<br />@Ford...SUPER congrats on your new job!!!! That is SO exciting...and, I'm sure, also a bit scary...but you will do great! Believe in yourself...you ARE great bearhug<br /><br />Don't stay away for too long, though...you are appreciated, valued and loved ::P<br /><br />Good luck!<br /><br />With L.O.V.E. always.<br />
<br /><br />OH thank you so very much and thanks for the vote of confidence I start on Monday, but have to get prepared with my dobes being alone..I'll be checking in "sometime"...I hope.<br />Love to you...keep on hoaxing...and let me know if something BIG comes up!
I think BEC did a great job at clarifying things related to hoax-Numerology in her post.<br />I'll try to add my way of understanding and seeing Numerology too.<br />Bec , I respect your view and you'll see that even though I agree with 80% of what you said, there are some parts where... I can't say I disagree, but maybe I complete what you said with my own perspective.... <br /><br />
on 1326906018:
<br />[...]<br /> These numerical elements that appear with tremendous frequency in all things hoax related could either be <br />[size=14pt]1) coincidences <br />or<br /> 2) by design.[/size]
or <br />3) by God's will<br /><br />The following data cannot be explained by the first 2 points mentioned by you, Bec, but in my opinion, these data can only be explained by God's will! While one can plan the dates on which some hoax-events will happen, I think everybody agrees no one can PLAN their own birthday. So there's definitely a 3rd option here - GOD, just my opinion and everything hoax-related had been planned starting from these already divinely set-up numbers. And I will try to explain my opinion and I will give more arguments to sustain my opinion, just below my numerology-demonstration here:<br /><br />A VERY important hoax-number, occurring very often both in Elvis & MJ hoax [we also saw Dr. Murray wearing a t-shirt with it] <br />is NUMBER 24 [which is Backwards or Reversed: 42-- the age Elvis "died"]<br /><br />- 24 = 8 + 8 + 8 or 888 [no. 8 is Elvis' number]<br />- 42 = 7 + 7 + 7 +7 +7 +7 or 777 777 [no. 7 is Michael's number]<br />- The 3 most important hoax-numbers sum: 7 + 8 + 9 = 24 <br />- Elvis “death” month + day: 16+8= 24 <br />- Elvis "death"year: 1+9+7+7 = 24 <br />- Elvis comeback in 1968: 1+9+6+8 = 24 <br />- Lisa Marie's birthday year: 1+9+6+8 = 24<br />- Michael’s birthday-anniversary in 2012: 8 + 2 + 9 + 2 + 1 + 2 = 24<br />- Michael ‘s birthday-date: 8+2+9+1+9+5+8 = 42 - the age Elvis "died"<br />- Michael’s “death”-date: 6+ 2 + 5 + 2 + 9 = 24<br />So Elvis significant numbers 42 & 24 perfectly match the total sums of Michael's birthday-date [42] & death-date [24] How funny! Can it be all a Coincidence? Can it be all just a man-made PLAN? or Does God have a 'hand' in this too?<br /><br /><br />*** I think that, as Bec said, the hoax is planned based on intentional figures and events meant to happen at a specific time! Why? maybe because:<br />1. doing everything by the numbers, namely doing calculated things, one can hardly make mistakes! carefully planned, calculated actions = the way to PERFECTION! I think we all know "someone" very dear to all of us, who has always been a PERFECTION seeker!<br />2. the belief that doing everything by the numbers, and not just any numbers, but the DIVINE ones, ensures the success of the plan<br />3. doing everything by the numbers represents the perfect proof that nothing was accidental, that there was a plan with a purpose and not just a capricious game<br />4. doing everything by the numbers made the perfect connection to Elvis' hoax!<br />and I could go on and on like this....<br /><br />*** But I also think these intentional figures were not just randomly chosen to plan the hoax, but these numbers were intentionally chosen to fit the divine figures already planned by God. Why would Michael chose no. 7 and not no. 2 , for example? Well here is a possible explanation: The Number 7 in Scripture and here: THE AMAZING FIRST VERSE OF THE BIBLE <br /><br />*** I think that both Elvis and Michael, realized that God's perfect creation is based on Numbers: think about how everything surrounding us is all about numbers! the Bible, the musical notes, everything in this world seems to exist because of Numbers! This would explain why, being so faithful and spiritual persons, both Elvis and Michael were so passioned by Numerology! I think they studied this "pseudoscience" because they believed it would get them to a better understanding of God's message, it brought them closer to God....<br /><br />[size=12pt]I think Elvis' words explain it best: "People who put down God, don't realize there is an order in the universe: the seasons, the movements of the planets, the harmony of words and numbers. We have no order unless it is by design. -He smiled- And no design without a designer."[/size]<br /><br />- I marked in red the word "universe" in Elvis' quote because I remember how Lisa Marie, in that Oprah interview about Michael's "death", I remember how at one point she looked upwards saying she's asking the universe (namely God) for answers as to why the circumstances of her father's death and Michael's death "were so identical, play by play by play" !!! I think this speaks volumes about what is happening "behind the curtains" of the hoax!! Who are the designer(s) of this hoax and what Lisa Marie really knows!! <br />- I marked in purple the word "by design" because I found it interesting that Bec used it in this context, just like Elvis... and something tells me Bec was unaware of this Elvis' quote... Am I right or wrong, Bec? <br /><br /><br />
on 1326906018:
Because we all agree that numerology is a pseudoscience, we accept that their appearances are not divinely inspired. This leaves few possibilities as to WHO designed their inclusion. Many accept that MJ himself designed their inclusion, NOT GOD.
I agree...I accept that Elvis and Michael designed their death hoax, BUT by certain numbers that they thought were indicated to them by God.<br /><br />
on 1326906018:
If anyone were touting that god (or even fate) was responsible for these numbers showing up in this hoax, you could refute that theory by offering the fact that numerology is a pseudoscience and you'd be right. [...]
Numerology is a pseudoscience, ok.<br />Fate is not responsible for all numerological connections in the hoax, ok.<br />God is not responsible for all numerological connections in the hoax, ok. <br />BUT the numerological connections in the hoax were designed to fit certain God given numbers that influenced the lives and careers of both Elvis & Michael!<br /><br />^^ This is how I see this whole Numerology trick related to the hoax. Everything is just my opinion, based on my own research that I started doing after reading TS' messages about Numerology.<br /> I don't claim to be right on everything I said here. I may be wrong on certain points, I hope the BAM will clarify everything in the end!<br /><br />@scorpionchik: I hope i could help you a little bit, since you asked for some clarifications. I tried... I cannot get any clearer than that and I hope that TS will step in to make the necessary corrections and / or to complete with further enlightening information what Bec and I have said here...<br /><br />This subject really interests me the MOST since it led me to all those fascinating discoveries about Elvis! So I'd be very happy to read more of what TS has to say on Numerology! bearhug
<br />@MissG: before I start asking you some questions, I'd like to tell you that I appreciate you very much for your original points of view, very cleverly expressed and especially for your polite, civilized tone. Not only you don't offend nor patronize anyone of us who have definitely a very different opinion from yours, but you also manage to have a conversation with opposing interlocutors. That's rare! and I love this! I just wanted you to know this.<br />Everything I wrote in this paragraph is also available to Anna! <br /><br />Now, let's continue with our contradictory discussion <br /><br />
on 1326856905:
<br />[...]TS to me is NOT one who is manipulating in order to gather a congregation of supporters for some unknown agenda but Front, and not to gather a congregation but to have an audience to be entertain with, not the other way around.
1. How do you envision someone's entertainment as you mentioned above^^? <br />I mean if Front likes to have an audience here (even as small as 20-30 people like on this forum and a few hundred others who just watch , but by not participating you can never know if they read Front's messages in particular, so we stick to 20-30 people), ok so I repeat: if you think Front is entertained by fooling around with this audience here, I tried to put myself in the shoes of such a person and I thought: how entertaining can it be? to play pretend as an insider to some 20-30 MJ believers, by writing a post or two per week, not more, giving them cryptic messages as you say, false clues, writing jokes, making some snippets with lyrics bashing the media, and you can add anything that Front-the faker seems to be doing here. I thought and I thought from the faker's perspective, but I couldn't find the entertainment! what's so funny about it? I mean at the beginning: you can have fun receiving all the posters' attention, receiving loving messages, you can feel good about yourself knowing that some 20-30 people wait impatiently for your next post, then you can laugh at believers at first, for 2-3 days, even weeks, but then, it's gotta become extremely boring, even for a mentally disturbed person who would do such a thing. So please tell me what do you think that Front, who in your view is a faker, who entertains himself with the 20 people audience here, what do you think he finds so entertaining about his fake game?<br />2. And if you think that it's not TS the one who manipulates, but only Front, then how do you explain TS validating Front? I mean in this case they either have to be both manipulators/fakers or neither of them!<br />
<br /><br />Thanks for your words. they are really appreciated.<br /><br />-"So please tell me what do you think that Front, who in your view is a faker, who entertains himself with the 20 people audience here, what do you think he finds so entertaining about his fake game?"<br /><br />I don´t say that Front is a faker but it is clear that he/she is evasive about giving a straight answer= "I AM NOT MJ PEOPLE"<br /><br />He/ she is being entertained by all of this back and forwards in his/her forum name and doesn´t mediate to stop it It is obvious that the hype is liked as well as the gossip and the cat fights... either pro or vs.<br />Everybody stand up for him/her but he/she rarely or never stands up for anyone.<br /><br />Beside all this, he/ she gets tons of appreciation and love messages and support (also hate) and people listen to his/ her music so he/she gets a feedback.<br /><br />In resume...he/she got followers expecting a word from him/her. What a great audience and a dose of ego!<br /><br />
<br />Really, do you honestly think that Michael could tell us directly that he's Michael? <br />
<br /><br />After seeing how people is still affected, yes.<br />
<br /><br />Yes and ruin his security and risk failure of the Hoax plans? Michael "faked his death" so he must make the world believe he is "dead". So how do you expect him to directly tell us? In which manner can he do that? I don't understand this at all.<br />
TS to me is NOT one who is manipulating in order to gather a congregation of supporters for some unknown agenda but Front, and not to gather a congregation but to have an audience to be entertain with, not the other way around.
<br /><br />That doesn't make sense at all suspicious// because TS has validated Front many times through his redirects. Not to mention all the validation from MJ's family and official MJ Facebook page. Not just once -- not twice -- but several times. rr/<br /><br />
<br /><br />Makes sense since both are 2 different characters, as shown in their posts.<br /><br />They may have validated each other but Michael´s family has not validated them.
<br />Really, do you honestly think that Michael could tell us directly that he's Michael? <br />
<br /><br />After seeing how people is still affected, yes.<br />
<br /><br />Yes and ruin his security and risk failure of the Hoax plans? Michael "faked his death" so he must make the world believe he is "dead". So how do you expect him to directly tell us? In which manner can he do that? I don't understand this at all.<br /><br />
<br />Agree Sarahli!<br />And: if he showed up on the forum posting "YES my dear hoax family, I am really MJ"....just imagine what would happen...even more accusations and "He´s a fake" outcry!
<br />Really, do you honestly think that Michael could tell us directly that he's Michael? <br />
<br /><br />After seeing how people is still affected, yes.<br />
<br /><br />Yes and ruin his security and risk failure of the Hoax plans? Michael "faked his death" so he must make the world believe he is "dead". So how do you expect him to directly tell us? In which manner can he do that? I don't understand this at all.<br /><br />
<br /><br />If would be a question for security the hoax rumors would have been addressed drastically from day 1, just in case.<br />Even if just a bunch of hoaxers actually write in here, there are thousands who doubt if MJ is dead.<br /><br />My view is that when someone wants to be noticed without a doubt, that person does all the necessary to deliver the message direct and clear.<br />If "real MJ" would want us to know for real, just no by faith or logic, that he is alive and communicating with us, he would use other ways.<br /><br />I perceive Michael (after watching his speeches in TII for a couple of times) as a kind loving person and quite direct when communicating his message. He definitely would use a kind loving approach, assuming he is the man shown in TII for real.<br /><br />
<br />[...]TS to me is NOT one who is manipulating in order to gather a congregation of supporters for some unknown agenda but Front, and not to gather a congregation but to have an audience to be entertain with, not the other way around.
[...]<br />2. And if you think that it's not TS the one who manipulates, but only Front, then how do you explain TS validating Front? I mean in this case they either have to be both manipulators/fakers or neither of them!<br />
<br /><br />
on 1326933738:
<br />I don´t say that Front is a faker but it is clear that he/she is evasive about giving a straight answer= "I AM NOT MJ PEOPLE"
<br /><br />@MissG: Thank you for your answer. <br />In my opinion, you don't have a clear perception of neither Front or TS because from what I see in the 2 quotes above ^^ you contradict yourself.<br /><br />Or maybe it's me who doesn't understand what you want to say. Please help me understand how you see Front.<br />- In your first statement, you clearly said that TS is not a manipulator, but that Front is a manipulator.<br />- In your second statement you said that Front is not a faker [it was me who understood that from your first quote, because to me: manipulator =faker], but just an evasive person who is entertained by making people believe he is MJ<br /><br />So to you, in this given context, being a manipulator does not equal faker?<br />I mean you consider Front to be a manipulator, but not a faker?<br />So, what you say is that Front is authentic [insider or MJ], but he's a manipulator because he doesn't clearly say that he is or that he is NOT MJ?<br />So, by this logic, Front = MJ and/or insider = manipulator = entertained ?<br />I think you just might be right! [size=8pt][hi Mike! hope you're having a great time watching YOUR show! ][/size]<br />We finally agree! But I also think that you just don't realize that right now, MissG.<br />That of course, unless it's me who didn't understand what you wanted to say.<br />So please correct me if I got it all wrong.<br /><br /><br /><br />
on 1326856905:
Everybody stand up for him/her but he/she rarely or never stands up for anyone.
<br />And who do you want Front to stand up for ? <br />In your opinion, is there anyone here that needs to be protected by Front?<br />Are we helpless? Aren't we able to defend ourselves and our opinions against those who contradict us?<br />We need Front to step in and help us?<br /><br />I will answer those questions ^^ for myself: <br />I don't stand up for Front nor for TS. <br />I stand up for my own beliefs and convictions!<br />I don't need Front to stand up for me when I have a contradictory conversation with the opponents here.<br />I think I can do just fine by myself.<br /><br /><br />I only need TS and/or Front to help me find more answers about my questions that I expressed in this topic here: "Questions for TS (& anyone else) about ELVIS (Jesse)" and also in the Numerology message I posted previously^^ in this current topic. Thank you for everything! bearhug
TS to me is NOT one who is manipulating in order to gather a congregation of supporters for some unknown agenda but Front, and not to gather a congregation but to have an audience to be entertain with, not the other way around.
<br /><br />That doesn't make sense at all suspicious// because TS has validated Front many times through his redirects. Not to mention all the validation from MJ's family and official MJ Facebook page. Not just once -- not twice -- but several times. rr/<br /><br />
<br /><br />Makes sense since both are 2 different characters, as shown in their posts.<br /><br />They may have validated each other but Michael´s family has not validated them.<br />
<br /><br />As Souza said:<br />
Regardless of who Front and TS are, I think we are forgetting here that both knew certain things in advance, and both are being backed up by Michael's own family. So whoever they might be should not be important, clearly the family thinks it's important enough to support both of them. That means that there is probably something in the messages we should pay attention to.
<br /><br />There have been many connections found and so many posted in the Back/Front thread.<br /><br />@MaryK exactly this is the kind of things that would happen. I don't see how Michael can tell us now. The Hoax is still going on we must undertand that.<br /><br />MissG, concerning your answer about Michael telling us directly. I think I understand you are doubting that Michael is alive? I am not sure about this maybe you can tell more. <br /><br />Concerning Michael being kind and loving I totally agree with you on this and this Hoax is proof of that even if it doesn't meet certain people's expectations or assumptions of who is Michael and what he would or wouldn't do. To me this Hoax is proof of Michael's big kinded heart and shows how much he cares for the world. Anyway I may answer more later I need some sleep now. (there should be a sighing smiley lol).<br /><br />
@Aussie...I read the thread you posted re: some of us being mentioned in some loser's blog. I know it bothered you...but give it some time (like a minute or two). You'll see that you just don't give a rats a$$ about what haters have to say. You know who you are, just as I know who I am, just as the others mentioned know who they are....that's all that matters. Give them what they deserve...which is a big "f*ck you" *FU*, and nothing more. Then turn your focus back on Mike ::P.<br /><br />Don't forget...HE'S watchin' too.<br /><br />Oh, and speaking of 'cults'...for those avidly researching that angle...I think you found your niche. Woof, woof.<br /><br />With L.O.V.E. always.<br /><br />
I think BEC did a great job at clarifying things related to hoax-Numerology in her post.<br />I'll try to add my way of understanding and seeing Numerology too.<br />Bec , I respect your view and you'll see that even though I agree with 80% of what you said, there are some parts where... I can't say I disagree, but maybe I complete what you said with my own perspective.... <br /><br />
on 1326906018:
<br />[...]<br /> These numerical elements that appear with tremendous frequency in all things hoax related could either be <br />[size=14pt]1) coincidences <br />or<br /> 2) by design.[/size]
or <br />3) by God's will<br /><br />The following data cannot be explained by the first 2 points mentioned by you, Bec, but in my opinion, these data can only be explained by God's will! While one can plan the dates on which some hoax-events will happen, I think everybody agrees no one can PLAN their own birthday. So there's definitely a 3rd option here - GOD, just my opinion and everything hoax-related had been planned starting from these already divinely set-up numbers.<br /><snip for ease of reviewing><br />So Elvis significant numbers 42 & 24 perfectly match the total sums of Michael's birthday-date [42] & death-date [24] How funny! Can it be all a Coincidence? Can it be all just a man-made PLAN? or Does God have a 'hand' in this too?
<br /><br />Respectfully, I don't want to tread to much into the God department because I'm out of my element there. I won't dispute your faith and I do think it noteworthy the numbers that you compiled. I do acknowledge that both MJ and Elvis are into numerology, that is a fact. I'll go into this more later but for now, I think that however legitimate your beliefs are and however accurate they may be, this is a debate irrelevant to the topic. Reason being, both men had to have discovered these numbers at some point. It is possible that Elvis pointed this out to MJ. It is very possible that because MJ was into numerology (or became into it), that once MJ became aware of them, these numbers were also incorporated into the hoax by Michael's design. But who knows?<br /><br />
on 1326933558:
*** I think that, as Bec said, the hoax is planned based on intentional figures and events meant to happen at a specific time! Why? maybe because:<br />1. doing everything by the numbers, namely doing calculated things, one can hardly make mistakes! carefully planned, calculated actions = the way to PERFECTION! I think we all know "someone" very dear to all of us, who has always been a PERFECTION seeker!<br />2. the belief that doing everything by the numbers, and not just any numbers, but the DIVINE ones, ensures the success of the plan<br />3. doing everything by the numbers represents the perfect proof that nothing was accidental, that there was a plan with a purpose and not just a capricious game<br />4. doing everything by the numbers made the perfect connection to Elvis' hoax!<br />and I could go on and on like this....
<br /><br />Yes to all of the above. Also adding, to word it another way, doing everything by these numbers probably just plain old brings good luck. It's same reason I turn the volume on the stereo to 16 or 18 (and sometimes 21 hehe), the same reason I fill up at pump 7, the same reason I sit in chair 21, the same reason I get excited when assigned number 304 in competition. It's just a thing. The numbers, for Michael, bring luck and help facilitate success. They don't ensure it... they just offer good karma.<br /><br />If you're into numbers, and you're working on a project that really REALLY matters, and you have the choice, you're going to incorporate the best numbers into everything that you can.<br /><br />The numerology may not have been included for any reason OTHER THEN---->it being important to MJ. Their first priority may simply be to MJ and to satisfy his beliefs and what he needs to feel comfortable and confident and at his best... not as clues for us as we have all speculated to some extent or another. We assume the numbers are clues left for US, but we don't really know that.<br /><br />
on 1326933558:
- I marked in purple the word "by design" because I found it interesting that Bec used it in this context, just like Elvis... and something tells me Bec was unaware of this Elvis' quote... Am I right or wrong, Bec?
<br /><br />You are right, I was not aware of that, but to be fair it's a fairly common phrase to indicate the opposite of a naturally occurring or chance act. By design is the opposite of by accident, that's how I was using it.<br /><br /><br />
on 1326933558:
on 1326906018:
Because we all agree that numerology is a pseudoscience, we accept that their appearances are not divinely inspired. This leaves few possibilities as to WHO designed their inclusion. Many accept that MJ himself designed their inclusion, NOT GOD.
I agree...I accept that Elvis and Michael designed their death hoax, BUT by certain numbers that they thought were indicated to them by God.<br /><br />
on 1326906018:
If anyone were touting that god (or even fate) was responsible for these numbers showing up in this hoax, you could refute that theory by offering the fact that numerology is a pseudoscience and you'd be right. [...]
Numerology is a pseudoscience, ok.<br />Fate is not responsible for all numerological connections in the hoax, ok.<br />God is not responsible for all numerological connections in the hoax, ok. <br />BUT the numerological connections in the hoax were designed to fit certain God given numbers that influenced the lives and careers of both Elvis & Michael!
<br /><br />I cannot disagree with you there Great discussion, thanks, Sim.<br /><br />Again, the bottom line as I understand it is this (@scorpionchick, don't forget this whole side discussion is in direct reply to your post):<br /><br />Numerology is important to MJ. Numerology is incorporated throughout the hoax. This indicates that the hoax was created and implemented by design (by someone!=MJ), not by chance (coincidence=dead).<br /><br />All beliefs regarding numerology are irrelevant, because numerology is not in question. It exists. In MJ's hoax it is everywhere. This is an undisputed fact. The only question remains, WHO incorporated the numerology? Well, probably MJ, right? Who else would?
Bec, I’m glad you’re enjoying trying to use numbers in carrying out daily tasks, but imagine MJ having to live out all the numbers. How frantic if something didn’t work out because of some unforseen problem, and they had to scrap some angle, but no, I get a picture of MJ unhurried, loving his children and people around him, and while living his life, the numbers fell into place. That’s indeed a God thing happening IMO.<br /><br />MissG<br />
I perceive Michael (after watching his speeches in TII for a couple of times) as a kind loving person and quite direct when communicating his message. He definitely would use a kind loving approach, assuming he is the man shown in TII for real.
<br />This is true but... and there are a lot of buts! For example:<br />
“One time I took pictures of him while he was in bed because he was late for a meeting I’d set up and wouldn’t get up. He was like, “Todd, I’m gonna get you for that!<br /> And he did. I’d forgotten all about what happened while he was performing one night and he’d told me to stand in a specific spot to take photos of him when he began singing that song. I did as I was instructed. So right before I go to take my position, Michael drops to his back and starts saying, “Help me, help me! I need some woman to touch me!” and every woman in that place collapsed on me. I was between them and Michael and I couldn’t even get one shot in and he gave me this look like, I got you.<br /><br /> Afterwards, I said you think you’re so cute, and he says, “What do you mean, Todd?” I’m like, Mike that hurt; those people were crushing me and all he said: “Todd, the spirit just takes me sometimes and the spirit just took me.” That’s when I knew that was payback and that was the last time I stepped out of line with him” - Todd Gray<br />MJFAN7 http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/smf2.0/index.php?topic=6765.msg385454#msg3854
<br /><br />SimPattyK<br />
A VERY important hoax-number, occurring very often both in Elvis & MJ hoax [we also saw Dr. Murray wearing a t-shirt with it] <br /> is NUMBER24 [which is Backwards or Reversed: [color=rgb(50, 205, 50)]42[/color]-- the age Elvis "died"]<br /> <br /> - 24 = 8 + 8 + 8 or 888 [no. 8 is Elvis' number]<br /> - [color=rgb(50, 205, 50)]42[/color] = 7 + 7 + 7 +7 +7 +7 or 777 777 [no. 7 is Michael's number]<br /> - The 3 most important hoax-numbers sum: [color=rgb(165, 42, 42)]7[/color] + 8 + 9 = 24 <br /> - Elvis “death” month + day: 16+8= 24 <br /> - Elvis "death"year: 1+9+7+7 = 24 <br /> - Elvis comeback in 1968: 1+9+6+8 = 24 <br /> - Lisa Marie's birthday year: 1+9+6+8 = 24<br /> - Michael’s birthday-anniversary in 2012: 8 + 2 + 9 + 2 + 1 + 2 = 24<br /> - Michael ‘s birthday-date: 8+2+9+1+9+5+8 = [color=rgb(50, 205, 50)]42[/color] - the age Elvis "died"<br /> - Michael’s “death”-date: 6+ 2 + 5 + 2 + 9 = 24<br /> So Elvis significant numbers [color=rgb(50, 205, 50)]42[/color] & 24 perfectly match the total sums of Michael's [color=rgb(50, 205, 50)]birthday-date [42][/color] & death-date [24] How funny! Can it be all a Coincidence? Can it be all just a man-made PLAN? or Does God have a 'hand' in this too?<br />*** I think that, as Bec said, the hoax is planned based on intentional figures and events meant to happen at a specific time! Why? maybe because:<br /> 1. doing everything by the numbers, namely doing calculated things, one can hardly make mistakes! carefully planned, calculated actions = the way to PERFECTION! I think we all know "someone" very dear to all of us, who has always been a PERFECTION seeker!<br /> 2. the belief that doing everything by the numbers, and not just any numbers, but the DIVINE ones, ensures the success of the plan<br /> 3. doing everything by the numbers represents the perfect proof that nothing was accidental, that there was a plan with a purpose and not just a capricious game<br /> 4. doing everything by the numbers made the perfect connection to Elvis' hoax!<br /> and I could go on and on like this....<br /> <br /> *** But I also think these intentional figures were not just randomly chosen to plan the hoax, but these numbers were intentionally chosen to fit the divine figures already planned by God. Why would Michael chose no. 7 and not no. 2 , for example? Well here is a possible explanation: [color=rgb(64, 0, 64)]The Number 7 in Scripture [/color]and here: [color=rgb(64, 0, 64)]THE AMAZING FIRST VERSE OF THE BIBLE [/color]<br /> <br /> *** I think that both Elvis and Michael, realized that God's perfect creation is based on Numbers: think about how everything surrounding us is all about numbers! the Bible, the musical notes, everything in this world seems to exist because of Numbers! This would explain why, being so faithful and spiritual persons, both Elvis and Michael were so passioned by Numerology! I think they studied this "pseudoscience" because they believed it would get them to a better understanding of God's message, it brought them closer to God....<br /> <br /> I think Elvis' words explain it best: "People who put down God, don't realize there is an order in the universe: the seasons, the movements of the planets, the harmony of words and numbers. We have no order unless it is by design. -He smiled- And no design without a designer."
<br />Great work, thanks so much!<br /><br />BeTheChange<br />
But what if he IS telling us what we need to do to understand things more but you're disregarding it because you're 'hung up' on fear or insecurity? Because there is no 'assurance' either way (i.e. we have not and will not hear from Mike directly...until he deems it's time)...then there IS a possibility that he IS 'guiding' us through TS, Front and Back in order to help us understand. No one here can claim to KNOW with 100% certainty that there is NO possibility that this is what's happening. It's been 2.5 years and NO ONE has been able to refute TS' posts with anything substantial. And if the possibility DOES exists...even if in your mind it's only a slight possibility...what harm is there in reading what could very well be coming from Mike? Has TS ever asked anyone for money or for their personal info or to do ANYTHING that would be dangerous? People are so quick to caution about 'reading' TS' posts...yet they have no problem sending their kids off to school everyday to read, learn and be 'taught' half-truths, slanted perspectives and, in many cases, outright lies ("history books ARE full of lies"). I just don't get it
I think BEC did a great job at clarifying things related to hoax-Numerology in her post.<br />I'll try to add my way of understanding and seeing Numerology too.<br />Bec , I respect your view and you'll see that even though I agree with 80% of what you said, there are some parts where... I can't say I disagree, but maybe I complete what you said with my own perspective.... <br /><br />
on 1326906018:
<br />[...]<br /> These numerical elements that appear with tremendous frequency in all things hoax related could either be <br />[size=14pt]1) coincidences <br />or<br /> 2) by design.[/size]
or <br />3) by God's will<br /><br />The following data cannot be explained by the first 2 points mentioned by you, Bec, but in my opinion, these data can only be explained by God's will! While one can plan the dates on which some hoax-events will happen, I think everybody agrees no one can PLAN their own birthday. So there's definitely a 3rd option here - GOD, just my opinion and everything hoax-related had been planned starting from these already divinely set-up numbers. And I will try to explain my opinion and I will give more arguments to sustain my opinion, just below my numerology-demonstration here:<br /><br />A VERY important hoax-number, occurring very often both in Elvis & MJ hoax [we also saw Dr. Murray wearing a t-shirt with it] <br />is NUMBER 24 [which is Backwards or Reversed: 42-- the age Elvis "died"]<br /><br />- 24 = 8 + 8 + 8 or 888 [no. 8 is Elvis' number]<br />- 42 = 7 + 7 + 7 +7 +7 +7 or 777 777 [no. 7 is Michael's number]<br />- The 3 most important hoax-numbers sum: 7 + 8 + 9 = 24 <br />- Elvis “death” month + day: 16+8= 24 <br />- Elvis "death"year: 1+9+7+7 = 24 <br />- Elvis comeback in 1968: 1+9+6+8 = 24 <br />- Lisa Marie's birthday year: 1+9+6+8 = 24<br />- Michael’s birthday-anniversary in 2012: 8 + 2 + 9 + 2 + 1 + 2 = 24<br />- Michael ‘s birthday-date: 8+2+9+1+9+5+8 = 42 - the age Elvis "died"<br />- Michael’s “death”-date: 6+ 2 + 5 + 2 + 9 = 24<br />So Elvis significant numbers 42 & 24 perfectly match the total sums of Michael's birthday-date [42] & death-date [24] How funny! Can it be all a Coincidence? Can it be all just a man-made PLAN? or Does God have a 'hand' in this too?<br /><br /><br />*** I think that, as Bec said, the hoax is planned based on intentional figures and events meant to happen at a specific time! Why? maybe because:<br />1. doing everything by the numbers, namely doing calculated things, one can hardly make mistakes! carefully planned, calculated actions = the way to PERFECTION! I think we all know "someone" very dear to all of us, who has always been a PERFECTION seeker!<br />2. the belief that doing everything by the numbers, and not just any numbers, but the DIVINE ones, ensures the success of the plan<br />3. doing everything by the numbers represents the perfect proof that nothing was accidental, that there was a plan with a purpose and not just a capricious game<br />4. doing everything by the numbers made the perfect connection to Elvis' hoax!<br />and I could go on and on like this....<br /><br />*** But I also think these intentional figures were not just randomly chosen to plan the hoax, but these numbers were intentionally chosen to fit the divine figures already planned by God. Why would Michael chose no. 7 and not no. 2 , for example? Well here is a possible explanation: The Number 7 in Scripture and here: THE AMAZING FIRST VERSE OF THE BIBLE <br /><br />*** I think that both Elvis and Michael, realized that God's perfect creation is based on Numbers: think about how everything surrounding us is all about numbers! the Bible, the musical notes, everything in this world seems to exist because of Numbers! This would explain why, being so faithful and spiritual persons, both Elvis and Michael were so passioned by Numerology! I think they studied this "pseudoscience" because they believed it would get them to a better understanding of God's message, it brought them closer to God....<br /><br />[size=12pt]I think Elvis' words explain it best: "People who put down God, don't realize there is an order in the universe: the seasons, the movements of the planets, the harmony of words and numbers. We have no order unless it is by design. -He smiled- And no design without a designer."[/size]<br /><br />- I marked in red the word "universe" in Elvis' quote because I remember how Lisa Marie, in that Oprah interview about Michael's "death", I remember how at one point she looked upwards saying she's asking the universe (namely God) for answers as to why the circumstances of her father's death and Michael's death "were so identical, play by play by play" !!! I think this speaks volumes about what is happening "behind the curtains" of the hoax!! Who are the designer(s) of this hoax and what Lisa Marie really knows!! <br />- I marked in purple the word "by design" because I found it interesting that Bec used it in this context, just like Elvis... and something tells me Bec was unaware of this Elvis' quote... Am I right or wrong, Bec? <br /><br /><br />
on 1326906018:
Because we all agree that numerology is a pseudoscience, we accept that their appearances are not divinely inspired. This leaves few possibilities as to WHO designed their inclusion. Many accept that MJ himself designed their inclusion, NOT GOD.
I agree...I accept that Elvis and Michael designed their death hoax, BUT by certain numbers that they thought were indicated to them by God.<br /><br />
on 1326906018:
If anyone were touting that god (or even fate) was responsible for these numbers showing up in this hoax, you could refute that theory by offering the fact that numerology is a pseudoscience and you'd be right. [...]
Numerology is a pseudoscience, ok.<br />Fate is not responsible for all numerological connections in the hoax, ok.<br />God is not responsible for all numerological connections in the hoax, ok. <br />BUT the numerological connections in the hoax were designed to fit certain God given numbers that influenced the lives and careers of both Elvis & Michael!<br /><br />^^ This is how I see this whole Numerology trick related to the hoax. Everything is just my opinion, based on my own research that I started doing after reading TS' messages about Numerology.<br /> I don't claim to be right on everything I said here. I may be wrong on certain points, I hope the BAM will clarify everything in the end!<br /><br />@scorpionchik: I hope i could help you a little bit, since you asked for some clarifications. I tried... I cannot get any clearer than that and I hope that TS will step in to make the necessary corrections and / or to complete with further enlightening information what Bec and I have said here...<br /><br />This subject really interests me the MOST since it led me to all those fascinating discoveries about Elvis! So I'd be very happy to read more of what TS has to say on Numerology! bearhug<br />
<br /><br />Darling, you did not clarify anything, you just repeated what has been posted here and there and added your own. No one can answer on my questions. Don't worry about it.
I never said I did.<br />I only said: "I hope I could help you a little bit, since you asked for some clarifications. I tried... I cannot get any clearer than that."<br /><br />
you just repeated what has been posted here and there and added your own.
Yes, that's what I said myself: "I'll try to add my way of understanding and seeing Numerology too."<br />So I took the information given by TS and I added what I found through my further research. <br /><br />
That's a very self assured statement. This means you already found your answers, otherwise you wouldn't be so sure about that. So you must know better. That must be feel great. I am glad for you, darling.<br />I am sorry if I thought your question was for real. I should have taken it as a rhetorical question. Sorry if I bothered you with my long answer.<br /><br />
since we are adding opinions might add mine. and i can pre-warn, that this aint going to be pretty. infact many of my fellow god fearing friends (not the JWs, those from other christian denominations) will definitely disagree with me and thats ok, each to their own. and i do respect that everyone has different standards and understanding / interpretation of the scriptures. <br /><br />ok here goes, though i am a 'god believer' i dont believe that god designed the number connection for MJ or elvis. i think it is designed by MJ inspired by elvis and based on 'godly' numbers, but CERTAINLY NOT controlled or directed by god.<br /><br />i also dont think (IMHO) god uses numbers to 'roll out events' in anyones lives. i think numbers are formulas and they are found in everything, but dont symbolise anything except math.<br /><br />i think the numerology in the hoax exists, because it was made to exist. and some perhaps (i am still not 100% on this which is why i say perhaps) is there by chance, as we all know that if you are looking for numbers, equations, connections, you can find them. not unlike when one buys a car. a random green volkswagon buggy, like none you have ever seen before. however you start driving it around and start spotting random green volkswagons everywhere! they were there all along and infact not uncommon at all, however now your attention has been drawn to them.<br /><br /><br />for those who are god believers and also believe that god directs or controls events both internal and external of MJDH, ponder this: the roots of numerology and astrology are founded in divination and magic. we know who 'powers' or 'provides' forces to divination and magic. essentially 'numerology' is the study of the occult meanings of numbers and their influence on human life. since there are no occult meanings to numbers and since numbers by themselves can have no significant influence on anyone's life, numerology is nothing but superstition masquerading as fortune telling or reading of the future or predestination.<br /><br />i agree with that statement regarding "mere supersition" in terms of numbers = predestined future, pertaining to MJDH if looking at the 'numerology' the way most of 'sociotey' view numerology. (sybolism of events based on numbers)<br /><br />however, i dont believe it is mere supersition in MJDH - i think quite the contrary. quite planned by MJ, based on Elvis' love for numbers and inspired by a godly number 777. as we know the number 777 is significant in various religious and political contexts. ... The number refers to a triumph of "God's number" 7 over the Devil's number 666.<br /><br />having said all that... we all know that MJ is a man of god. i dont think (IMHO - without knowing him personally) that he would look to numbers or stars to direct his life as this is a form of occult practice and we know how he feels about that....<br /><br />therefore it is from looking at numerology (the kind of numerology that is used in relation to lifes events) for what it is, a form of occult practice, makes me feel it is ALL planned by MJ himself. such an easy sentance to read that probably seems to diminish the importance of the numbers, but that is not my intention. what i mean is he has masterfully, carefully, strategically, exruciatingly planned by MJ to a "T" to coin a phrase.<br /><br /><br />i should finish by saying I AM NOT trying to instigate a hot debate, (although, im open to a civil one) but just saying. it is certainly something to think about it. ask, where does numerology originate? and would it be christian to subscribe to it?<br /><br />i will prelude this next sentence with the following statement: i am NOT JUDGING anyone here, i want to make that clear as i have recently been accused of acting 'holier than thou' and that could not be further from the truth as i humbly admit i am but a mere sinner and endebted to jesus and god... (finally here is my controversial sentence) however as a 'god believer' (in want of a better phrase) there is no way that i could or would interpret meaning and symbolism of lifes events based on associated numbers, as i believe that this is a form of occult practice.<br /><br />as we know wicked spirits can make events come true too. not just god. wicked spirits can tell future and fortune too. not just god. therefore this is why i personally view numberology as a form of subtle occultism. <br /><br />therefore numerology that can be found in life is either coincidental (again, seeing green volkswagon buggies everywhere) or supernatural inspired by demons and wicked spirits or perfectly planned.<br /><br />in conclusion, for me, as MJ would not be involved with anything remotely even subtly linked with spiritism (nor would i. and that includes numerology) and because the MJDH numerology is too complex to be coincidental, it has GOT TO BE perfectly, stragetically planned by MJ himself, perhaps with the 'assistance of' or at a minimum 'inspired by' elvis and based on 'spiritual and holy' numbers - in reverence / regognition / honor of their spiritual beliefs....<br /><br />i finish this post with IMHO IMHO IMHO IMHO IMHO IMHO.... <br /><br /> respect/ for you all!
from a practical and character level, MJ is a control freak and a perfectionist (love you MJ - but you know you are)<br /><br />do you think he would leave all of this (MJDH) and how complex it is, to mere chance, numbers, predestination.<br /><br />no this is a man who is in control. more in control than we can ever really understand. he controlled every little thing from day dot to now. his life, his music, his PR, the media, and why would he leave this, the most important thing, bigger than 'thriller' remember, in the hands of numbers, controlled by someone else...<br /><br />i dont think so tim!<br /><br />as i said, down to the ''T'' - every second of it. every number. every single digit!<br /><br /><br />LOVE YOU MJ - ALWAYS!!!
Some astrologers believe that each number from 0 to 9 is ruled by a celestial body in our solar system -- the layout below is one widely accepted system among modern astrologers but there are other systems as well, such as the kabbalistic system. [1]<br /> Zero is ruled by the planet Pluto.<br /> One is ruled by the Sun and the astrological aspect of the conjunction.<br /> Two is ruled by the Moon and the astrological aspect of the opposition.<br /> Three is ruled by Jupiter and the astrological aspect of the trine.<br /> Four is ruled by Sun or Uranus.<br /> Five is ruled by the planet Mercury and the astrological aspect of the quincunx.<br /> Six is ruled by the planet Venus and the astrological aspect of the sextile.<br /> Seven is ruled by the planets Moon or Neptune.<br /> Eight is ruled by the planet Saturn.<br /> Nine is ruled by the planet Mars and the astrological aspect of the square.<br /><br />these numbers are then used 'like' or in 'conjunction with' horoscopes to predict and interpret lifes events. this is the kind of 'numerology that i dont agree with as it conflicts with the bibles advice to 'flee' from spiritism.<br /><br /><br /><br />though the events may be true and future may be told by these numbers, i believe this to be powered by evil spirits, aka demons.<br /><br />the type of numerology that i do believe or better word, accept exists is:<br /><br />Scientific theories are sometimes labeled "numerology" if their primary inspiration appears to be a set of patterns rather than scientific observations. This colloquial use of the term is quite common within the scientific community and it is mostly used to dismiss a theory as questionable science.<br /> <br />The best known example of "numerology" in science involves the coincidental resemblance of certain large numbers that intrigued such eminent men as mathematical physicist Paul Dirac, mathematician Hermann Weyl and astronomer Arthur Stanley Eddington. These numerical co-incidences refer to such quantities as the ratio of the age of the universe to the atomic unit of time, the number of electrons in the universe, and the difference in strengths between gravity and the electric force for the electron and proton. ("Is the Universe Fine Tuned for Us?", Stenger, V.J., page 3[9]).<br /> <br />The discovery of atomic triads (dealing with elements primarily in the same group or column of the periodic table) was considered a form of numerology, and yet ultimately led to the construction of the periodic table. Here the atomic weight of the lightest element and the heaviest are summed, and averaged, and the average is found to be very close to that of the intermediate weight element. This didn't work with every triplet in the same group, but worked often enough to allow later workers to create generalizations. See Döbereiner's Triads<br /> <br />Large number co-incidences continue to fascinate many mathematical physicists. For instance, James G. Gilson has constructed a "Quantum Theory of Gravity" based loosely on Dirac's large number hypothesis.[10]<br /> <br />Wolfgang Pauli was also fascinated by the appearance of certain numbers, including 137, in physics.[11]<br /><br /><br />This (IMHO) is numerology or a better word the 'numerical formulas' of science.<br /><br />
I think BEC did a great job at clarifying things related to hoax-Numerology in her post.<br />I'll try to add my way of understanding and seeing Numerology too.<br />Bec , I respect your view and you'll see that even though I agree with 80% of what you said, there are some parts where... I can't say I disagree, but maybe I complete what you said with my own perspective.... <br /><br />
on 1326906018:
<br />[...]<br /> These numerical elements that appear with tremendous frequency in all things hoax related could either be <br />[size=14pt]1) coincidences <br />or<br /> 2) by design.[/size]
or <br />3) by God's will<br /><br />The following data cannot be explained by the first 2 points mentioned by you, Bec, but in my opinion, these data can only be explained by God's will! While one can plan the dates on which some hoax-events will happen, I think everybody agrees no one can PLAN their own birthday. So there's definitely a 3rd option here - GOD, just my opinion and everything hoax-related had been planned starting from these already divinely set-up numbers. And I will try to explain my opinion and I will give more arguments to sustain my opinion, just below my numerology-demonstration here:<br /><br />A VERY important hoax-number, occurring very often both in Elvis & MJ hoax [we also saw Dr. Murray wearing a t-shirt with it] <br />is NUMBER 24 [which is Backwards or Reversed: 42-- the age Elvis "died"]<br /><br />- 24 = 8 + 8 + 8 or 888 [no. 8 is Elvis' number]<br />- 42 = 7 + 7 + 7 +7 +7 +7 or 777 777 [no. 7 is Michael's number]<br />- The 3 most important hoax-numbers sum: 7 + 8 + 9 = 24 <br />- Elvis “death” month + day: 16+8= 24 <br />- Elvis "death"year: 1+9+7+7 = 24 <br />- Elvis comeback in 1968: 1+9+6+8 = 24 <br />- Lisa Marie's birthday year: 1+9+6+8 = 24<br />- Michael’s birthday-anniversary in 2012: 8 + 2 + 9 + 2 + 1 + 2 = 24<br />- Michael ‘s birthday-date: 8+2+9+1+9+5+8 = 42 - the age Elvis "died"<br />- Michael’s “death”-date: 6+ 2 + 5 + 2 + 9 = 24<br />So Elvis significant numbers 42 & 24 perfectly match the total sums of Michael's birthday-date [42] & death-date [24] How funny! Can it be all a Coincidence? Can it be all just a man-made PLAN? or Does God have a 'hand' in this too?<br /><br /><br />*** I think that, as Bec said, the hoax is planned based on intentional figures and events meant to happen at a specific time! Why? maybe because:<br />1. doing everything by the numbers, namely doing calculated things, one can hardly make mistakes! carefully planned, calculated actions = the way to PERFECTION! I think we all know "someone" very dear to all of us, who has always been a PERFECTION seeker!<br />2. the belief that doing everything by the numbers, and not just any numbers, but the DIVINE ones, ensures the success of the plan<br />3. doing everything by the numbers represents the perfect proof that nothing was accidental, that there was a plan with a purpose and not just a capricious game<br />4. doing everything by the numbers made the perfect connection to Elvis' hoax!<br />and I could go on and on like this....<br /><br />*** But I also think these intentional figures were not just randomly chosen to plan the hoax, but these numbers were intentionally chosen to fit the divine figures already planned by God. Why would Michael chose no. 7 and not no. 2 , for example? Well here is a possible explanation: The Number 7 in Scripture and here: THE AMAZING FIRST VERSE OF THE BIBLE <br /><br />*** I think that both Elvis and Michael, realized that God's perfect creation is based on Numbers: think about how everything surrounding us is all about numbers! the Bible, the musical notes, everything in this world seems to exist because of Numbers! This would explain why, being so faithful and spiritual persons, both Elvis and Michael were so passioned by Numerology! I think they studied this "pseudoscience" because they believed it would get them to a better understanding of God's message, it brought them closer to God....<br /><br />[size=12pt]I think Elvis' words explain it best: "People who put down God, don't realize there is an order in the universe: the seasons, the movements of the planets, the harmony of words and numbers. We have no order unless it is by design. -He smiled- And no design without a designer."[/size]<br /><br />- I marked in red the word "universe" in Elvis' quote because I remember how Lisa Marie, in that Oprah interview about Michael's "death", I remember how at one point she looked upwards saying she's asking the universe (namely God) for answers as to why the circumstances of her father's death and Michael's death "were so identical, play by play by play" !!! I think this speaks volumes about what is happening "behind the curtains" of the hoax!! Who are the designer(s) of this hoax and what Lisa Marie really knows!! <br />- I marked in purple the word "by design" because I found it interesting that Bec used it in this context, just like Elvis... and something tells me Bec was unaware of this Elvis' quote... Am I right or wrong, Bec? <br /><br /><br />
on 1326906018:
Because we all agree that numerology is a pseudoscience, we accept that their appearances are not divinely inspired. This leaves few possibilities as to WHO designed their inclusion. Many accept that MJ himself designed their inclusion, NOT GOD.
I agree...I accept that Elvis and Michael designed their death hoax, BUT by certain numbers that they thought were indicated to them by God.<br /><br />
on 1326906018:
If anyone were touting that god (or even fate) was responsible for these numbers showing up in this hoax, you could refute that theory by offering the fact that numerology is a pseudoscience and you'd be right. [...]
Numerology is a pseudoscience, ok.<br />Fate is not responsible for all numerological connections in the hoax, ok.<br />God is not responsible for all numerological connections in the hoax, ok. <br />BUT the numerological connections in the hoax were designed to fit certain God given numbers that influenced the lives and careers of both Elvis & Michael!<br /><br />^^ This is how I see this whole Numerology trick related to the hoax. Everything is just my opinion, based on my own research that I started doing after reading TS' messages about Numerology.<br /> I don't claim to be right on everything I said here. I may be wrong on certain points, I hope the BAM will clarify everything in the end!<br /><br />@scorpionchik: I hope i could help you a little bit, since you asked for some clarifications. I tried... I cannot get any clearer than that and I hope that TS will step in to make the necessary corrections and / or to complete with further enlightening information what Bec and I have said here...<br /><br />This subject really interests me the MOST since it led me to all those fascinating discoveries about Elvis! So I'd be very happy to read more of what TS has to say on Numerology! bearhug<br />
<br /><br /><br /><br />Perhaps a little off the subject but i do not say to the numbers a pseudo-science, look at these " matches "? With the number phi and what many are calling the geometry of God<br /><br />"Why is the number of petals of the flowers or the leaves of the plants (filotaxis) are organized by fulfilling this numerical sequence? "Why is the shell of a seashell meets this proportion? "Why the Parthenon greek, the man of - Vitruvius, the Mona Lisa, the ancient pyramids or the UN building are also designed and developed on the basis to Ihp? "Why do hurricanes, whirlpools, galaxies and black holes develop their dynamics on the basis of the proportion ?<br /><br />• How is it possible that rabbits also occur on the basis of this ratio?<br />• Did you know that the physical dimensions of the human body also fulfil the aspect ratios given by 1, 6180…?<br />• How is it possible that the flight of a bird of prey lurking also describes the ellipse marked by this series?<br />• Why the city of Mecca is located in the geographical position whose distance to the poles and the solstices meets the PHI relationship?<br />•Podemos even find this amazing series on the aspect ratio of the spiral of DNA and the beating of the heart.<br /><br />• Where this incredible mathematical knowledge published Leonardo of Pisa (Fibonacci) originates from the 13th century and what is behind it?<br /><br /><br />"Ignorance and obscurantism at all times have not produced more than flocks of slaves for tyranny"<br />Emiliano Zapata
@scorpionchik, although I'm a 7 in numerology and I have some interest in this area, I didn't understand WHY would MJ use it in hoaxing his death either.<br />I think Bec's post is logic in our trying to find the real answer.<br /><br />
on 1326953475:
<br />Numerology is important to MJ. Numerology is incorporated throughout the hoax. This indicates that the hoax was created and implemented by design (by someone!=MJ), not by chance (coincidence=dead).<br /><br />All beliefs regarding numerology are irrelevant, because numerology is not in question. It exists. In MJ's hoax it is everywhere. This is an undisputed fact. The only question remains, WHO incorporated the numerology? Well, probably MJ, right? Who else would?
<br /><br />Using numerology in hoaxing his death is MJ's way of telling us: "Look, I'm not dead! Open your eyes and see beyong what's quick to be seen, beyond the apparent."<br /><br />One more exercise in awareness; thank you, MJ!
Perhaps a little off the subject but i do not say to the numbers a pseudo-science, look at these " matches "? With the number phi and what many are calling the geometry of God<br /><br />"Why is the number of petals of the flowers or the leaves of the plants (filotaxis) are organized by fulfilling this numerical sequence? "Why is the shell of a seashell meets this proportion? "Why the Parthenon greek, the man of - Vitruvius, the Mona Lisa, the ancient pyramids or the UN building are also designed and developed on the basis to Ihp? "Why do hurricanes, whirlpools, galaxies and black holes develop their dynamics on the basis of the proportion ?<br /><br />• How is it possible that rabbits also occur on the basis of this ratio?<br />• Did you know that the physical dimensions of the human body also fulfil the aspect ratios given by 1, 6180…?<br />• How is it possible that the flight of a bird of prey lurking also describes the ellipse marked by this series?<br />• Why the city of Mecca is located in the geographical position whose distance to the poles and the solstices meets the PHI relationship?<br />•Podemos even find this amazing series on the aspect ratio of the spiral of DNA and the beating of the heart.<br /><br />• Where this incredible mathematical knowledge published Leonardo of Pisa (Fibonacci) originates from the 13th century and what is behind it?<br />Perhaps a little off the subject but i do not say to the numbers a pseudo-science, look at these " matches "? With the number phi and what many are calling the geometry of God<br /><br />"Why is the number of petals of the flowers or the leaves of the plants (filotaxis) are organized by fulfilling this numerical sequence? "Why is the shell of a seashell meets this proportion? "Why the Parthenon greek, the man of - Vitruvius, the Mona Lisa, the ancient pyramids or the UN building are also designed and developed on the basis to Ihp? "Why do hurricanes, whirlpools, galaxies and black holes develop their dynamics on the basis of the proportion ?<br /><br />• How is it possible that rabbits also occur on the basis of this ratio?<br />• Did you know that the physical dimensions of the human body also fulfil the aspect ratios given by 1, 6180…?<br />• How is it possible that the flight of a bird of prey lurking also describes the ellipse marked by this series?<br />• Why the city of Mecca is located in the geographical position whose distance to the poles and the solstices meets the PHI relationship?<br />•Podemos even find this amazing series on the aspect ratio of the spiral of DNA and the beating of the heart.<br /><br />• Where this incredible mathematical knowledge published Leonardo of Pisa (Fibonacci) originates from the 13th century and what is behind it?<br />
<br /><br /><br />my short answer to that (and again with respect and IMHO) is that:<br /><br />god creates everything. everything in nature has a mathematical formula. from a subtance in a petrie dish under a microscope to the complex solar system.<br /><br />God is a God of Order, Not Confusion - Demonstrated through the physical laws of the universe<br /><br />God ties the reliability of the physical laws of the universe to the reliability of His promises (Jeremiah 31:35-36) It is the LORD who provides the sun to light the day and the moon and stars to light the night, and who stirs the sea into roaring waves. His name is the LORD of Heaven's Armies, and this is what he says: I am as likely to reject my people Israel as I am to abolish the laws of nature!<br /><br />this scripture shows that there are laws, otherwise known as sequences, formulas, math and numbers to nature. including but not limited to such things mentioned in this scripture as moon, stars, sea, waves, etc.<br /><br />God used formulas to create things... things in nature that have scientific / mathematical formulas linked to their subtance, position, weight, make up, matter.<br /><br />As for 'other' numerology i think it is inspired by the devil. (except in the case of elvis and MJ, here it was installed by the designer) i am talking about the numerology pertaining to mecca numerology, pyramid numerology, mayan numerology, stonehenge numerology, mason numerology, illuminati numerology, astrology, reading future, etc. based on bibles viewpoint of such things and based on what many of the things just mentioned originate from or with, most of which are aligned with reading of the future, again a form of occultism.
To put it simply......Michael has used the numerology throughout this hoax to show us the entire thing WAS planned from LONG ago and the events which have occurred the past 2.5 years (and probably also some prior to the "death date") are not a coincidence.
<br />To put it simply......Michael has used the numerology throughout this hoax to show us the entire thing WAS planned from LONG ago and the events which have occurred the past 2.5 years (and probably also some prior to the "death date") are not a coincidence.<br />
<br />To put it simply......Michael has used the numerology throughout this hoax to show us the entire thing WAS planned from LONG ago and the events which have occurred the past 2.5 years (and probably also some prior to the "death date") are not a coincidence.<br />
<br /><br /><br />exactly, that is the reason for the numerology in the hoax
<br />To put it simply......Michael has used the numerology throughout this hoax to show us the entire thing WAS planned from LONG ago and the events which have occurred the past 2.5 years (and probably also some prior to the "death date") are not a coincidence.<br />
<br />You said it very clearly, I'm grateful! <br /><br />About planning the hoax for a long time, I believe MJ wanted to do it like... since forever. I think he was one's of Elvis' "beLIEvers" and this is the source of inspiration, only that revolutionary as we know MJ, he would take the idea to a whole new level: not only he'd hoax his death, but he would return too.<br /><br />I guess some time before 2009 finally he had all the WHYs in the world to do it. And this is it! All he needed now was to find the means. Obviously he found them too. <br /><br />
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