I have to agree. When something is ambiguous and unclear, it never takes certain elements of society long to get the wrong idea. There is definately a game plan here.
Thank you!...that's all I was trying to say... it's sad that society thinks that way, but it's real.
That was my "knee jerk" reaction to first hearing the song and seeing this cover. It's no different than say seeing two women kiss and hug each other on the street. My first "knee jerk" reaction would be to think they were gay...when in fact they could have been a mother - daughter. Things aren't always so obvious until they are explained or researched and sadly not alot of people are going to research such things...they are just going to go on their initial assumption.
I feel like I'm preaching to the choir here because if people are here reading these forum threads, they obviously "get it"....they "see" things differently already...you know the meaning behind things Michael does....that's not true for everyone else.
Yes - you only stop to wonder when something is ambiguous - someone obviously meant it that way to make people wonder. Its a bit like the Say Say Say cover where you could plainly see MJ and Paul McCartney holding hands - I often used to wonder why they did the cover that way.
I don't think the world was that corrupt those days. Right now everything anyone does or says has a double meaning and I am tired of it already.
We don't doubt - we are just acknowledging that there are people out there who will and the ambiguity on the cover will only add to it. Personally, I don't hear any ambiguity in the song itself - just on the cover - which is open to interpretation. I think most, if not all of us here don't doubt MJ at all.
I looked further into this, and I still see nothing gay about this at all. Men do songs together all the time, sometimes with disgusting lyrics, but nobody ever has anything to say about that. Nothing about this song or cover looks or sounds gay. It doesn't even look like two men, even if it was, it's not a big deal, I hold hands with friends of the same gender all the time, am I a lesbian now? No, not at all. I love men. That's just me and my friends loving each other and having fun together. Plus, if they were gay, which I do NOT believe to be true, so what, what does this have to do with anything? I know we are some hardcore investigators and we look into everything, but this is just off the wall, no pun intended. And narrow-minded. Just my opinion
You know bec, I looked at the cover and the first thing I thought was, ok that makes an M and a V.
Second thing I thought was, who are those two guys holding hands?
Though I agree with Serenity that on a closer inspection one wrist is more feminine.
Now, my thought is, either
1) Sony really are the bad guys and are trying to make Michael look gay (although why ANYONE would have a problem if he WAS gay is beyond me-hello! it's 2010 not the stone age!!) and releasing the album and simoutaneously sabotaging Michaels name (this theory doesn't make too much sense to me)
2) Michael is behind it and wants to shake up peoples perceptions or even just cause controversy (possible)
3) We are reading too much into it. (possible)
Right now my brain is a mushy fuzzy mess so who knows. <!-- s --><!-- s -->
Its funny you bring this up. Just yesterday I played this song for my little brother, who is ten years old, from YouTube. The very first thing out of his mouth was, "Is that supposed to be Akon and Michael holding hands?" Of course I told him no and pointed out the differences of the two.
My personal opinion is he's stirring up controversy, as usual. I don't think Sony is out to get him or any of that jazz. I just think he's doing what he used to do, just without people knowing he's behind it. Know what I mean?
I looked further into this, and I still see nothing gay about this at all. Men do songs together all the time, sometimes with disgusting lyrics, but nobody ever has anything to say about that. Nothing about this song or cover looks or sounds gay. It doesn't even look like two men, even if it was, it's not a big deal, I hold hands with friends of the same gender all the time, am I a lesbian now? No, not at all. I love men. That's just me and my friends loving each other and having fun together. Plus, if they were gay, which I do NOT believe to be true, so what, what does this have to do with anything? I know we are some hardcore investigators and we look into everything, but this is just off the wall, no pun intended. And narrow-minded. Just my opinion
XOXO
I agree with the point that it shouldn't matter whether it's 2 men or 2 women or a parent and child... It's 2 people holding hands - since when is that wrong/bad, and WHY?! There's nothing wrong with being gay, so why is anyone talking about "negativity" at all?
WE are the ones creating the controversy - ANY controversy - not MJ or anyone else. If we were indifferent to MJ, this forum would not exist and we wouldn't be here (regardless of what MJ did or does)... It's our reactions to people's words and actions that create controversy. MJ's life simply held a mirror onto us... in which we got and still get reflected. That's all. No one ever held a gun to our heads telling us what to think or do about MJ, if anything.
This cover is, to me, a simple M and 2 people holding hands... I don't think "Oh wait, let me figure out who exactly that is!" And if this cover happened pre 6/25/2009, would we dissect it so much?
Other artists have dabbled in ambiguity of all sorts - including Prince, Freddie Mercury... WHY NOT? Seems to make people go nuts, so it's a good marketing ploy. <!-- s:D -->:D<!-- s:D -->
Another thought:
MJ was someone who wanted to break barriers and walls of all kinds. He promoted equality through his songs and everything else he did in life... He took on the issue of color, race, and nationality. What if now he's taking on the issue of gay-ness, trying to send out a message that "it don't matter if you're straight or gay"? There was a recent incident in the U.S. where a gay boy (college student) ended up committing suicide... Remember that Michael was sensitive to people's pain and sometimes wrote songs inspired by real stories of real people (Bad, Gone Too Soon)? Maybe this is just another example of that. Now I know HMH was written in 2007 or so, but maybe the cover was created recently and is ambiguous on purpose... And maybe it IS about gay-ness. (I don't know, of course. This is a possible theory.)
I am not going to say I totally disagree with bec because I did think of the homosexual overtones but I thought of that when I heard the demo. I figured that is not what they meant obviously but I did think of it. I just laughed it off and enjoyed the song. However, I'm actually surprise, no one didn't think that this could simply be a continuation of Michael's last single and video from Invincible--Cry. Throughout the video, there are people of different backgrounds, races, cultures, holding hands. It is also interesting that Michael is NOT in this video. It seems to be a prelude to this adventure we are on now. I think the message of Cry and Hold My Hand is similar and goes along with this adventure of L.O.V.E. and truth. I think the homosexual overtones could just be a coincidence? It's not there with Cry so I would say it could be just be our interpretations getting in the way of the important message or maybe you guys are onto something...what exactly...not sure. The video for Cry is below.
Sorry guys, I didn't read all the posts, just the first page.
I also think that the woman on the cover could look more womanly, but if they make an hourglass figure for her, the letter M wouldn't be that obvious...
And I also think it can be good that we cannot really decide whether it's a woman on the right or not, because IMO the main thing is that people are holding each other's hands. Any people. It symbolises that if we are connected, together we can reach much more.
I posted my opinion of this song (and this cover photo) in the other thread, but I post it here too, as it fits here:
(Basically I wrote about the hands forming a human heart).
The heart as a symbol would just fit for me to this song. When I hear this song I think of Michael's "I Have This Dream" - when he encourages people to hold each other's hands.
"I would like all of you now to take the hand of the person to the left and to the right of you. Go ahead. Right now, I mean it. Don't be shy. Do it, because it starts now. ... Now tell the person next to you that you care for them, tell them that you LOVE them. Tell them that you LOVE them! This is what makes the difference. Together we can make a change to the world, together we can help to stop racism, together we can help to stop prejudice, we can help the world live without fear, it is our only hope. Without hope we are lost. Thank you all!"
HEART symbolises LOVE, this is why I think it's possible that the form of the hands shows a heart for us, telling that LOVE is the most important thing.
(I cannot copy-paste videos here - it doesn't work with my computer. Sorry.)
From HMH: We're Better off being together (hold my hand)
Than being miserable alone (hold my hand)
together we can be alright
Do you guys see the similarities?
I know it's basically a love song, but artists used to create music (etc.) which can be understood differently - for being perfect for everyone's feelings. We can hear from the song which we want, we can connect them with our own lifes. So maybe this song was also written with that goal: to be able to reach everyone's feelings. But the main message to me is: together, by holding our hands (like people used to do in Catholic churches for example) and loving each other, we can do more.
when i clicked on the thread and saw the cry vid picture immediately i got a flash of the the shot of kenny and the others in a circle holding hands with their heads bowed.
looking4truth, I just read your post, and realized that we basically think the same. We just brought up different examples <!-- s:) -->:)<!-- s:) -->
Sorry that I read it only after writing mine...
when i clicked on the thread and saw the cry vid picture immediately i got a flash of the the shot of kenny and the others in a circle holding hands with their heads bowed.
Yes! <!-- s:) -->:)<!-- s:) -->
I only thought of the statue of the children in Neverland, but yours has way more meaning <!-- s:D -->:D<!-- s:D -->
looking4truth, I just read your post, and realized that we basically think the same. We just brought up different examples <!-- s:) -->:)<!-- s:) -->
Sorry that I read it only after writing mine...
Oh you're fine! I didn't even think of that example. So many things are pointing to Michael and holding hands. <!-- s --><!-- s -->
I am going to disagree with you on this. I love the song and that picture is of a man on the left holding the hand of a woman on the right.
The bodies are shaped differently, the body on the right has muscles...masculine looking and the arm on the right is more slender, the hand appears smaller and more feminine, look at the wrist. All only IMO of course.
I agree with you that the the hands are not two men. I also don't think their was homosexual innuendo in the song. So i disagree with that part of the OP's post. However, the strange happenings surrounding the release of this album scream hoax. The album and the songs on it are a message.
I feel that when people get this album, if they get this album, they will be surprised by what they get.
I AGREE WITH YOU A 100000000000000000000000%
IT IS SO OBVIOUS IT IS A MALE AND FEMALE!
I honestly believe this thread was a worth-while discussion, and that I think we've come very close to what Michael has in mind. IMO.
IT IS NOW I SEE AND FEEL THAT CALLING ONCE AGAIN, TO BE PART OF A MUSIC THAT WILL NOT JUST CONNECT BUT, MAKE ALL FEEL ONE, ONE IN JOY, ONE IN PAIN, ONE IN LOVE, ONE IN SERVICE AND IN CONSCIOUSNESS. MJ
by RK » Wed Nov 17, 2010 11:20 am
This has to be strategic to the hoax. It seems Mike is throwing these things in the world's face. Where it can't be ignored. I'd say our boy is understandably really pissed off. It reminds me of Is It Scary. where he says I'm gonna be exactly what you wanna see
It's you whose haunting me Your warning me
To be the stranger in your life
Am I amusing you or just confusing you
Am I the beast you visualize.
And if you wanna see eccentrialities I'll be grotesque before your eyes
Let them all materialize.
But if you came to see the truth and purity
It's here inside a lonely heart
So let the performance start......As far as HMH goes, I love it. Nice song....but the controversy is on purpose....hoax purpose. I don't understand how it all will unfold, but I intend to keep watching the performance of the greatest show on earth.
suspicious mind wrote:
when i clicked on the thread and saw the cry vid picture immediately i got a flash of the the shot of kenny and the others in a circle holding hands with their heads bowed.
DREAMSandTRUTH
The heart as a symbol would just fit for me to this song. When I hear this song I think of Michael's "I Have This Dream" - when he encourages people to hold each other's hands.
"I would like all of you now to take the hand of the person to the left and to the right of you. Go ahead. Right now, I mean it. Don't be shy. Do it, because it starts now. ... Now tell the person next to you that you care for them, tell them that you LOVE them. Tell them that you LOVE them! This is what makes the difference. Together we can make a change to the world, together we can help to stop racism, together we can help to stop prejudice, we can help the world live without fear, it is our only hope. Without hope we are lost. Thank you all!"
by looking4truth » Wed Nov 17, 2010 9:21 pm
I am not going to say I totally disagree with bec because I did think of the homosexual overtones but I thought of that when I heard the demo. I figured that is not what they meant obviously but I did think of it. I just laughed it off and enjoyed the song. However, I'm actually surprise, no one didn't think that this could simply be a continuation of Michael's last single and video from Invincible--Cry. Throughout the video, there are people of different backgrounds, races, cultures, holding hands. It is also interesting that Michael is NOT in this video. It seems to be a prelude to this adventure we are on now. I think the message of Cry and Hold My Hand is similar and goes along with this adventure of L.O.V.E. and truth. I think the homosexual overtones could just be a coincidence? It's not there with Cry so I would say it could be just be our interpretations getting in the way of the important message or maybe you guys are onto something...what exactly...not sure. The video for Cry is below.
by truthprevails » Wed Nov 17, 2010 6:09 pm
Another thought: MJ was someone who wanted to break barriers and walls of all kinds. He promoted equality through his songs and everything else he did in life... He took on the issue of color, race, and nationality. What if now he's taking on the issue of gay-ness, trying to send out a message that "it don't matter if you're straight or gay"? There was a recent incident in the U.S. where a gay boy (college student) ended up committing suicide... Remember that Michael was sensitive to people's pain and sometimes wrote songs inspired by real stories of real people (Bad, Gone Too Soon)? Maybe this is just another example of that. Now I know HMH was written in 2007 or so, but maybe the cover was created recently and is ambiguous on purpose... And maybe it IS about gay-ness. (I don't know, of course. This is a possible theory.)
by trublu » Wed Nov 17, 2010 4:28 pm
You know bec, I looked at the cover and the first thing I thought was, ok that makes an M and a V.
I also must say, that this afternoon as I started the car to do shopping, immediately the DJ said someone requested MJ and Akon's "Hold my Hand". So I pumped er up and that was so great. I felt so happy. I really feel people are going to love the song too!
I know Michael's alive, I love him, and I know he knows what he's doing with these songs! <!-- s:D -->:D<!-- s:D --> <!-- s:oops: -->:oops:<!-- s:oops: --> <!-- s:D -->:D<!-- s:D -->
Well , I love the song very much and I never noticed any gay hints in it . But really when I saw the cover I felt like “ wow ! what does it mean ? “
For me the explanation is that everything concerning Michael , his art , his talent , his life etc. has dual meaning. His intentions , his thoughts, his songs , his life are simple from his point of view- it’s love , humanism. But when it goes to public and media they immediately start to look for some hidden meaning and put everything upside down.
The controvercy surrounds Michael all the time. We know there is controvercy that is intended by the author himself for some reason but here we have conrovercy installed in our minds . Remember Breaking News, there were rumours from the family it was not Michael ‘s voice just before the releasing of the song and when it was released the hot discussion started. We were ready already to percept the song being fake.
The same with HMH. I’m sure the majority of us didn’t even dare to think the song is about gay love. But now when we are given a picture we start to hesitate.
The whole thing with the album shows the fact that it’s too easy to manipulate people’s mind. This media manipulation surrounded Michael and his art everywhere.
For me it’s one more proof he’s alive and he’s teaching us to think first before judge something. Things may be different from what we see them ! <!-- s:!: -->:!:<!-- s:!: -->
The original post here is something to consider, but after thinking about the song and it being chosen as the first single as a love ballad sung by two men with a gender-neutral look to the cover, I believe it follows MJ's warrior spirit in speaking out against injustice. Again, with his huge heart, he majestically underscores that everyone deserves love and intimacy unencumbered. Same-sex couples could very well see this as an anthem and Michael is saying there's victory for all. The inclusiveness of this song and artwork is a brilliant way to make a statement like only Michael can do. And this, on the heels of the children who are hanging themselves and jumping off bridges out of desperation and despair, Michael speaks out once again. And he speaks out as a straight man who is in solidarity with the gay community. Why not consider this as the underlying agenda for the release of Hold My Hand?
I don't know anything about Akon but I'm glad to see he's unafraid of being part of something like this. It's also interesting to note that this song is released soon after Janet mentioned the anti-bullying campaign she's a part of. I can see why it's the first song released. There are a lot of children in pain right now and I hope they hear Michael's message.
"JUSTICE IS WHAT LOVE LOOKS LIKE IN PUBLIC" Cornel West
I am going to disagree with you on this. I love the song and that picture is of a man on the left holding the hand of a woman on the right.
The bodies are shaped differently, the body on the left has muscles...masculine looking and the arm on the right is more slender, the hand appears smaller and more feminine, look at the wrist. All only IMO of course.
look at the background of the two hands. does anyone else see a very pregnant body there or is it time for my meds. <!-- s:? -->:?<!-- s:? -->
I am going to disagree with you on this. I love the song and that picture is of a man on the left holding the hand of a woman on the right.
The bodies are shaped differently, the body on the left has muscles...masculine looking and the arm on the right is more slender, the hand appears smaller and more feminine, look at the wrist. All only IMO of course.
look at the background of the two hands. does anyone else see a very pregnant body there or is it time for my meds. <!-- s:? -->:?<!-- s:? -->
I saw that too, @suspicious mind. You are not alone -- lol!
i can plainly see its a male and female hand look at the one on the right its a female lovely long manicured finger nails i also dont think this song is weak i love it i cant stop listening to it i love michaels voice miss him so much though hurry up mike we want you back we miss you like mad
I am going to disagree with you on this. I love the song and that picture is of a man on the left holding the hand of a woman on the right.
The bodies are shaped differently, the body on the left has muscles...masculine looking and the arm on the right is more slender, the hand appears smaller and more feminine, look at the wrist. All only IMO of course.
look at the background of the two hands. does anyone else see a very pregnant body there or is it time for my meds. <!-- s:? -->:?<!-- s:? -->
I saw that too, @suspicious mind. You are not alone -- lol!
good i hate the thought of going crazy alone <!-- s;) -->;)<!-- s;) -->
I am going to disagree with you on this. I love the song and that picture is of a man on the left holding the hand of a woman on the right.
The bodies are shaped differently, the body on the left has muscles...masculine looking and the arm on the right is more slender, the hand appears smaller and more feminine, look at the wrist. All only IMO of course.
Besides the male and female forms, I see an 'M"... <!-- s:D -->:D<!-- s:D -->
I am going to disagree with you on this. I love the song and that picture is of a man on the left holding the hand of a woman on the right.
The bodies are shaped differently, the body on the left has muscles...masculine looking and the arm on the right is more slender, the hand appears smaller and more feminine, look at the wrist. All only IMO of course.
Besides the male and female forms, I see an 'M"... <!-- s:D -->:D<!-- s:D -->
This may be coincidence, but it caught my eye while going through the "rare" picture thread...it makes me wonder about this song cover even more. Check out this picture...what does something remind you of? <!-- s:) -->:)<!-- s:) -->
Comments
I don't think the world was that corrupt those days. Right now everything anyone does or says has a double meaning and I am tired of it already.
We don't doubt - we are just acknowledging that there are people out there who will and the ambiguity on the cover will only add to it. Personally, I don't hear any ambiguity in the song itself - just on the cover - which is open to interpretation. I think most, if not all of us here don't doubt MJ at all.
XOXO
Second thing I thought was, who are those two guys holding hands?
Though I agree with Serenity that on a closer inspection one wrist is more feminine.
Now, my thought is, either
1) Sony really are the bad guys and are trying to make Michael look gay (although why ANYONE would have a problem if he WAS gay is beyond me-hello! it's 2010 not the stone age!!) and releasing the album and simoutaneously sabotaging Michaels name (this theory doesn't make too much sense to me)
2) Michael is behind it and wants to shake up peoples perceptions or even just cause controversy (possible)
3) We are reading too much into it. (possible)
Right now my brain is a mushy fuzzy mess so who knows. <!-- s
My personal opinion is he's stirring up controversy, as usual. I don't think Sony is out to get him or any of that jazz. I just think he's doing what he used to do, just without people knowing he's behind it. Know what I mean?
I agree with the point that it shouldn't matter whether it's 2 men or 2 women or a parent and child... It's 2 people holding hands - since when is that wrong/bad, and WHY?! There's nothing wrong with being gay, so why is anyone talking about "negativity" at all?
WE are the ones creating the controversy - ANY controversy - not MJ or anyone else. If we were indifferent to MJ, this forum would not exist and we wouldn't be here (regardless of what MJ did or does)... It's our reactions to people's words and actions that create controversy. MJ's life simply held a mirror onto us... in which we got and still get reflected. That's all. No one ever held a gun to our heads telling us what to think or do about MJ, if anything.
This cover is, to me, a simple M and 2 people holding hands... I don't think "Oh wait, let me figure out who exactly that is!" And if this cover happened pre 6/25/2009, would we dissect it so much?
Other artists have dabbled in ambiguity of all sorts - including Prince, Freddie Mercury... WHY NOT? Seems to make people go nuts, so it's a good marketing ploy. <!-- s:D -->:D<!-- s:D -->
MJ was someone who wanted to break barriers and walls of all kinds. He promoted equality through his songs and everything else he did in life... He took on the issue of color, race, and nationality. What if now he's taking on the issue of gay-ness, trying to send out a message that "it don't matter if you're straight or gay"? There was a recent incident in the U.S. where a gay boy (college student) ended up committing suicide... Remember that Michael was sensitive to people's pain and sometimes wrote songs inspired by real stories of real people (Bad, Gone Too Soon)? Maybe this is just another example of that. Now I know HMH was written in 2007 or so, but maybe the cover was created recently and is ambiguous on purpose... And maybe it IS about gay-ness. (I don't know, of course. This is a possible theory.)
[youtube:o7z34xl1]
I also think that the woman on the cover could look more womanly, but if they make an hourglass figure for her, the letter M wouldn't be that obvious...
And I also think it can be good that we cannot really decide whether it's a woman on the right or not, because IMO the main thing is that people are holding each other's hands. Any people. It symbolises that if we are connected, together we can reach much more.
I posted my opinion of this song (and this cover photo) in the other thread, but I post it here too, as it fits here:
(Basically I wrote about the hands forming a human heart).
From HMH:
We're Better off being together (hold my hand)
Than being miserable alone (hold my hand)
together we can be alright
Do you guys see the similarities?
I know it's basically a love song, but artists used to create music (etc.) which can be understood differently - for being perfect for everyone's feelings. We can hear from the song which we want, we can connect them with our own lifes. So maybe this song was also written with that goal: to be able to reach everyone's feelings. But the main message to me is: together, by holding our hands (like people used to do in Catholic churches for example) and loving each other, we can do more.
Sorry that I read it only after writing mine...
I only thought of the statue of the children in Neverland, but yours has way more meaning <!-- s:D -->:D<!-- s:D -->
Oh you're fine! I didn't even think of that example. So many things are pointing to Michael and holding hands. <!-- s
I AGREE WITH YOU A 100000000000000000000000%
IT IS SO OBVIOUS IT IS A MALE AND FEMALE!
IT IS NOW I SEE AND FEEL THAT CALLING ONCE AGAIN, TO BE PART OF A MUSIC THAT WILL NOT JUST CONNECT BUT, MAKE ALL FEEL ONE, ONE IN JOY, ONE IN PAIN, ONE IN LOVE, ONE IN SERVICE AND IN CONSCIOUSNESS. MJ
I know Michael's alive, I love him, and I know he knows what he's doing with these songs! <!-- s:D -->:D<!-- s:D --> <!-- s:oops: -->:oops:<!-- s:oops: --> <!-- s:D -->:D<!-- s:D -->
For me the explanation is that everything concerning Michael , his art , his talent , his life etc. has dual meaning. His intentions , his thoughts, his songs , his life are simple from his point of view- it’s love , humanism. But when it goes to public and media they immediately start to look for some hidden meaning and put everything upside down.
The controvercy surrounds Michael all the time. We know there is controvercy that is intended by the author himself for some reason but here we have conrovercy installed in our minds . Remember Breaking News, there were rumours from the family it was not Michael ‘s voice just before the releasing of the song and when it was released the hot discussion started. We were ready already to percept the song being fake.
The same with HMH. I’m sure the majority of us didn’t even dare to think the song is about gay love. But now when we are given a picture we start to hesitate.
The whole thing with the album shows the fact that it’s too easy to manipulate people’s mind. This media manipulation surrounded Michael and his art everywhere.
For me it’s one more proof he’s alive and he’s teaching us to think first before judge something. Things may be different from what we see them ! <!-- s:!: -->:!:<!-- s:!: -->
I don't know anything about Akon but I'm glad to see he's unafraid of being part of something like this. It's also interesting to note that this song is released soon after Janet mentioned the anti-bullying campaign she's a part of. I can see why it's the first song released. There are a lot of children in pain right now and I hope they hear Michael's message.
"JUSTICE IS WHAT LOVE LOOKS LIKE IN PUBLIC" Cornel West
look at the background of the two hands. does anyone else see a very pregnant body there or is it time for my meds. <!-- s:? -->:?<!-- s:? -->
good i hate the thought of going crazy alone <!-- s;) -->;)<!-- s;) -->
Besides the male and female forms, I see an 'M"... <!-- s:D -->:D<!-- s:D -->
This may be coincidence, but it caught my eye while going through the "rare" picture thread...it makes me wonder about this song cover even more. Check out this picture...what does something remind you of? <!-- s:) -->:)<!-- s:) -->