i can't get over thinking that often we are seeing a sequence of scenes shot with both doubles and michael and digitally put together as one smooth movement.
yes which would explain all the time Kenny spent in the editing room with Michael.... <!-- s:D -->:D<!-- s:D --> <!-- s;) -->;)<!-- s;) -->
i can't get over thinking that often we are seeing a sequence of scenes shot with both doubles and michael and digitally put together as one smooth movement.
yes which would explain all the time Kenny spent in the editing room with Michael.... <!-- s:D -->:D<!-- s:D --> <!-- s;) -->;)<!-- s;) -->
Well in TII, they did keep switching back and forth during the same song - to MJ in different modes of dress, including red pants guy - but you couldn't see his face up close in a lot of the frames - I think the close-ups were definitely MJ but those film from further away were not.
i can't get over thinking that often we are seeing a sequence of scenes shot with both doubles and michael and digitally put together as one smooth movement.
yes which would explain all the time Kenny spent in the editing room with Michael.... <!-- s:D -->:D<!-- s:D --> <!-- s;) -->;)<!-- s;) -->
Well in TII, they did keep switching back and forth during the same song - to MJ in different modes of dress, including red pants guy - but you couldn't see his face up close in a lot of the frames - I think the close-ups were definitely MJ but those film from further away were not.
that is most likely what went on.imo
i have wondered before if now is the first time the question of doubles has come up or if it had sometime in the past.
There is no "TII dude" like there is now "02 dude"
All Michael
He used doubles b4, why wouldnt he use them again? Mike may have worn thr orange pants for some scences, but not everyone. He's not dumb, he knew what he was doing. Why do you think Joe said he believes there were doubles used? It was a clue, and a hint for the general public to look @ the movie differently. Unfortunatetly. it didnt work.
I think it is not Michael in the orange pants but saw the HD clip and thought I would have a closer look and to me even more I believe it is not Michael and wondered what you all thought and if it is not him who is it it could be some sort of clue
I have to wonder if MJ knows there are debates like this going on! I'm proudly sitting on the fence with all this talk of doubles! I am one who watched 'Ghosts' all the way through and never once suspected the mayor was MJ, until the reveal at the end! (Whereas my son saw him straight away!) So who am I to say that MJ couldn't easily be some orange pants guy who looks quite like him but doesn't have the same moves?! <!-- s --><!-- s -->
I just look and look and he he does not have the same elegance and gentle touches to his dance as the real michael or am i being cruel and why havent the dancers sliped up about any doubles i suppose they have had to sign something and in the end it will come out. but looking at this HD clip i just cant think that this is Michael in the red trousers when you can see the real Michael so clealy in the other part. Sorry if going over old ground and this needs to be deleated.
[youtube:2a7kuprb]
I agree with you.... MJ is total perfection and classic in his moves. I don't see that in red trousers guy, though he works hard at it. I also agree that MJ would jump in and out of shots with the same outfits as the doubles....but you can tell.
Like the other poster said....MJ holds your attention....red trousers guy doesn't. ....though no disrespect to to him...it's just MJ is a near impossible act to follow.
I didn't watch This Is It. When it was in the cinemas I was too sad to watch it. Then when I started to believe that Michael is alive, and watched some parts of TII on YouTube, I found it too confusing. So I didn't buy the DVD. For me, the guy wearing the orange pants, moves way less good than Michael ever did. It crossed my mind too, that it can be Michael though, playing that he can't dance... But WHY?
Michael always said he wanted to do perfect films, videos, everything. To put a double into TII or Michael dancing in a funny way makes the film unperfect. Can the orange pants guy's strange dance be a message? I don't think so - mainly because we still don't know what to think of it... If it is a message, it is quite unclear. So WHY does the guy wearing the orange pants dance that strange???? We still don't get it, but there must be some reason...
I will wait for Michael telling the truth about it. Basically I don't like to look for messages and clues given by Michael during this hoax, as most of what fans found can be misunderstood and are so unclear. We don't know for sure what is coming from Michael and what do they mean. We are just wasting are time with trying to understand WHY Michael did this and that in this past year. Sorry for telling my honest opninion, but it's quite bothering that we still doesn't know the truth.
We are just wasting are time with trying to understand WHY Michael did this and that in this past year. Sorry for telling my honest opninion, but it's quite bothering that we still doesn't know the truth.
Do you not understand WHY MJ has done this? I think we know the truth about what MJ's reason/message is and that's what's really important, not whether orange pants guy was a double! Spend your time reading and researching that and you won't be wasting your time. I believe all the hoax stuff will be explained to us in due course.
There is no "TII dude" like there is now "02 dude"
All Michael
He used doubles b4, why wouldnt he use them again? Mike may have worn thr orange pants for some scences, but not everyone. He's not dumb, he knew what he was doing. Why do you think Joe said he believes there were doubles used? It was a clue, and a hint for the general public to look @ the movie differently. Unfortunatetly. it didnt work.
@ MJmakesmespeechless
I absolutely agree with you.
@ LoveNeedsExpression
Do you know why Joe said this?
How I can rememer he was on day on a big baseball game, but I'm not sure. And there were people of the press. They asked Joe over and over again about Michael. At least he simply wanted to be left alone, so he said this double story. So the press guys had their story and Joe his quiet.
We are just wasting are time with trying to understand WHY Michael did this and that in this past year. Sorry for telling my honest opninion, but it's quite bothering that we still doesn't know the truth.
Do you not understand WHY MJ has done this? I think we know the truth about what MJ's reason/message is and that's what's really important, not whether orange pants guy was a double! Spend your time reading and researching that and you won't be wasting your time. I believe all the hoax stuff will be explained to us in due course.
Hi Curls,
no, honestly, I don't understand why Michael is doing this. But I would really love to. And I also think this is what counts.
(I don't really care about the orange pants guy, although I find it strange that he danced liked that in TII. I'm curious about why he was included in the film, but only a little.)
I spent a lot of time trying to find out the WHY for the hoax, but I don't think any of us can say "I know why Michael hoaxed his death".
"I believe all the hoax stuff will be explained to us in due course"
I hope so. Although Elvis's fans still cannot know for sure anything...
We believe this and that, but it's really not the same when Michael was still here - I mean gave interviews, talked to his fans in person...
We are just wasting are time with trying to understand WHY Michael did this and that in this past year. Sorry for telling my honest opninion, but it's quite bothering that we still doesn't know the truth.
Do you not understand WHY MJ has done this? I think we know the truth about what MJ's reason/message is and that's what's really important, not whether orange pants guy was a double! Spend your time reading and researching that and you won't be wasting your time. I believe all the hoax stuff will be explained to us in due course.
Hi Curls,
no, honestly, I don't understand why Michael is doing this. But I would really love to. And I also think this is what counts.
(I don't really care about the orange pants guy, although I find it strange that he danced liked that in TII. I'm curious about why he was included in the film, but only a little.)
I spent a lot of time trying to find out the WHY for the hoax, but I don't think any of us can say "I know why Michael hoaxed his death".
"I believe all the hoax stuff will be explained to us in due course"
I hope so. Although Elvis's fans still cannot know for sure anything...
We believe this and that, but it's really not the same when Michael was still here - I mean gave interviews, talked to his fans in person...
Try looking at some of these videos - again, if you already have. It's Mo's thread on MJ's message. And incidentally, even if this WASN'T MJ's intended message, it's something we sure all should be aware of.
We are just wasting are time with trying to understand WHY Michael did this and that in this past year. Sorry for telling my honest opninion, but it's quite bothering that we still doesn't know the truth.
Do you not understand WHY MJ has done this? I think we know the truth about what MJ's reason/message is and that's what's really important, not whether orange pants guy was a double! Spend your time reading and researching that and you won't be wasting your time. I believe all the hoax stuff will be explained to us in due course.
Hi Curls,
no, honestly, I don't understand why Michael is doing this. But I would really love to. And I also think this is what counts.
(I don't really care about the orange pants guy, although I find it strange that he danced liked that in TII. I'm curious about why he was included in the film, but only a little.)
I spent a lot of time trying to find out the WHY for the hoax, but I don't think any of us can say "I know why Michael hoaxed his death".
"I believe all the hoax stuff will be explained to us in due course"
I hope so. Although Elvis's fans still cannot know for sure anything...
We believe this and that, but it's really not the same when Michael was still here - I mean gave interviews, talked to his fans in person...
Try looking at some of these videos - again, if you already have. It's Mo's thread on MJ's message. And incidentally, even if this WASN'T MJ's intended message, it's something we sure all should be aware of.
Do you mean that Michael is doing this against the NWO? To wake us up?
I read a sentence in Souza & Mo's video, part 1b: "Michael Jackson is showing you that you are being LIED TO."
Well, Michael showed this to us before, and I could understand it much better than now.
by Mo: "Souza and I decided to make this series of videos after it became crystal clear to us what Mike has been talking about for many many years. He tried to make people aware of what's really going on in this world, but for some reason it didn't click. In many of his speeches, lyrics and videos he's pointing out to the men behind the curtain who rule the world, but if you have no knowledge about illuminati and NWO it's hard to get his message."
IMO it's more hard to get his message NOW, as he is not saying it himself. He is hiding and NOW it's him and his family are the ones who are lying... Confusing people. Many of his fans still believe that he is dead. So I really doubt this hoax would be the best way to wake people up.
Do you mean that Michael is doing this against the NWO? To wake us up?
I read a sentence in Souza & Mo's video, part 1b: "Michael Jackson is showing you that you are being LIED TO."
Well, Michael showed this to us before, and I could understand it much better than now.
by Mo: "Souza and I decided to make this series of videos after it became crystal clear to us what Mike has been talking about for many many years. He tried to make people aware of what's really going on in this world, but for some reason it didn't click. In many of his speeches, lyrics and videos he's pointing out to the men behind the curtain who rule the world, but if you have no knowledge about illuminati and NWO it's hard to get his message."
IMO it's more hard to get his message NOW, as he is not saying it himself. He is hiding and NOW it's him and his family are the ones who are lying... Confusing people. Many of his fans still believe that he is dead. So I really doubt this hoax would be the best way to wake people up.
Remember MJ is not a politician or an orator (although he has delivered some pretty powerful speeches) - he is primarily a musician, a performer and an artist, so these are the main ways he 'speaks' to people. IMO this hoax is the biggest 'performance' of his life, a piece of performance art, and his family and indeed we ourselves, are all part of it. When he reveals the hoax, that is when everybody who asks 'why?' will wake up. So yes, I do believe he's doing this to wake us all up, and he's fulfilling a lifelong career ambition at the same time. Hang in there, be patient, I know it's hard, confusing and overwhelming sometimes. With L.O.V.E.
Remember MJ is not a politician or an orator (although he has delivered some pretty powerful speeches) - he is primarily a musician, a performer and an artist, so these are the main ways he 'speaks' to people. IMO this hoax is the biggest 'performance' of his life, a piece of performance art, and his family and indeed we ourselves, are all part of it. When he reveals the hoax, that is when everybody who asks 'why?' will wake up. So yes, I do believe he's doing this to wake us all up, and he's fulfilling a lifelong career ambition at the same time. Hang in there, be patient, I know it's hard, confusing and overwhelming sometimes. With L.O.V.E.[/quote] i agree if people didnt take any notice before when michael comes back everyone will listen he had to do it to get the worlds attention fully love you mike
Do you mean that Michael is doing this against the NWO? To wake us up?
I read a sentence in Souza & Mo's video, part 1b: "Michael Jackson is showing you that you are being LIED TO."
Well, Michael showed this to us before, and I could understand it much better than now.
by Mo: "Souza and I decided to make this series of videos after it became crystal clear to us what Mike has been talking about for many many years. He tried to make people aware of what's really going on in this world, but for some reason it didn't click. In many of his speeches, lyrics and videos he's pointing out to the men behind the curtain who rule the world, but if you have no knowledge about illuminati and NWO it's hard to get his message."
IMO it's more hard to get his message NOW, as he is not saying it himself. He is hiding and NOW it's him and his family are the ones who are lying... Confusing people. Many of his fans still believe that he is dead. So I really doubt this hoax would be the best way to wake people up.
Remember MJ is not a politician or an orator (although he has delivered some pretty powerful speeches) - he is primarily a musician, a performer and an artist, so these are the main ways he 'speaks' to people. IMO this hoax is the biggest 'performance' of his life, a piece of performance art, and his family and indeed we ourselves, are all part of it. When he reveals the hoax, that is when everybody who asks 'why?' will wake up. So yes, I do believe he's doing this to wake us all up, and he's fulfilling a lifelong career ambition at the same time. Hang in there, be patient, I know it's hard, confusing and overwhelming sometimes. With L.O.V.E.
I'm really worried that if Michael reveals he faked his death because he wanted to wake people up, most people will react negatively - finding him a weirdo, more than before. Michael is really not a politican. He is a very good, intelligent man, but I don't think he has the experience in politics to be able to predict/foresee how people will react to his actions. It's hard to foresee even for the greatest politician.
And I wouldn't be happy either if he faked his death for this reason. Because I absolutely doubt that enough people would listen to him to make a real change regarding the NWO, or the Illuminati. And IMO those people are too powerful... So if he faked his death for fighting against them, I'm afraid he caused a huge sadness and confusion for nothing. But I don't really think he is doing this hoax for this reason. Of course, I'm only guessing...
The other thing is that I only can find it acceptable if Michael is faking his death because his or someone's life was/is in serious danger. Otherwise I find lying this big a bad thing. Even from Michael. His lie made millions of fans very sad. He is responsible for his fans - he has no choice. (Many fans say MJ deserves to live a happy life now, as people think he is dead, but life is not always about what we deserve. He has fans, and he knows it.)
What bothers me is that I don't think his or anyone's life was in danger. I might be wrong, but I believe it was Michael as DD on LKL, so if he had dangerous enemies, he wouldn't have showed them that he is alive. Maybe there is another acceptable reason for hoaxing his death which I haven't thought of yet...
Don't get me wrong, I love Michael, and I want him to be happy, I'm just worried...
<!-- s:oops: -->:oops:<!-- s:oops: --> I kinda am in love with orange pants guy. <!-- s:oops: -->:oops:<!-- s:oops: --> I hope it's Michael. Watching him I feel that matronly need to feed him and fatten him up a bit. <!-- s --><!-- s -->
During this long year I've learned that Michael is all about illusion.When I first went to see TII, I cringed every time orange pants danced. But now I feel pretty confident it's all Michael. He is acting when he's in the orange pants. And I believe he is enjoying tantelyzing and "torturing" us, all for LOVE! I could be wrong obviously. Just as 02 guy is MJ acting like a double too. It's subtle.
I have always said the 02 Guy is Michael acting as a double as well he was definatly acting out something and i dont understand .Glad I am not the only one that thinks that.
:oops: I kinda am in love with orange pants guy. <!-- s:oops: -->:oops:<!-- s:oops: --> I hope it's Michael. Watching him I feel that matronly need to feed him and fatten him up a bit. <!-- s --><!-- s -->
Orange pants isn't Michael in my opinion orange pants is very robotic in his moves while Michael is very fluid, I'm not sure what song it was but they did a split between orange pants and grey suit which I think is Michael he was dancing way more fluid while orange pants looked like he was forcing it they were comparing that sideway moonwalk move I think it was wanna be starting something if I'm not mistaken
During this long year I've learned that Michael is all about illusion.When I first went to see TII, I cringed every time orange pants danced. But now I feel pretty confident it's all Michael. He is acting when he's in the orange pants. And I believe he is enjoying tantalizing and "torturing" us, all for LOVE! I could be wrong obviously. Just as 02 guy is MJ acting like a double too. It's subtle.
Thank you so much for taking the words right out of my mouth MJonmind!! Great minds think alike! <!-- s;) -->;)<!-- s;) --> I had just said this stuff about Michael and his illusions on the other thread about his hands. Just because Michael moves differently, or acts differently than we have ever seen him before doesn't mean it's not him. I put nothing past Michael...he loves illusions, and I think like you he was messing with us so to speak. I LOVE you Michael!! <!-- s:) -->:)<!-- s:) -->
I agree and have been saying it from the beginning. Illusion, distraction and misdirection...the magic.
Doubles = Dualism not a physical double and many other clues lead to dualism as well.
I watched that video and all I can say is that when I see the Michael dressing in black I have one reaction and when I see the orange pants Michael I react in other way.
For some strange reason I see 2 Michaels but not as "different" in bodies but in Aura. Like 2 different personalities.
Still, the orange pants Michael does not look like Michael to me, not at all.
Black jacket Michael is the one that makes my heart bit in a different way, so should be the right one <!-- s;) -->;)<!-- s;) --> (this has been scientifically proven.... <!-- s:roll: -->:roll:<!-- s:roll: --> )
Comments
Well in TII, they did keep switching back and forth during the same song - to MJ in different modes of dress, including red pants guy - but you couldn't see his face up close in a lot of the frames - I think the close-ups were definitely MJ but those film from further away were not.
that is most likely what went on.imo
i have wondered before if now is the first time the question of doubles has come up or if it had sometime in the past.
He used doubles b4, why wouldnt he use them again? Mike may have worn thr orange pants for some scences, but not everyone. He's not dumb, he knew what he was doing. Why do you think Joe said he believes there were doubles used? It was a clue, and a hint for the general public to look @ the movie differently. Unfortunatetly. it didnt work.
<!-- l -->viewtopic.php?f=17&t=1539<!-- l -->
Hot pants is def. not mike!!!
I hope when Mike comes back he tells us all about the doubles etc..
Like the other poster said....MJ holds your attention....red trousers guy doesn't. ....though no disrespect to to him...it's just MJ is a near impossible act to follow.
For me, the guy wearing the orange pants, moves way less good than Michael ever did. It crossed my mind too, that it can be Michael though, playing that he can't dance... But WHY?
Michael always said he wanted to do perfect films, videos, everything. To put a double into TII or Michael dancing in a funny way makes the film unperfect.
Can the orange pants guy's strange dance be a message? I don't think so - mainly because we still don't know what to think of it... If it is a message, it is quite unclear.
So WHY does the guy wearing the orange pants dance that strange???? We still don't get it, but there must be some reason...
I will wait for Michael telling the truth about it. Basically I don't like to look for messages and clues given by Michael during this hoax, as most of what fans found can be misunderstood and are so unclear. We don't know for sure what is coming from Michael and what do they mean. We are just wasting are time with trying to understand WHY Michael did this and that in this past year. Sorry for telling my honest opninion, but it's quite bothering that we still doesn't know the truth.
Do you not understand WHY MJ has done this? I think we know the truth about what MJ's reason/message is and that's what's really important, not whether orange pants guy was a double! Spend your time reading and researching that and you won't be wasting your time. I believe all the hoax stuff will be explained to us in due course.
@ MJmakesmespeechless
I absolutely agree with you.
@ LoveNeedsExpression
Do you know why Joe said this?
How I can rememer he was on day on a big baseball game, but I'm not sure. And there were people of the press. They asked Joe over and over again about Michael. At least he simply wanted to be left alone, so he said this double story. So the press guys had their story and Joe his quiet.
no, honestly, I don't understand why Michael is doing this. But I would really love to. And I also think this is what counts.
(I don't really care about the orange pants guy, although I find it strange that he danced liked that in TII. I'm curious about why he was included in the film, but only a little.)
I spent a lot of time trying to find out the WHY for the hoax, but I don't think any of us can say "I know why Michael hoaxed his death".
"I believe all the hoax stuff will be explained to us in due course"
I hope so. Although Elvis's fans still cannot know for sure anything...
We believe this and that, but it's really not the same when Michael was still here - I mean gave interviews, talked to his fans in person...
Try looking at some of these videos - again, if you already have. It's Mo's thread on MJ's message. And incidentally, even if this WASN'T MJ's intended message, it's something we sure all should be aware of.
<!-- l -->viewtopic.php?f=74&t=10035#p169034<!-- l -->
I read a sentence in Souza & Mo's video, part 1b: "Michael Jackson is showing you that you are being LIED TO."
Well, Michael showed this to us before, and I could understand it much better than now.
by Mo: "Souza and I decided to make this series of videos after it became crystal clear to us what Mike has been talking about for many many years. He tried to make people aware of what's really going on in this world, but for some reason it didn't click. In many of his speeches, lyrics and videos he's pointing out to the men behind the curtain who rule the world, but if you have no knowledge about illuminati and NWO it's hard to get his message."
IMO it's more hard to get his message NOW, as he is not saying it himself. He is hiding and NOW it's him and his family are the ones who are lying... Confusing people. Many of his fans still believe that he is dead. So I really doubt this hoax would be the best way to wake people up.
Remember MJ is not a politician or an orator (although he has delivered some pretty powerful speeches) - he is primarily a musician, a performer and an artist, so these are the main ways he 'speaks' to people. IMO this hoax is the biggest 'performance' of his life, a piece of performance art, and his family and indeed we ourselves, are all part of it. When he reveals the hoax, that is when everybody who asks 'why?' will wake up. So yes, I do believe he's doing this to wake us all up, and he's fulfilling a lifelong career ambition at the same time. Hang in there, be patient, I know it's hard, confusing and overwhelming sometimes. With L.O.V.E.
And I wouldn't be happy either if he faked his death for this reason. Because I absolutely doubt that enough people would listen to him to make a real change regarding the NWO, or the Illuminati. And IMO those people are too powerful... So if he faked his death for fighting against them, I'm afraid he caused a huge sadness and confusion for nothing. But I don't really think he is doing this hoax for this reason. Of course, I'm only guessing...
The other thing is that I only can find it acceptable if Michael is faking his death because his or someone's life was/is in serious danger. Otherwise I find lying this big a bad thing. Even from Michael. His lie made millions of fans very sad. He is responsible for his fans - he has no choice. (Many fans say MJ deserves to live a happy life now, as people think he is dead, but life is not always about what we deserve. He has fans, and he knows it.)
What bothers me is that I don't think his or anyone's life was in danger. I might be wrong, but I believe it was Michael as DD on LKL, so if he had dangerous enemies, he wouldn't have showed them that he is alive. Maybe there is another acceptable reason for hoaxing his death which I haven't thought of yet...
Don't get me wrong, I love Michael, and I want him to be happy, I'm just worried...
You are certainly NOT <!-- s;) -->;)<!-- s;) -->
That is so cute. haha
Doubles = Dualism not a physical double and many other clues lead to dualism as well.
L.O.V.E. & Light
For some strange reason I see 2 Michaels but not as "different" in bodies but in Aura. Like 2 different personalities.
Still, the orange pants Michael does not look like Michael to me, not at all.
Black jacket Michael is the one that makes my heart bit in a different way, so should be the right one <!-- s;) -->;)<!-- s;) --> (this has been scientifically proven.... <!-- s:roll: -->:roll:<!-- s:roll: --> )