@MJonmind - you ask a very good question - what's the car doing in that video?? Doesn't seem to belong in that short movie. I've always found it odd. And it seems to be missing a wheel??<br />Also interesting that in the dance moment starting from around 3:50 there are the 6 men and Michael is in the middle of them, being the seventh one.<br />Was Michael suffering of that Mesia syndrom or it really is something about him..are we really living those times....
@mjonmind. thank you for your last post. i am still sitting on a few thoughts about what you wrote and trying to understand what i feel / think about them.<br /><br />i was interested by your interpretation of WYBT. i always translated that verse as:<br /><br />Hold me, like the river Jordan (Jesus was baptised in the River Jordan as you know - therefore MJ trying to parallel a Baptism / dedication of his own body / life to God) <br /><br />And I will then say to thee, You are my Friend (As we know from bible, Baptism constitutes friendship with God)<br /><br /><br />i always thought this verse was speaking of Michael's dedicating his or desire to dedicate his bod / life to loving God, speaking of God and living with God as his focus in life, so as to become his friend.<br /><br /><br />your interpreation is interesting and is something for me to think about further. thank you<br /><br /><br /><br />also, can i please clarify with you re: your last post, am I right in thinking that in all instances that you wrote michael, you are referring to the ark angel, and in all instances that you are refering to michael jackson you refer to him as MJ. i just want to make sure i am reading your post the way you intend for it to be percieved.<br /><br /><br />*hugs*
Ok I'm glad I asked, as that is what I thought I took. Thank you.<br /><br /><br /> :smiley_abuv: each members right to have a theory.<br /><br /><br />You know how I feel so I won't go there to uphold peace.<br /><br /><br />Hugs
Not sure if this is on topic or off, but it seems to fit so I will throw it out there.<br /><br />For those who don't believe MJ is more then just a mortal man, I believe that at least MJ believes he is more then just that. The lyrics of Cry make it quite clear themselves, particularly the chorus:<br /><br />"You can change the world/I can't do it by myself,<br />You can touch the sky/gonna take somebody's help,<br />You're the chosen one/I'm gonna need some kind of sign"<br /><br />It matters not to me that R. Kelly wrote this song (allegedly). What matters to me is that MJ chose to sing it, approved (obviously, by singing it) of the written lyrics, and chose to include it on his hoax album (Invincible). This, to me, indicates that MJ believes, truly, that he is the chosen one.
<br />Thanks for your kind comments! :beerchug:<br /><br />Gina,<br />
Also interesting that in the dance moment starting from around 3:50 there are the 6 men and Michael is in the middle of them, being the seventh one.
<br />That's what I mentioned in my post, the 6 priests (dancers) who carried the Ark, and the 'Ark' in the middle.<br />
<br />Oh yes, sorry, I am terribly tired these days, can't even think straight.<br />You made me watch the video again from another perspective. Like this:<br />
<br />Not sure if this is on topic or off, but it seems to fit so I will throw it out there.<br /><br />For those who don't believe MJ is more then just a mortal man, I believe that at least MJ believes he is more then just that. The lyrics of Cry make it quite clear themselves, particularly the chorus:<br /><br />"You can change the world/I can't do it by myself,<br />You can touch the sky/gonna take somebody's help,<br />You're the chosen one/I'm gonna need some kind of sign"<br /><br />It matters not to me that R. Kelly wrote this song (allegedly). What matters to me is that MJ chose to sing it, approved (obviously, by singing it) of the written lyrics, and chose to include it on his hoax album (Invincible). This, to me, indicates that MJ believes, truly, that he is the chosen one.<br />
<br />Yes, that is why he ordered some strange pictures of himself. Arnold Klein posted a few in a row yesterday on fb, one of them I've never seen before:<br /><br />Michael, being such a sensitive and smart person, was able to perceive what other people do not realize in a lifetime. Maybe Michael reached that place inside where we are all like God, that little spark of divinity that exists in every human. And he probably was searching for answers to why he was what he was, why he had the destiny that he had, probably feeling compelled to live up to the gifts God gave to him, to match God's expectations from him. Who knows....
wasnt going to continue down this line, as i dont want to debate especially on this thread. i disagree, so simply no point to debate it and also repect others for having their opinions. but, since bec's post, i'd really like to make another comment and then i'll leave it at that with my opinion in tow, and respectfully leave MJonmind, with hers...<br /><br />although i dont believe MJ is the chosen one, michael the arc angel, the ark, or other, i AGREE and do believe that MJ may feel he is the chosen one, so i completely agree with your last post bec. and when i think of the dance moves, the poses, the art work that was commissioned, the lyrics, that does fit. i have always thought that especially during the dangerous to invincible era.<br /><br /><br />i personally dont believe MJ is THE chosen one as in equal to or the next christ, but do believe he is a 'chosen' one in (but still in want of a better phrase. perhaps a self appointed chosen one) in terms of being the only person on earth who can command such a great following / fan base and influence as he does. (We know he trancends, racial, sexual and religious barriers and has more worldwide followers than other iconic people of history, with the exception of christ.) i honestly to believe in my heart that he is using his position through song, lyrics, dance, and now more importantly hoax to draw peoples attention to God and the bible and bible prophecy that is soon to be fulfilled...<br /><br />i believe he is human and does not have supernatural / angelic make up. but while i dont agree that he is the chosen one as in the next christ or the arc angel, i do believe he is THE perfect person to raise attention, awareness and draw people to look to God. so in a way i agree that he is the chosen one (self appointed) amongst everyone / anyone (in this era, not incl Jesus) who can have the largest influence on a global scale in a bid to "make it happen"<br /><br />but ultimately, i must say this out of respect for christ and his sacrifice of dying for the human race, that personally i believe as per the bible, that salvation is through jesus christ, not michael.<br /><br />hope this makes sence and is not disrespectful to anyone elses beliefs or MJ himself. i tried hard to articulate myself properly and respectfully.<br /><br /><br /> :smiley-vault-misc-150:<br />
<br />Everything that Aussie said....[size=18pt]+ 1[/size]<br />
[size=18pt]+ 4[/size]<br /><br /><br />But even though I agree with everything Aussie perfectly expressed here^^, I still feel the need to add that Michael truly HAS something ANGELIC in him!! through his natural generosity and kindness, incredible magnetism, numerous talents and purely, angelic beauty inside and out!<br />And already these are so many divine gifts that only God could have decided to bless one person with. Michael has always been aware of all this ^^ and grateful to God for everything, and this is where I agree with what Bec said about Michael who probably and why not say it logically, thinks of himself he's more then just a mortal man, taking into account everything mentioned above ^^.
@MJonMind: your analysis of Will You Be there video is fantastic!! Thank you for "translating" it so well!! I t really makes a LOT of sense the way you put it and in relation to The Signs! <br />Little by little, we discover the meaning of those Signs too... impossible to "digest" at the beginning, now, as tIME goes by we learn how to understand and how to interpret them.<br /><br />Will You Be There is one of the most beautiful songs ever!<br />But I haven't quite listened to it ever since June 2009... I kind of avoided it ... lol They used to play this song a lot those days when I was still crying,thinking that he died. Therefore, it has gained too much sadness in my "auditory memory" if I can say so... At one point I had found myself switching off the radio or stopping certain videos when I heard this song... just because it reminded me of some really hard moments...and it always makes me cry even though now I know he's alive! It still makes me cry.... can't help it.
- thanks for your comments all :icon_e_smile:<br /><br /><br />- i still maintain that WYBT (first verse) referrs to baptism in jordan river to become gods friend - not the ark. (see my post, not the last one, the one before that) but again, thats jus personal opinion, not trying to debate it with anyone.<br /><br />- as for the picture that Gina posted up, michael with what appears to be a bride, this reminds me of what i have read in revelation about christs bride being adorned for him. (not that it is a literal bride) i wonder if this is what MJ was trying to illude in this picture, again giving ammunition for some to think he is archangel / ark / next christ, etc, or give ammunition to think, he thinks he is archangel / ark / next christ....<br /><br /><br />
For those who don't believe MJ is more then just a mortal man, I believe that [size=12pt]at least MJ believes he is more[/size] then just that. The lyrics of Cry make it quite clear themselves, particularly the chorus:<br /><br />"You can change the world/I can't do it by myself,<br />You can touch the sky/gonna take somebody's help,<br />You're the chosen one/I'm gonna need some kind of sign"
<br />Bec, I agree. And it is also a strong proof for me that Back, Front, TS, The Sign are all MJ or someone together with MJ, because they all agree on this subtle topic. Fakers don't go near this subject.<br /><br />And Aussie your post #135 is very good! I'm glad this aspect is being talked about instead of denying that he is claiming this.<br /><br />For me that is precisely the kind of challenge of MJ--namely, is what he thinks of himself, what the actual truth is. In other words, is it what the Creator of the Universe has in mind for a fulfillment of Scripture, and for our planet, or are the public right in saying he was a has-been gifted eccentric. <br /><br />Then there are those that would even claim the Illuminati are preparing Michael to be the Anti-Christ or false Messiah to appear in the clouds via holograms (project blue-beam). Which I don't believe is true, but I thought about that possibility.<br /><br />It brings to mind the fact that many Christians have said about Jesus, that he was either telling the truth about who he was, or he was deluded and only THOUGHT he was the Messiah, the Christ. Now if MJ only thinks he is Special, then it is indeed sad, BUT what IF he is telling the truth. The religious leaders who knew Old testament well, did not understand when he came the first time, but do all the religious leaders of our day understand any better the grand truths. I do believe that MJ is saying that he is the Messiah subtley, and is NOT denying it. Much more could be written on this subject. Front/TS/MJ have all said the history books will change and be re-written. I believe this special identity (or believing it) was a SECRET that MJ carried inside himself, that he would/could never talk about openly, but only express poetically and symbolically throughout his life. I believe Katherine knows as well, and she carries this quietly.<br /><br />Schmuley said that MJ had a messiah complex –meaning he thought he was the Messiah. In a video that I posted a while back of Bashir, he says that many fans consider Michael to be some kind of a Messiah (which he thought was ridiculous). Randy Philips said he thought MJ was the most Christ-like person he had ever met. Jarvis Cocker went on stage to protest because he thought it was offensive that MJ was saying he was Jesus in the Brit awards. Yes, and paintings he commissioned of himself as Jesus or Messiah. There are countless other snippets of ways/places. Of course MJ publicly said about 5 times that he was not Jesus, but only trying to be ‘LIKE’ Jesus. Interesting that The Sign stresses the word ‘like’ as well. It’s an VERY interesting way he describes the comparison.<br /><br />Sign #1<br />
Finally, we need to understand what the name “Michael” means (see Hebrew #4317). The last part, El, means “God” (see Hebrew #410; Matthew 27:41). [size=12pt]Today, the name Michael is frequently abbreviated as “Mike”; and with just one letter changed, you have the word “like.”[/size] The full name, Michael, means “like God”—or one who is like God; Jesus could sit on the throne, just “like God” (the Father). And this is exactly what Lucifer wanted; he planned to usurp the position of Michael the archangel, and become “like the most High” (like God).
<br /><br />I just don't know in all honesty where this leaves Front/TS/The Sign in everyone's mind. It makes him a sad, deluded but genius, character for some. I've really agonized over this for 3 years, and I really believe there's something Special there, though I admit I could be mistaken and duped. Nobody wants to be deceived or gullible.<br /><br />In my heart I do not see a bearded sandal & robe-wearing Caucasian Jesus appearing in the clouds the way the Bible describes and Christians expect. I believe there are other layers to the Bible that connect to ancient Egypt and UFO and ET involvement. I think MJ knows things mankind doesn't know about our future. I believe God's got unusual unexpected twists to the story, and those who think they know may be very surprised. <br /><br />So finally, I will say that I totally respect all of you who reject MJ/Messiah thinking, and can understand it.
MJonmind, I agree with a lot of what you've said and with what Aussie and others have said.<br /><br />I also wonder about Front/TS/The Sign and MJ. It's all connected, I'm pretty sure most can agree that much is so. MJ may not be the Messiah but he could be a chosen one of sorts. Like Ron Wyatt maybe. How would he have been able to find the physical evidence of Biblical stories if he had not been chosen? I think there could be some people in the world who have roles they are/were destined to fulfill.
mjonmind, i want to thank you for sharing your incredibly perfonal feelings about this. i know its hard.. though you and i differ on opnion here, i can assure you this is the one area i am stuggling with at the moment and it often agonises me, because it goes against what i know and feel in my heart about jesus. my heart goes out to you and if its any consolation, we are in a similar situation with our feelings and emotions on this. <br /><br /> :bearhug:<br /><br /><br />NB: i always imagine that when MJ/TS/Front talk about history books that he is speaking of wiki, encyclopeadeas, obituraries, news articles that will need to retracted and rewritten after DH is revealed and all notices and mentions of MJs death will need to be edited... dunno. could be wrong.... i also have to disagree on your comment on Katherine. <br /><br /><br />but the main reason I replied was to say i feel for you and understand... its the same thing i am trying to work out, regards to how i feel and think about it... and its a doosie and plays with my head at times too...<br /><br />Love to you x<br />
@ bec, you were right the other day when you mentioned math and being the most logical / reliable / predictable part of the hoax. i thought of the points we are currently discussing in this thread, when i read that comment of yours in the other thread earlier this week...<br /><br /><br />math = easy to accept<br />evidence = easy to accept <br />facts = easy to accept<br />trial debunking = easy to accept<br /><br />throw religion / god / ET's / bible interpretation.... well.. thats when it gets messy and difficult for me....<br /><br /> :over-react-smiley:
I think we are all, collective, a whole lot more in agreement then disagreement on this subject.<br /><br />My thoughts on Jesus Christ are less religious and more historical/sociological so believe it or not, I do tend to agree with you, MJonmind, on the minor details of this theory.<br /><br />I concede the possibility that in 200 years, people just might be worshiping MJ as the new age deity and JC will be the stuff of old legend like Moses.<br /><br />Crazy, I know.
MJ may not be the Messiah but he could be a chosen one of sorts. Like Ron Wyatt maybe. How would he have been able to find the physical evidence of Biblical stories if he had not been chosen? I think there could be some people in the world who have roles they are/were destined to fulfill.
<br /><br />Initially, I thought Ron Wyatt was just a quack/fraudster. And the way he described his arm jerking out from his side pointing to where the Ark was located made me just laugh. The blood with half the chromosomes was just plain silly—like who could make this stuff up. And then TS comes along and says it’s supposed to be true. Talk about my eyeballs going boing out of my head! So as I read and examined everything, I started thinking maybe it could have happened. So if RW’s story is true, then that most certainly is a miraculous sign. Is it from Satan, and he’s only discovered a fake Ark for deceiving the nations, OR is it from God the Creator. Most Christians aren’t expecting the Ark to have any play in end-times.<br /><br />I think that MJ is going to have to ultimately provide some clearly supernatural elements to provide the convincing signs that he is called from God, and it can’t just be clever technology, genius human creativity, or demonic signs and wonders. Was the announcement of the revealing of the Ark of the Covenant by the Ethiopian priest, and MJ’s hoax death on the same day, a coincidence, a planned aspect by MJ, or possibly a sign from God. IDK We’ll have to wait and see if supernatural events are forth-coming.<br /><br />Bec<br />
I concede the possibility that in 200 years, people just might be worshiping MJ as the new age deity and JC will be the stuff of old legend like Moses.
<br />Yes, I could too. The new Following would join the thousands of other world religions/cults/beliefs whatever you want to call them.<br /><br />I find it interesting that there could/would be so many reactions to MJ having a Special calling:<br /><br />Athiests don’t believe there’s a divine being in charge, or guiding history, or that the Bible is God’s message to mankind. They think the future could go in any direction, and that mankind can evolve to create a better world for themselves. Correct me if that’s inaccurate. So if MJ claims to be the Messiah, to them it really is either a joke or a human arising to help the planet. No real problem to them if he claims to be another Jesus type.<br /><br />Muslims expect the Madhi or a Muslim Messiah, which is a different coming anointed One. Christians would say theirs is a false one, and Muslims would say the Christian type is false, and round it goes. So for Muslim, they would strongly reject MJ as Messiah because MJ apparently did not convert to Islam, and certainly MJ, Front and TS seem to only quote from the Bible.<br /><br />Hindus, Buddhists, and misc. faiths would likely reject MJ as their own chosen One, if he is not teaching their group’s doctrine. Just guessing.<br /><br />General Theists those who believe in a Creator but reject any of the main religions as being the only way, would likely have little or no problem with MJ claiming special status, and would just wait and see. <br /><br />Some MJ fans are so in love with him, that for them he is Everything, no matter what anyone says to the contrary. He is their 'Messiah' already.<br /><br />Orthodox devout Christians are the group that would have the most difficulty with MJ as a Messiah, because they feel they already have one, who doesn’t seem to look anything like MJ. Their Jesus is not replaceable; the position is not open for applicants. They would probably get quite angry about it even, the ones I know and my family. The Bible (Jesus) teaches that there will be many claiming to be the Christ in End times, in addition to the ultra bad claim of the Anti-Christ himself. Over the 2 thousand years since Jesus, there have probably been thousands of people who have claimed some kind of special status, like prophet, seer, messiah, or whatever. They have ALL eventually died and most are forgotten. MJ’s not getting any younger himself. I don’t think any of these wannabe prophets/messiahs can hold a candle to the worldwide status and clout MJ has though. <br />In addition, most Christians probably reject Ron Wyatt’s claims as well IDK. <br /><br />So it’s all going to boil down to what MJ has planned to do in the future, such as this BAM, and what it all involves. The Sign links the Ark to End Times, and subtley to MJ, and I feel Front/TS/Back link BAM to End Times or EOW. It all seems inter-related in this hoax, at least that’s how I read it. It’s going to be interesting the next months/years. Absolutely ANYTHING can happen, and I will for sure Keep Watching! I believe in the Bible and I don't in a way; I'm open to possibilities. Mostly I listen to what my heart tells me as I read, observe, experience. What if EVERYTHING we've been taught in history is a lie, and we humans have been toyed with. I'm literally choosing to trust MJ in this, because I don't have confidence in any other current 'end time' options. But that's just me. Should I find out in the end that MJ was just putting on a fabulous show, The Greatest Show on Earth, then I will enjoy it, do my happy dancing, and then move on from there with my life...ease on down the road. Know what I mean? I won't have lost anything!! :Michael_Jackson_dancing_smile<br /><br />Gina, the kitty in that picture is very wise! :icon_lol:
I don't know what to believe. It is possible that Michael is The chosen one, it is possible that he is not, but it is possible that he is.<br />But I think of another scenario:<br /><br />Maybe Michael made a goal for himself to be as much like God as he could, to raise above his human condition and follow Jesus' demand that we should all try to be perfect like our Father in Heaven is perfect. And maybe Michael tried to cultivate this perfection until the point where he started to believe in it. <br />Maybe he just tried to apply that saying "Fake it, fake it until you make it".<br />Maybe he casted himself in that role in real life, like for example I would say: from tomorrow I will be a doctor, and start believing with all my being that I am a doctor. Hence his feelings that he is the chosen one.
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