It's Her, I believe you are very perceptive and I agree that your theory is sound.
Monster :01 very first sound on the track is Thriller :01 very first sound on the track. Do you hear it? Who else knows that? For many of us that sound is ingrained very very deeply in our subconscious. The fans know that. And Michael knows that.
I already thought I heard something familiar in there. Will listen again tomorrow.
You have to listen to the digital version turned up fairly loud. Sounds like the creaking door opening to Thriller at the *very* beginning and then quickly you realize it's not a door creak it's wind blowing.
Breaking News static opening is similar but it's not the exact soundbyte like it is in Monster.
There's so much stuff in this album, I need a note pad while listening to record it all but I get wrapped up in Enjoying Michael.
I DO hear it. It is very faint. But on some subconscious level, the first thing I thought of WAS THRILLER, when I heard Monster begin, so like you say, it IS imprinted in the deep of all our minds! <!-- s8-) -->8-)<!-- s8-) --> <!-- s --><!-- s -->
I totally agree with you. It something about the eyes. Also, I get the feeling it's not him. I'd read Sousa and Mo blog of their conversation with Jennifer Batten and she stated that Michael didn't rehearse as much on the Dangerous or History tour as he did with the Bad tour. If you notice Bucharest and Copenhagen concerts his size is different.
Yeah, I agree. I think it's the eyes and body shape. He seems taller in those two tours than in his previous ones.
I am leaning toward the informal theory that something happened between Bad and Dangerous too. Frank Dileo was also let go and everyone thought that was strange. Also, all the memorial and burial pictures were from that era which have always led many of us believe that there was something more to that than just MJ directing the hoax. And now the live from Bucharest could be trying to give a similar clue. I really wish we could solve this one?? I would be able to sleep at night!
I have about 13 of the History tour concerts on DVD and if you watch each one you notice that in most you have a nice healthy and deliciously filled out Michael and then there are a couple where you suddenly see him come out and his dancing is all off, he's terribly thinner and does not look like the same guy at all and it has always made me go Hmmmm but with the Dangerous era Bucharest concert I see no one but Michael except for the ending with the rocket man switch bit.
I have no doubt it was Michael in Bucharest 1992.
I don't think he is in Bucharest now......in fact he could be anywhere if he is alive......maybe in London..... or maybe he is just 2 meters under the groud
Lately I've been leaning to a theory... MJ has a twin. <!-- s:shock: -->:shock:<!-- s:shock: -->
I totally agree with you. When you view the concerts, you will notice the facial features are different. I'd noticed the face is more round and the eyes look smaller. Have you watched Flem 18 videos? The videos make you think different. Also, I read Souza and Mo's blog interview with Jennifer Batten. She said that Michael didn't rehearse that much on the Dangerous or History tour as he did during the Bad tour. She also noticed when he would leave the stage, he would use oxygen. I'd read article after June 25th, someone said had talked about MJ's 30th anniversary concert in New York. The person noticed that MJ was tired. They said MJ never gets tired like that. They also indicated to look at the Bucharest and Copenhagen concerts. Especially when he is singing "You are not alone."
That all goes with what I am saying about the HIStory tour concerts. There is a hot well nourished looking MJ and then there is one that looks like he is ill or possibly *and I sooo hate to say this* on some sort of medication. My husband noticed it too and said oh where he looks bad was probably like the end leg of the tour and maybe he was tired and lost weight but I'm not so sure. One of the concerts shows him confused and missing steps and much thinner.
Lately I've been leaning to a theory... MJ has a twin. <!-- s:shock: -->:shock:<!-- s:shock: -->
I totally agree with you. When you view the concerts, you will notice the facial features are different. I'd noticed the face is more round and the eyes look smaller. Have you watched Flem 18 videos? The videos make you think different. Also, I read Souza and Mo's blog interview with Jennifer Batten. She said that Michael didn't rehearse that much on the Dangerous or History tour as he did during the Bad tour. She also noticed when he would leave the stage, he would use oxygen. I'd read article after June 25th, someone said had talked about MJ's 30th anniversary concert in New York. The person noticed that MJ was tired. They said MJ never gets tired like that. They also indicated to look at the Bucharest and Copenhagen concerts. Especially when he is singing "You are not alone."
Michael's appearance can change slightly because he had lupis. Lupis from friends i know that have it can make the face rosy red and some day look slight bubbly. This could mean that he would need to wear extra make up on certain days.
As for rehearsing, there are plenty of videos out there concerning the Dangerous Tour. Michael didn't have a twin unless his family has been planning the hoax since conception which I highly doubt.
Michael also had layrngitis during a good part of the tour which requires medication so I am sure the tiredness you see if Michael with medication in his system. Listen to the end of Billie Jean from this tour, you will hear once the play back end Michael saying "Breaking my heart babe..." and it is incredible raspy and scratchy.
"half of me can never be, so you should be threatened by me",
always perplexes me.
This is an intriguing topic. You guys are so perceptive!
@bec: I thought it was, "Half of me you’ll never be, so you should feel threatened by me"
I take this to mean that 'you could never be half of who I am and this should feel threatening' ??
@MJFan: we'll probably never know for sure but, i do think the Lupis condition has to be considered which can really change the way you look and perhaps at times there's a stand-in to help fill things out?
But, now that I'm reading more about Elvis, the Orion singer comes to mind where it is thought that after Elvis left he stilled performed part of a concert as Orion and they would switch back and forth.
And then my mind goes to wonderful Marlon, (I think he's extremely intelligent, purposeful and articulate), who seemed to drop lots of clues at the memorial: disguises, twin, his signature in the program with Study Peace... And I will not forget him wearing an FBI hat in the tv reality show, so to my mind, he gives many clues because, if you study Marlon, I don't feel he does anything randomly...) And so the twin idea just keeps popping up, doesn't it?
It gives me pause to think about the song Behind The Mask, and Bucharest concert is thrown in, and then there's feelings among some of you that it wasn't always Michael in Bucharest -- although it seems so to me -- but I can see why you would examine this and think twice (no pun intended )
I know one thing for sure: Nothing Is What It Seems
i haven't read all the posts but does someone DOUBT it is Michael in Bucharest 92??! Speechless.
Where do these theories come out from, tell me at least to know. It's incredible. It IS Michael Jackson himself and no impersonator, double, twin or anything from that brand
Two Birds
It's hard to tell them what I feel for you. They haven't ever met you, and no one has your
picture. So how can they ever understand your mystery? Let's give them a clue:
Two birds sit in a tree. One eats cherries, while the other looks on. Two birds fly through the air.
One's song drops like crystal from the sky while the other keeps silent. Two birds wheel in the
sun. One catches the light on its silver feathers, while the other spreads wings of invisibility.
It's easy to guess which bird I am, but they'll never find you. Unless...
Unless they already know a love that never interferes, that watches from beyond, that breathes
free in the invisible air. Sweet bird, my soul, your silence is so precious. How long will it be
before the world hears your song in mine?
Oh, that is a day I hunger for!
Also, listen to the lyrics of "We are here to change the world" and "Another Part of Me."
Wow! What a thread I started. Thanks kalispera for trying to keep them on topic. Thanks Its Her for your explanation about the possible meaning of having the Live from Bucharest crowd soundbite at the beginning and again later in the song Behind the Mask.
Now on the other topic brought up by this topic, I have to say, it is MJ doing that tour and every tour. IMHO. Yes, his features changed as we know. And although I do think that he looks shorter in some concerts, it could also be camera angles affecting what we see as his height. I know that it is interesting to discuss these possibilities, but I think that it takes away from our main purpose....finding out what the heck happened to MJ and the events surrounding June 25, 2009, keeping his message alive while he is "dead" and living his message and spreading it to others throughout the world. <!-- s:) -->:)<!-- s:) --> <!-- s8-) -->8-)<!-- s8-) -->
Finding out if he had a twin or not could settle the entire Hoax and death once and for all.
If Michael had a twin, why is he not in the hours and hours of footage of Jackson home videos available on the internet? Why is he in no pictures of the family that are released both properly or leaked?
If he had a twin that means that the twin would have the same hand writing, exact same facial features, lupis and vitiligo not to mention the same exact style of dance which would be very hard to try to duplicate.
There is only 1 Michael Jackson. This twin idea is just as bad as the "doubles" theory in This is it.
I think those 2 photos from "Come Together/Moonwalker" are an example of different lighting and him maybe playing with contact lenses. However I have seen so many photos over the years where there is clearly 2 different ears on both young Michaels and older Michaels. BUT there has also been a lot of photo flipping over the years, mole on this side then the other, gapped tooth on opposite sides, glove on opposite hands in same photos that have been flipped etc....and I cant help but wonder, why so much photo flipping. I know it's done often with other people as well but seems like a LOT with Michael. Trying to hide something maybe or confuse the bejebus out of the public.
This picture mainly got me thinking he has a twin:
Idk, the pictures look like 2 different people, but the facial features are too similar to be a double, imo.
You almost ! got me with these pix, except for the hair: NO two people, even identical, have every single hair in the same place on two different heads. Whew! These two gave me pause! <!-- s:o -->:o<!-- s:o --> but, naw...
Same head, here, one face has been retouched, to make him look "fresher".
Off the OP topic, but right on, here:
I always wondered about this:
"...Kiss me baby, and tell me TWICE, you're the one for me..."
AND:
"...take my message to your brother, and tell him TWICE..."
Especially NOW <!-- s:shock: -->:shock:<!-- s:shock: --> , kind of makes ya go, "Hmmm..." <!-- s:? -->:?<!-- s:? --> <!-- s --><!-- s -->
This picture mainly got me thinking he has a twin:
Idk, the pictures look like 2 different people, but the facial features are too similar to be a double, imo.
Two different pictures, slightly different expressions and obvious contrasting and brightness changes. The reason you see a cleft in the pic to the left is because the contrast was turned up which is obvious when viewing the 2 shirts. The pic on the right shows hardly any cleft because the brightness was turned up and some brushing had to have gone on with the uneven skin tones and the the look being a little cloudy.
This picture mainly got me thinking he has a twin:
Idk, the pictures look like 2 different people, but the facial features are too similar to be a double, imo.
Two different pictures, slightly different expressions and obvious contrasting and brightness changes. The reason you see a cleft in the pic to the left is because the contrast was turned up which is obvious when viewing the 2 shirts. The pic on the right shows hardly any cleft because the brightness was turned up and some brushing had to have gone on with the uneven skin tones and the the look being a little cloudy.
I forgot to mention that it was not just a little retouching(airbrushing). The picture on the right looks just exactly like the innocent boyish doll on the BAD album, which MJ SAID they had retouched. The reason it looks "cloudy", as you say, is because there are over ten thousand muscles of expression in the human face, and airbrushing irrespectfully paints over these, as if what they are telling is inconsequential, and fails to paint new believable subtle musculature there, in place of what was blotted out... The picture on the left was totally unretouched, and looks like a man <!-- s8-) -->8-)<!-- s8-) --> . The real deal. Not bad at ALL, eh??? <!-- s:D -->:D<!-- s:D --> <!-- s:D -->:D<!-- s:D -->
This picture mainly got me thinking he has a twin:
Idk, the pictures look like 2 different people, but the facial features are too similar to be a double, imo.
Two different pictures, slightly different expressions and obvious contrasting and brightness changes. The reason you see a cleft in the pic to the left is because the contrast was turned up which is obvious when viewing the 2 shirts. The pic on the right shows hardly any cleft because the brightness was turned up and some brushing had to have gone on with the uneven skin tones and the the look being a little cloudy.
I forgot to mention that it was not just a little retouching(airbrushing). The picture on the right looks just exactly like the innocent boyish doll on the BAD album, which MJ SAID they had retouched. The reason it looks "cloudy", as you say, is because there are over ten thousand muscles of expression in the human face, and airbrushing irrespectfully paints over these, as if what they are telling is inconsequential, and fails to paint new believable subtle musculature there, in place of what was blotted out... The picture on the left was totally unretouched, and looks like a man <!-- s8-) -->8-)<!-- s8-) --> . The real deal. Not bad at ALL, eh??? <!-- s:D -->:D<!-- s:D --> <!-- s:D -->:D<!-- s:D -->
I agree, the left one looks much better. I don't like airbrushed pictures, most definitely not with men.
There was something else going on with this picture though, but I can't remember what. I'll see if I can find it later on.
"For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places."
Comments
Yeah, I agree. I think it's the eyes and body shape. He seems taller in those two tours than in his previous ones.
I don't think he is in Bucharest now......in fact he could be anywhere if he is alive......maybe in London..... or maybe he is just 2 meters under the groud
always perplexes me.
Michael's appearance can change slightly because he had lupis. Lupis from friends i know that have it can make the face rosy red and some day look slight bubbly. This could mean that he would need to wear extra make up on certain days.
As for rehearsing, there are plenty of videos out there concerning the Dangerous Tour. Michael didn't have a twin unless his family has been planning the hoax since conception which I highly doubt.
Michael also had layrngitis during a good part of the tour which requires medication so I am sure the tiredness you see if Michael with medication in his system. Listen to the end of Billie Jean from this tour, you will hear once the play back end Michael saying "Breaking my heart babe..." and it is incredible raspy and scratchy.
This is an intriguing topic. You guys are so perceptive!
@bec: I thought it was, "Half of me you’ll never be, so you should feel threatened by me"
I take this to mean that 'you could never be half of who I am and this should feel threatening' ??
@MJFan: we'll probably never know for sure but, i do think the Lupis condition has to be considered which can really change the way you look and perhaps at times there's a stand-in to help fill things out?
But, now that I'm reading more about Elvis, the Orion singer comes to mind where it is thought that after Elvis left he stilled performed part of a concert as Orion and they would switch back and forth.
And then my mind goes to wonderful Marlon, (I think he's extremely intelligent, purposeful and articulate), who seemed to drop lots of clues at the memorial: disguises, twin, his signature in the program with Study Peace... And I will not forget him wearing an FBI hat in the tv reality show, so to my mind, he gives many clues because, if you study Marlon, I don't feel he does anything randomly...) And so the twin idea just keeps popping up, doesn't it?
It gives me pause to think about the song Behind The Mask, and Bucharest concert is thrown in, and then there's feelings among some of you that it wasn't always Michael in Bucharest -- although it seems so to me -- but I can see why you would examine this and think twice (no pun intended )
I know one thing for sure: Nothing Is What It Seems
Maybe that line can stop eating at me now, lol.
Where do these theories come out from, tell me at least to know. It's incredible. It IS Michael Jackson himself and no impersonator, double, twin or anything from that brand
Two Birds
It's hard to tell them what I feel for you. They haven't ever met you, and no one has your
picture. So how can they ever understand your mystery? Let's give them a clue:
Two birds sit in a tree. One eats cherries, while the other looks on. Two birds fly through the air.
One's song drops like crystal from the sky while the other keeps silent. Two birds wheel in the
sun. One catches the light on its silver feathers, while the other spreads wings of invisibility.
It's easy to guess which bird I am, but they'll never find you. Unless...
Unless they already know a love that never interferes, that watches from beyond, that breathes
free in the invisible air. Sweet bird, my soul, your silence is so precious. How long will it be
before the world hears your song in mine?
Oh, that is a day I hunger for!
Also, listen to the lyrics of "We are here to change the world" and "Another Part of Me."
Now on the other topic brought up by this topic, I have to say, it is MJ doing that tour and every tour. IMHO. Yes, his features changed as we know. And although I do think that he looks shorter in some concerts, it could also be camera angles affecting what we see as his height. I know that it is interesting to discuss these possibilities, but I think that it takes away from our main purpose....finding out what the heck happened to MJ and the events surrounding June 25, 2009, keeping his message alive while he is "dead" and living his message and spreading it to others throughout the world. <!-- s:) -->:)<!-- s:) --> <!-- s8-) -->8-)<!-- s8-) -->
If Michael had a twin, why is he not in the hours and hours of footage of Jackson home videos available on the internet? Why is he in no pictures of the family that are released both properly or leaked?
If he had a twin that means that the twin would have the same hand writing, exact same facial features, lupis and vitiligo not to mention the same exact style of dance which would be very hard to try to duplicate.
There is only 1 Michael Jackson. This twin idea is just as bad as the "doubles" theory in This is it.
Idk, the pictures look like 2 different people, but the facial features are too similar to be a double, imo.
Same head, here, one face has been retouched, to make him look "fresher".
Off the OP topic, but right on, here:
I always wondered about this:
"...Kiss me baby, and tell me TWICE, you're the one for me..."
AND:
"...take my message to your brother, and tell him TWICE..."
Especially NOW <!-- s:shock: -->:shock:<!-- s:shock: --> , kind of makes ya go, "Hmmm..." <!-- s:? -->:?<!-- s:? --> <!-- s
Two different pictures, slightly different expressions and obvious contrasting and brightness changes. The reason you see a cleft in the pic to the left is because the contrast was turned up which is obvious when viewing the 2 shirts. The pic on the right shows hardly any cleft because the brightness was turned up and some brushing had to have gone on with the uneven skin tones and the the look being a little cloudy.
I forgot to mention that it was not just a little retouching(airbrushing). The picture on the right looks just exactly like the innocent boyish doll on the BAD album, which MJ SAID they had retouched. The reason it looks "cloudy", as you say, is because there are over ten thousand muscles of expression in the human face, and airbrushing irrespectfully paints over these, as if what they are telling is inconsequential, and fails to paint new believable subtle musculature there, in place of what was blotted out... The picture on the left was totally unretouched, and looks like a man <!-- s8-) -->8-)<!-- s8-) --> . The real deal. Not bad at ALL, eh??? <!-- s:D -->:D<!-- s:D --> <!-- s:D -->:D<!-- s:D -->
I agree, the left one looks much better. I don't like airbrushed pictures, most definitely not with men.
There was something else going on with this picture though, but I can't remember what. I'll see if I can find it later on.
"For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places."