this happen at the same time, in the same video? geek/<br />His hands are his, yes, but his face looks like if would have been shopped (added) in the video afterwards.<br /><br />Whatever ::)<br /><br /><br /><br />
<br /> <br />6:53-7:00 looks more like "I'm having a heart attack!" By the way he grabs his heart twice. And then he says "No I'm fine!" by opening his arms. lol maybe I'm just silly, but it seems MJ is a man of secret messages in his gestures. You just have to use your imagination a little.
<br />I don´t care anymore crash/ <br /><br />Not focusing in body language, but just in images, to me, some frames are Michael and some frames are not. How can this happen at the same time, in the same video? geek/ <br />His hands are his, yes, but his face looks like if would have been shopped (added) in the video afterwards.<br /><br />Whatever ::) <br /><br /><br /><br /><br />
<br /><br />LOL - you are funny. I think that could very well be why some of us think it's not Michael yet some frames appear to really be Michael. I'm confused like you are. I'm convinced that it's not all Michael yet some of those other pictures do have his distinct features.<br /><br />As we know it's been discussed that parts of this video could have been pretaped or edited in some way before being shown on the airwaves. That would explain it...kind of like Hollywood Tonight, near the end when the female dancer kind of looks like Michael instead of the real dancer.<br /><br />Going back up to Grace's comment about Elvis. I've never totally bought into the Elvis connection of this hoax. It just seems like a distraction away from Michael. Yes, I know I'm probably too closed minded - but I'm trying to be open to it.<br /><br />Anyway, she mentions the hair. Good observation. <br /><br />The date of his last concert was June 26, 1977? 6/26/77. 6+2+6=14 (7+7) (+77)<br /><br />June 26th was one day after Michael's disappearance of June 25th<br /><br />In that clip, the drink that Elvis takes is from a Coke cup. We know that Coke has had a place in this hoax.<br /><br /><br />I just found these things kind of interesting considering there is growing thought that Elvis and MJ hoaxes are related.<br /><br />By the way, other than MJ, Elvis was the only other entertainer that made me cry when he "died". And that was only for a day. MJ clearly has his beat because I'm still not convinced that Elvis is alive.<br /><br />Blessings <br />
as I think back to the day of this announcement, I was doing some work at home (when I had a small TV in my office before they changed the TV signal stuff) I thought: why is Michael Jackson using an old school puppet/magic show backdrop for such a major announcement? then he was saying stuff like: this is it, and this is my final curtain call... LOL I remember thinking why is he using such phrases like he's about to kick the bucket! Then he did! Now I think about it, MJ had to be cooking things up!! LOL<br /><br /> mj_bad/
Comments
No, Dermot O'Leary was not being rude. x
I was talking about the host guy sounding mean but apparently he wasn't so never mind... <!-- s
But yeah I heard MJ's voice go deep when he said "Thank you all" but I thought his voice was actually deep anyway?
I think his jumping around & chanting "This is it" maybe he was either high or pretending to be high, to create the confusion and get people talking/wondering...also when he "died" people would look back and say "well he did act differently so it's no wonder he passed, if he was taking drugs..." so it would be more convincing...ahh I don't know <!-- s:roll: -->:roll:<!-- s:roll: -->
I then found 3 pics of the real Michael's left palm:
<!-- m -->http://realurbanentertainment.blogspot. ... chive.html<!-- m --> (you need to scroll down for that one)
<!-- m -->http://fred-astaire.blogspot.com/2008_0 ... chive.html<!-- m -->
<!-- m -->http://www.pbpulse.com/gossip/celeb-sta ... l-charges/<!-- m -->
Let me know your opinions! <!-- s:P -->:P<!-- s:P -->
I'm pretty darned sure that we're experiencing a genius at work, just look at how this man can arouse our curiosity, confuse us and intrigue us, surrounding everything he does in mystery and illusion. Look at how he makes us think and question. This is Michael Jackson ... whoever he is!
Actually the one video I instantly thought was a double, before even considering the possibility of the O2 guy being one, was this video: <!-- m -->http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M_uTK_oBK2U<!-- m -->
Maybe I'm imagining things, but his eyes look like really different, almost like they're missing his usual eyeliner underneath. Also his behaviour from about 6:07 in the clip reminds me of the O2 speech somewhat, maybe he was high? I don't know...also when he walks into audience from about 6:51, would MJ normally do that? <!-- s:? -->:?<!-- s:? -->
She said he didn't look well.
L.O.V.E!