If somebody did get in there why didn't they take the evidence with them and burn it why leave it there touched by bare hands why not cover your tracks
If somebody did get in there why didn't they take the evidence with them and burn it why leave it there touched by bare hands why not cover your tracks
What if these fingerprints were deliberately planted to cause doubt and confusion?
Im betting these fingerprints dont match any of the main players that we know, and we may probably never know.
Souza mentioned someone had a theory that a false hand was used to plant fingerprints. Wouldnt be impossible, i suppose.
ahahah this i funny, their letting people with out brains know that Murry could walk. but i am sure that this thing will not even go as fair as a verdict from the jury. the fact that the police did not do their job and locking down the place, and the family was parading around in the house, will result in a mistrial. they cant use anything from the house in the case. it;s all tampered with. and the family should be in jail for distraction of evidence. (but that is why i know it's a hoax) <!-- s --><!-- s -->
there is nothing that proves that he was in that house. what the people say is just he said she said to a lot of people, it is the test, fingerprints , hair samples,ect, that make the trail. if they try to use anything from the house in the trail they will be breaking the law.
If somebody did get in there why didn't they take the evidence with them and burn it why leave it there touched by bare hands why not cover your tracks
just considering all angles here (i do not believe he's dead at all) maybe whoever it was had to abruptly leave after he/she heard Murray flushing the toilet and returning. <!-- s:shock: -->:shock:<!-- s:shock: -->
I remember someone in hoaxland back in 2009 who kept talking about fingerprints. His/her story at that time was so strange and unbelievable, that I thought (s)he was nuts. I can't remember it all, but I do remember that when this person left, (s)he said: you will remember me later, when the fingerprints will come up. Well, I do remember her/him now, such a pity I can't remember the rest of the story. All I remember is that it was about a clinic in Europe and fake hands. I told you it sounded strange...
So now the story is that a third person managed to get into the house, passed the bodyguards, the chef, the kids and Murray, got into the room at the right moment, when Murray was out to phone one of his girls or taking a piss, KNEW where Mike had his cash, KNEW that the drugs he was going to inject him with would kill him and not wake him up, got the cash, and got out unnoticed as well. Oh, and he also has ties with the LAPD so the tapes would be gone and the fingerprints not checked until the defence got a hold of it. So the thief story doesn't really sound convincing, a thief has no LAPD connections like that, or that much luck. MJ knew how protect himself, a thief could never get this far, BS. If people do believe this could have happened, they would also believe that the bodyguards and the LAPD are involved to cover it all up and send Murray to jail for it instead. In that case they would have made SURE that the fingerprints would have matched Murray's, they would have planted evidence against him. This story doesn't make sense at all.
I found this, how someone can implant other fingerprints. It could be that tampered with the evidence. If you read this it will be more explicit. If this is not what you mean Souza I cannot find what you are trying to say.
<!-- m -->http://www.wikihow.com/Fake-Fingerprints<!-- m -->
In order to fake a fingerprint, one needs an original first. Latent fingerprints are nothing but fat and sweat on touched items. Thus to retrieve someone else's fingerprint (in this case the fingerprint you want to forge) one should rely on well tested forensic research methods. Which is what's to be explained here.
Steps1 Find some good counterfeits. A good source of originals for our counterfeits are glasses, doorknobs and glossy paper. The standard method of forensic research makes them visible: Sprinkling it with colored powder, which sticks to the fat.
Biometric AuthenticationWV: Leader in Competitive Global Biometrics Market, Opportunities.
<!-- m -->http://www.biometricswv.com<!-- m -->
2 Try something related to superglue. Another solution involves Cyanoacrylat, the main ingredient of superglue. A small amount thereof is poured into a bottlecap, which is then turned upside down and put over the fingerprint.
The Cyanoacrylat gasses out and reacts with the fat residue to a solid, white substance
3 Get a digital reproduction. The further treatment involves scanning/photographing (Figure 5) and a bit of graphical refurbishment.
The goal is to get an exact image of the fingerprint, for further use as mold, out of which the dummy is made. The easiest way is to print the image on a transparency slide (the ones normally used for an overhead projector) with a laser printer. The toner forms a relief, which is later used similar to letter press printing. Wood glue is suitable for producing the dummy.
4 Use a small dash of glycerene to optimize humidity and workability. After thorough mixing, the dummy gets coated with a thin layer of the compound.
5 After the glue has dried (Figure 10), pull off the foil (Figure 11) and cut it to finger size.
6 Glue the counterfeit to your own finger. Theatrical glue is used to glue the dummy onto the own finger. The new identity is ready!
A Chinese woman managed to enter Japan illegally by having plastic surgery to alter her fingerprints, thus fooling immigration controls, police claim.
Lin Rong, 27, had previously been deported from Japan for overstaying her visa. She was only discovered when she was arrested on separate charges.
Tokyo police said she had paid $15,000 (£9,000) to have the surgery in China.
It is Japan's first case of alleged biometric fraud, but police believe the practice may be widespread.
Japanese police suspect Chinese brokers of taking huge sums to modify fingerprints surgically.
Local media reports said Ms Lin had undergone surgery to swap the fingerprints from her right and left hands.
Skin patches on her thumbs and index fingers were removed and then re-grafted on to the matching digits of the opposite hand.
Japanese newspapers said police had noticed that Ms Lin's fingers had unnatural scars when she was arrested last month for allegedly faking a marriage to a Japanese man.
The apparent ability of illegal migration networks to break through hi-tech controls suggests that other countries who fingerprint visitors could be equally vulnerable - not least the United States, according to BBC Asia analyst Andre Vornic.
Story from BBC NEWS:
<!-- m -->http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/2/hi/a ... 400222.stm<!-- m -->
This is really hard to believe, specially from one source.
Okay, it is easy to say I did expect this news or gossip or whatever you call it. So I can laugh about it or I can let my imagination flow and start to make a theory out of it. Although Murray is innocent, there must be a trial, because it is leading part of the hoax which should draw massive media attention in order to bring out MJ's message expressed in a revealing movie.
My - perhaps a bit too imaginary - theory is that the scenario could be that an "unknown" person managed to sneak into the house and supposedly killed MJ by using the propofol filled syringe and stole the cash. "Unfortunately", we missed the part of the sneaking intruder on tape <!-- s;) -->;)<!-- s;) --> . I remember the TMZ article dated 01/25/2011 'Dr. Murray -- Dead Body Found in Courthouse Sweep' <!-- l -->viewtopic.php?f=172&t=17531&hilit=sweep<!-- l -->, and I was thinking somehow the dead body must be a part of the puzzle. The found corpse must have been the intruder who "killed" MJ. Probably he was killed because of the money. This is all a hoax movie scenario. So in reality MJ is NOT killed, Murray is innocent and there was no intruder, but it has been made up to create a scapegoat. And they all live happily ever after...
ahahah this i funny, their letting people with out brains know that Murry could walk. but i am sure that this thing will not even go as fair as a verdict from the jury. the fact that the police did not do their job and locking down the place, and the family was parading around in the house, will result in a mistrial. they cant use anything from the house in the case. it;s all tampered with. and the family should be in jail for distraction of evidence. (but that is why i know it's a hoax) <!-- s --><!-- s -->
there is nothing that proves that he was in that house. what the people say is just he said she said to a lot of people, it is the test, fingerprints , hair samples,ect, that make the trail. if they try to use anything from the house in the trail they will be breaking the law.
ahahha love it <!-- s:D -->:D<!-- s:D -->
why wouldn't murry's team use the scene not being secured as a line of defense from the get go?
"And it supports his theory that a "Mr X" injected Jacko with a lethal dose of Propofol - before stealing more than a million dollars of his cash and fleeing.
Police will not be able to disprove Murray easily because in another twist they have LOST 24 hours of CCTV footage from Jacko's mansion that would have shown exactly who was inside when he died.
A source close to the case told the News of the World: "The mystery fingerprints are the biggest breakthrough for Murray so far. If it is handled right it would mean a jury cannot convict him. "
Before it was Michael who injected fatal dose himself. Now it is Mr.X who's fingerprints found just now...... since LAPD "lost" tapes.
Since it is a hoax, then everything goes in order so no one would be convicted.
BTW, FBI can find whos fingerprints are those within 24 hours. Are they going to check that out or maybe FBI will "lose" fingerprints.
Even with murder theory, all this looks crap.
"And it supports his theory that a "Mr X" injected Jacko with a lethal dose of Propofol - before stealing more than a million dollars of his cash and fleeing.
Police will not be able to disprove Murray easily because in another twist they have LOST 24 hours of CCTV footage from Jacko's mansion that would have shown exactly who was inside when he died.
A source close to the case told the News of the World: "The mystery fingerprints are the biggest breakthrough for Murray so far. If it is handled right it would mean a jury cannot convict him. "
Before it was Michael who injected fatal dose himself. Now it is Mr.X who's fingerprints found just now...... since LAPD "lost" tapes.
Since it is a hoax, then everything goes in order so no one would be convicted.
BTW, FBI can find whos fingerprints are those within 24 hours. Are they going to check that out or maybe FBI will "lose" fingerprints.
Even with murder theory, all this looks crap.
That's what I find weird, with all this new technology, they say the FBI can see through your roof by satelite, you mean to say they cannot find the finger print on the syringe. Ma give me a break? All a hoax.. They have to say that now so to prepare us that Murray will not go to jail.. Michael is coming home soon..
By CAROLINE GRANT
<!-- m -->http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/ne ... d-him.html<!-- m -->
Published: Today
MYSTERY fingerprints on the syringe that killed Michael Jackson were being investigated - amid claims they point to an intruder murdering the superstar.
The prints are not those of Jacko's doctor Conrad Murray, who faces trial next month despite always denying he gave the singer a lethal jab of sedative.
Dr Murray, 57, says it backs his theory a robber crept into the Los Angeles home of the Thriller star, 50, and swiped a million dollars.
The prints do not match any member of Jacko's family or staff.
A source said of the medic's looming trial for involuntary manslaughter: "A jury cannot convict.
"Murray and Michael were the only ones supposedly at the house at the time, but the prints point to someone else using the fatal syringe."
Murray's jubilant legal team will insist to jurors: "If the print doesn't fit, you must acquit."
By CAROLINE GRANT
<!-- m -->http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/ne ... d-him.html<!-- m -->
Published: Today
MYSTERY fingerprints on the syringe that killed Michael Jackson were being investigated - amid claims they point to an intruder murdering the superstar.
The prints are not those of Jacko's doctor Conrad Murray, who faces trial next month despite always denying he gave the singer a lethal jab of sedative.
Dr Murray, 57, says it backs his theory a robber crept into the Los Angeles home of the Thriller star, 50, and swiped a million dollars.
The prints do not match any member of Jacko's family or staff.
A source said of the medic's looming trial for involuntary manslaughter: "A jury cannot convict.
"Murray and Michael were the only ones supposedly at the house at the time, but the prints point to someone else using the fatal syringe."
Murray's jubilant legal team will insist to jurors: "If the print doesn't fit, you must acquit."
Ok this is my theory, if an intruder killed Michael, he must know Michael, and has gone to the house several times and knows where Michael room is and has stashed the money. I for eg: never been to Michael's house, do not know where his room is, that house was guarded with bodyguards, cooks children, and Murray, so how can i get in with security and start looking for Michael's room and the money. I will never end. Did you see the size of that house? A normal theif and killer will not be able to do so. He would have been caught. If and I say If Michael was murdered this was done by an insider.
This is a theory to throw us off coarse. Michael is alive and now they have to find a way to acquit Murray, they will not let him go to jail for no reason. Michael will never do that to an innocent man God bless.
Guys, this is like in a movie! We don't know who killed until the end!
Put your 3d hoax glasses on and keep watching!
<TMZ is also a tabloid trash, yet we all follow it every day>
it does play like a movie scrip. We don't know who is the bad guy until the very end.
It is quite a possibility to say that Mr. X gave the fatal dose and the camera footage is lost and no one can find him. And the story is being run from a tabloid to test the waters.
We have to wait for the trial.
"And it supports his theory that a "Mr X" injected Jacko with a lethal dose of Propofol - before stealing more than a million dollars of his cash and fleeing.
Police will not be able to disprove Murray easily because in another twist they have LOST 24 hours of CCTV footage from Jacko's mansion that would have shown exactly who was inside when he died.
A source close to the case told the News of the World: "The mystery fingerprints are the biggest breakthrough for Murray so far. If it is handled right it would mean a jury cannot convict him. "
Before it was Michael who injected fatal dose himself. Now it is Mr.X who's fingerprints found just now...... since LAPD "lost" tapes.
Since it is a hoax, then everything goes in order so no one would be convicted.
BTW, FBI can find whos fingerprints are those within 24 hours. Are they going to check that out or maybe FBI will "lose" fingerprints.
Even with murder theory, all this looks crap.
That's what I find weird, with all this new technology, they say the FBI can see through your roof by satelite, you mean to say they cannot find the finger print on the syringe. Ma give me a break? All a hoax.. They have to say that now so to prepare us that Murray will not go to jail.. Michael is coming home soon..
Step by step media is preparing the stage, the global audience, to watch Conrad Murray walk free, clear from any accusations!
By CAROLINE GRANT
<!-- m -->http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/ne ... d-him.html<!-- m -->
Published: Today
MYSTERY fingerprints on the syringe that killed Michael Jackson were being investigated - amid claims they point to an intruder murdering the superstar.
<!-- s --><!-- s --> <!-- s --><!-- s --> 1. Intruder I suppose was after $$, then why kill Michael and HOW HE/SHE KNEW WHERE MONEY IS?
2. WHERE WERE SECURITY, BODY GUARDS, or Murray, and OTHERS IN THAT HOUSE? Everybody were sleeping under Propofol? 3. IF SUPPOSEDLY LAPD HAD TAPES IN T HE BEGINNING, "BEFORE THEY LOST IT", THEN LAPD SHOULD HAVE SEEN INTRUDER, WHY THIS ACCUSATION,INVESTIGATION AND PRELIM WITH MURRAY?
Nothing is add up.
By CAROLINE GRANT
<!-- m -->http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/ne ... d-him.html<!-- m -->
Published: Today
MYSTERY fingerprints on the syringe that killed Michael Jackson were being investigated - amid claims they point to an intruder murdering the superstar.
<!-- s --><!-- s --> <!-- s --><!-- s --> 1. Intruder I suppose was after $$, then why kill Michael and HOW HE/SHE KNEW WHERE MONEY IS?
2. WHERE WERE SECURITY, BODY GUARDS, or Murray, and OTHERS IN THAT HOUSE? Everybody were sleeping under Propofol? 3. IF SUPPOSEDLY LAPD HAD TAPES IN T HE BEGINNING, "BEFORE THEY LOST IT", THEN LAPD SHOULD HAVE SEEN INTRUDER, WHY THIS ACCUSATION,INVESTIGATION AND PRELIM WITH MURRAY?
Nothing is add up.
One more thing I forgot to write 4. MURRAY FINGERPRINTS SHOULD NOT HAVE BEEN ON SYRINGE BECAUSE HE SUPPOSE TO WEAR GLOVES WORKING WITH IV, INJECTIONS ON THE PATIENT.
I don't think 'Mr X' fingerprints will help Murray to walk because they can just say Murray was an accomplice.
They can say whatever they want, but reasonable doubt means aqcuittal.
"For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places."
So how do they know which syringe was used to administer the fatal dose? Is it labeled "syringe used to administer fatal dose"? If not, how can they tell? Just because it's one they found at the scene doesn't mean it's the one that supposedly killed MJ. There was apparently a whole box of syringes there and who knows how long the syringe they found had been lying around. <!-- s:roll: -->:roll:<!-- s:roll: --> If this is what they are going with then I'm convinced I could do a better job of investigating than these people. I think they should call up the cast from the tv series CSI and get some pointers. <!-- s --><!-- s -->
If it's really true that Murray's fingerprints aren't on the "fatal syringe", then I suspect this will lead to an acquittal. Although for some reason, I still keep feeling like there isn't even going to be trial.
News of the World... I remember years back they had a cover story "Mermaid Found in Tuna Sandwich". It was literally a Barbie between two pieces of bread.
I'm really not inclined to put any credence in an article by that publication...
I think you are thinking of a different tabloid... not the UK one.
News of the World... I remember years back they had a cover story "Mermaid Found in Tuna Sandwich". It was literally a Barbie between two pieces of bread.
I'm really not inclined to put any credence in an article by that publication...
<!-- s --><!-- s --> <!-- s --><!-- s --> <!-- s --><!-- s -->
We should be glad that they didn't find Michael in a hotdog. <!-- s --><!-- s -->
Yet... you know it's only a matter of time! <!-- s --><!-- s -->
Comments
What if these fingerprints were deliberately planted to cause doubt and confusion?
Im betting these fingerprints dont match any of the main players that we know, and we may probably never know.
Souza mentioned someone had a theory that a false hand was used to plant fingerprints. Wouldnt be impossible, i suppose.
there is nothing that proves that he was in that house. what the people say is just he said she said to a lot of people, it is the test, fingerprints , hair samples,ect, that make the trail. if they try to use anything from the house in the trail they will be breaking the law.
ahahha love it <!-- s:D -->:D<!-- s:D -->
just considering all angles here (i do not believe he's dead at all) maybe whoever it was had to abruptly leave after he/she heard Murray flushing the toilet and returning. <!-- s:shock: -->:shock:<!-- s:shock: -->
I found this, how someone can implant other fingerprints. It could be that tampered with the evidence. If you read this it will be more explicit. If this is not what you mean Souza I cannot find what you are trying to say.
<!-- m -->http://www.wikihow.com/Fake-Fingerprints<!-- m -->
In order to fake a fingerprint, one needs an original first. Latent fingerprints are nothing but fat and sweat on touched items. Thus to retrieve someone else's fingerprint (in this case the fingerprint you want to forge) one should rely on well tested forensic research methods. Which is what's to be explained here.
Steps1 Find some good counterfeits. A good source of originals for our counterfeits are glasses, doorknobs and glossy paper. The standard method of forensic research makes them visible: Sprinkling it with colored powder, which sticks to the fat.
Biometric AuthenticationWV: Leader in Competitive Global Biometrics Market, Opportunities.
<!-- m -->http://www.biometricswv.com<!-- m -->
2 Try something related to superglue. Another solution involves Cyanoacrylat, the main ingredient of superglue. A small amount thereof is poured into a bottlecap, which is then turned upside down and put over the fingerprint.
The Cyanoacrylat gasses out and reacts with the fat residue to a solid, white substance
3 Get a digital reproduction. The further treatment involves scanning/photographing (Figure 5) and a bit of graphical refurbishment.
The goal is to get an exact image of the fingerprint, for further use as mold, out of which the dummy is made. The easiest way is to print the image on a transparency slide (the ones normally used for an overhead projector) with a laser printer. The toner forms a relief, which is later used similar to letter press printing. Wood glue is suitable for producing the dummy.
4 Use a small dash of glycerene to optimize humidity and workability. After thorough mixing, the dummy gets coated with a thin layer of the compound.
5 After the glue has dried (Figure 10), pull off the foil (Figure 11) and cut it to finger size.
6 Glue the counterfeit to your own finger. Theatrical glue is used to glue the dummy onto the own finger. The new identity is ready!
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/8400222.stm
Encyclopedia of Biometrics
http://books.google.de/books?id=0bQbOYVULQcC&pg=PA459&lpg=PA459&dq=fingerprints+fake+hands&source=bl&ots=hGziXcsL7A&sig=8MX5Iop-dPrsBRHcM0BX6_8k9A0&hl=en&ei=2FirTbfSMc6eOpb_yNkJ&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=3&ved=0CCEQ6AEwAg#v=onepage&q=fingerprints%20fake%20hands&f=false
Fingerprint generation
http://biolab.csr.unibo.it/research.asp?organize=Activities&select=&selObj=12&pathSubj=111||12&
Okay, it is easy to say I did expect this news or gossip or whatever you call it. So I can laugh about it or I can let my imagination flow and start to make a theory out of it. Although Murray is innocent, there must be a trial, because it is leading part of the hoax which should draw massive media attention in order to bring out MJ's message expressed in a revealing movie.
My - perhaps a bit too imaginary - theory is that the scenario could be that an "unknown" person managed to sneak into the house and supposedly killed MJ by using the propofol filled syringe and stole the cash. "Unfortunately", we missed the part of the sneaking intruder on tape <!-- s;) -->;)<!-- s;) --> . I remember the TMZ article dated 01/25/2011 'Dr. Murray -- Dead Body Found in Courthouse Sweep' <!-- l -->viewtopic.php?f=172&t=17531&hilit=sweep<!-- l -->, and I was thinking somehow the dead body must be a part of the puzzle. The found corpse must have been the intruder who "killed" MJ. Probably he was killed because of the money. This is all a hoax movie scenario. So in reality MJ is NOT killed, Murray is innocent and there was no intruder, but it has been made up to create a scapegoat. And they all live happily ever after...
Police will not be able to disprove Murray easily because in another twist they have LOST 24 hours of CCTV footage from Jacko's mansion that would have shown exactly who was inside when he died.
A source close to the case told the News of the World: "The mystery fingerprints are the biggest breakthrough for Murray so far. If it is handled right it would mean a jury cannot convict him. "
Before it was Michael who injected fatal dose himself. Now it is Mr.X who's fingerprints found just now...... since LAPD "lost" tapes.
Since it is a hoax, then everything goes in order so no one would be convicted.
BTW, FBI can find whos fingerprints are those within 24 hours. Are they going to check that out or maybe FBI will "lose" fingerprints.
Even with murder theory, all this looks crap.
That's what I find weird, with all this new technology, they say the FBI can see through your roof by satelite, you mean to say they cannot find the finger print on the syringe. Ma give me a break? All a hoax.. They have to say that now so to prepare us that Murray will not go to jail.. Michael is coming home soon..
By CAROLINE GRANT
<!-- m -->http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/ne ... d-him.html<!-- m -->
Published: Today
MYSTERY fingerprints on the syringe that killed Michael Jackson were being investigated - amid claims they point to an intruder murdering the superstar.
The prints are not those of Jacko's doctor Conrad Murray, who faces trial next month despite always denying he gave the singer a lethal jab of sedative.
Dr Murray, 57, says it backs his theory a robber crept into the Los Angeles home of the Thriller star, 50, and swiped a million dollars.
The prints do not match any member of Jacko's family or staff.
A source said of the medic's looming trial for involuntary manslaughter: "A jury cannot convict.
"Murray and Michael were the only ones supposedly at the house at the time, but the prints point to someone else using the fatal syringe."
Murray's jubilant legal team will insist to jurors: "If the print doesn't fit, you must acquit."
Ok this is my theory, if an intruder killed Michael, he must know Michael, and has gone to the house several times and knows where Michael room is and has stashed the money. I for eg: never been to Michael's house, do not know where his room is, that house was guarded with bodyguards, cooks children, and Murray, so how can i get in with security and start looking for Michael's room and the money. I will never end. Did you see the size of that house? A normal theif and killer will not be able to do so. He would have been caught. If and I say If Michael was murdered this was done by an insider.
This is a theory to throw us off coarse. Michael is alive and now they have to find a way to acquit Murray, they will not let him go to jail for no reason. Michael will never do that to an innocent man God bless.
Guys, this is like in a movie! We don't know who killed until the end!
Put your 3d hoax glasses on and keep watching!
<TMZ is also a tabloid trash, yet we all follow it every day>
it does play like a movie scrip. We don't know who is the bad guy until the very end.
It is quite a possibility to say that Mr. X gave the fatal dose and the camera footage is lost and no one can find him. And the story is being run from a tabloid to test the waters.
We have to wait for the trial.
Step by step media is preparing the stage, the global audience, to watch Conrad Murray walk free, clear from any accusations!
<!-- s
2. WHERE WERE SECURITY, BODY GUARDS, or Murray, and OTHERS IN THAT HOUSE? Everybody were sleeping under Propofol? 3. IF SUPPOSEDLY LAPD HAD TAPES IN T HE BEGINNING, "BEFORE THEY LOST IT", THEN LAPD SHOULD HAVE SEEN INTRUDER, WHY THIS ACCUSATION,INVESTIGATION AND PRELIM WITH MURRAY?
Nothing is add up.
They can say whatever they want, but reasonable doubt means aqcuittal.
"For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places."Who told the media that MJ had cash stashed in the house ????
Was it members of the family ???
No, the US one. I saw it in Cali.
Yet... you know it's only a matter of time! <!-- s
I remember La Toya saying that