Why would it be over for you? They ID'd his body using a driver's license! And, notice that the officer who collected hair samples says in the affidavit that everything was covered except the hands and the top of the head. So, how does anyone know WHO was in that casket?
There is still nothing specifically identifiable--it could have been ANYONE in that autopsy! Especially because the report says he was 5'9". MJ is taller than that!
Why would it be over for you? They ID'd his body using a driver's license! And, notice that the officer who collected hair samples says in the affidavit that everything was covered except the hands and the top of the head. So, how does anyone know WHO was in that casket?
There is still nothing specifically identifiable--it could have been ANYONE in that autopsy! Especially because the report says he was 5'9". MJ is taller than that!
Why would it be over for you? They ID'd his body using a driver's license! And, notice that the officer who collected hair samples says in the affidavit that everything was covered except the hands and the top of the head. So, how does anyone know WHO was in that casket?
There is still nothing specifically identifiable--it could have been ANYONE in that autopsy! Especially because the report says he was 5'9". MJ is taller than that!
Just read through the coroner's report. Not a fun read.
However, since the report is to account for all markings and scars, why is there no mention of the burn on his scalp? And even if the burned area was removed during the scalp surgeries MJ reportedly had, wouldn't those markings be listed as well? Link 8 would seem to be the place this should appear in the text, but there is no mention.
There is a mention of "pigmentation" on the diagram on Link 20, but shouldn't MJ have more scars or markings on his scalp in this report?
Why would it be over for you? They ID'd his body using a driver's license! And, notice that the officer who collected hair samples says in the affidavit that everything was covered except the hands and the top of the head. So, how does anyone know WHO was in that casket?
There is still nothing specifically identifiable--it could have been ANYONE in that autopsy! Especially because the report says he was 5'9". MJ is taller than that!
if he is not dead who is this autopsy report belong too..?? <!-- s:? -->:?<!-- s:? --> <!-- s --><!-- s -->
The report might not even be real. And really... If this is a hoax... What are we all thinking? There have to be tons of people involved. Don't you think the coroner's office would've spoken out by now, saying they've never seen no Michael Jackson, the hospital, the LAPD, everyone has to be involved. This has to be huge, otherwise you can't really explain any of this. Nobody could pull this off, not even Michael, unless they're involved. So, if you believed he hoaxed his death before this report came out, you might as well believe it now. You know what I mean?
Me, I still believe. I don't say he is alive, I say he might be. And as long as he might be, I'll believe he is, because I couldn't possibly say goodbye to him if I don't even know he's dead for sure.
I have been looking over this report and so far a few things that have stood out that seem odd:
Page 1: Facial Hair - Unshaven unshaven - not shaved
shaved, shaven - having the beard or hair cut off close to the skin
Page 14: A mustache and beard are absent
He looked clean shaven to me in the ambulance photograph..
So someone gave him a shave between the initial observation and the autopsy?
Page 3: I preformed an external body examination at the hospital on 6/25/09. The body was positively identified as Michael Joseph Jackson by visual comparison to his California drivers license on 6/25/09.
If this identification was taking place at the hospital, there were many family members present etc why would identification be made using his drivers license? not just that, the next one too...
Page 15: The body was not clothed and no clothing is available for review.
If he was unclothed, where did the drivers licence come from that was used to identify him? It is not like he had pockets to have this item on him at the time. It also seems unlikely it would have been a priority to locate this piece of identification during the efforts to revive him.
I do not know Michael personally but didn't he wear pyjamas a lot? Why would he not have some garment on as he was a modest, shy man and especially as Murray was supposed to be watching over him during the entire "induced sleep". There seemed to be many other medical supplies present why not a hospital gown at least? IDK seems odd...
Page 18: Residual Brain tissue is released to the mortuary 7-8-09.
So if the brain tissue was released 7-8-09 why was the internment ceremony (funeral) delayed until Sept 3. We were told that the family was awaiting the release of this tissue to proceed with his internment. The stories do not coincide.
Page 51: August 6, 2009at approximately 1300 hours I was notified by Chief of Laboratories Joseph Muto that a Coroner's Criminalist was requested to collect hair samples from the above listed decadent for potential toxicology testing.
The coroner had the body from June 25/09 and it appeared that the decedent may have died from drugs but they never took hair samples at the autopsy? I am not a forensic expert but you would think this would be something that would have been done at autopsy as someone who is a long time drug user would have deposits of these drugs in their hair follicles.
Page 51: The majority of the decedent was covered with multiple white towels/sheets leaving only the hands and the top of the head exposed.
I have never heard of anyone being placed in a casket covered by such items. Could the criminalist not distinguish between whether these where towels or sheets? I mean seriously towel and sheet material are 2 completely different things and what purpose did they serve? The criminalist mentions moving the wig but not the sheet/towel items covering the face, how does he even know he is taking hair samples from the right body?
Nowhere are there any test results for the hair samples that were taken included in this report...
A big deal seems to be made about substances on the hair and some sort of adhesive on the head but we see no results of any tests or anything.
Page 3: Scene description - Various medical supplies including a box a catheters...Also at the foot of the bed,there was a closed bottle of urine atop a chair.
Body Examination - There was also an external urine catheter present.
Ok so when this supposed home infusion of anaesthetic was taking place, a catheter was being used to collect urine. Nowhere in the report does it say that this catheter was attached to any sort of collection bag. We have a bottle of urine which has been closed and capped sitting there, nothing is described as having been attached to it etc. TMZ peeing in cups story anyone?
Page 27:
A. Mild cerebral vascular congestion Cerebral - relating to the brain
Vascular - vessels that conduct and circulate fluids
Congestion - accumulation of blood or other fluid in a body part
Page 26: There is a mild degree of leptomeningeal vascular congestion. Leptomeningeal - the meninges; membranes surrounding the central nervous system. Cerebrospinal fluid circulates between these layers.
So we have some fluid that has accumulated in this brain area but the report does include a description of this fluid nor any possible cause for the fluids accumulation.
B. Mild diffuse brain swelling without herniation syndrome Diffuse - spread out not concentrated in one place
herniation syndrome -Inter cranial pressure
So we have mild spread out swelling within the brain without any pressure but such swelling is an indication of some sort of head and/or brain injury. Yet there are no outward indications of any head injury occurring and no explanation for this swelling is given in the report.
Page 45: Stomach Contents
SERVICE DRUG LEVELS UNITS
Bases Lidocaine 1.6 mg
Propofol Propofol 0.13 mg
Again I do not know a lot about forensics but if propofol was being administered intravenously and lidocaine is given at an injection site how did they get in to the actual stomach contents, was he sipping on them?
Propofol is found throughout the blood, tissue, fluids samples etc. There seems to be a problem with this scenario though. The most important advantage of propofol is its rapid onset and offset of action. This behavior of a "rapid on, rapid off" feature, not available with the intravenous opiates or benzodiazepines, accounts for the increasing popularity of propofol. Because the onset of action after a single dose is rapid, and its effect brief (~ 10-15 minutes) due to high lipophilicity and central nervous system penetration, propofol is given only by continuous infusion when used for sedation. Propofol is a complex drug that actually has three half-lives. Its a half-life, the distribution of the drug from the blood to the tissues after intravenous administration, is very short, perhaps 2 to 3 minutes. The ß half-life of the drug, which is basically the elimination half-life, ranges from 30 to 60 minutes. The half-life, or terminal half-life, during which the drug is eliminated from the third compartment, or tissue fat, ranges from 300 to 700 minutes. Clearance is by hepatic elimination. The large contribution of (about 50%) to the fall of plasma levels means that after very long infusions (at steady state), only about half the initial is needed to maintain the same plasma levels. The large volume of distribution normally seen in the septic or injured host, in combination with the lessened ability to clear the drug in the elderly, can result in a prolonged recovery phase of days due to drug accumulation. Failure to the infusion rate in patients receiving propofol for extended periods may result in excessively high blood concentrations of the drug. Thus, titration to clinical response and daily evaluation of sedation levels are important during extended use of propofol in the ICU. http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/410884_3
Propofol is given intravenously infusing this drug slowly over a period of time to maintain the anaesthetic effects and it is being continuously and quickly removed by the body. So either it built up over time in the blood or a big dose was given at once for there to be such a traceable amount found in all these tissues and fluids. There is also one other possibility... The propofol was poured into/onto blood and tissues samples after they were taken. If this is the case then explains why propofol and lidocaine were both found in the stomach contents.
I am going to reread it again and see if i notice anything else that seems unusual. I will get back to you on this.
Why would it be over for you? They ID'd his body using a driver's license! And, notice that the officer who collected hair samples says in the affidavit that everything was covered except the hands and the top of the head. So, how does anyone know WHO was in that casket?
There is still nothing specifically identifiable--it could have been ANYONE in that autopsy! Especially because the report says he was 5'9". MJ is taller than that!
Hoax not over for me....and I notice that there isn't much coverage about this today.
<!-- s:o -->:o<!-- s:o --> Is it just me or did the report totally blow off the burn scar that should be on the scalp? Only thing I read about the scalp was a tatoo like color or something and they mentioned alot of scars elsewhere and we all know burns leave scars so where is the burn scar on his head? And WTF is with a urinary cath? You dont cath for a nap I see lots that dont add up here.
Why would it be over for you? They ID'd his body using a driver's license! And, notice that the officer who collected hair samples says in the affidavit that everything was covered except the hands and the top of the head. So, how does anyone know WHO was in that casket?
There is still nothing specifically identifiable--it could have been ANYONE in that autopsy! Especially because the report says he was 5'9". MJ is taller than that!
Hoax not over for me....and I notice that there isn't much coverage about this today.
<!-- s:o -->:o<!-- s:o --> Is it just me or did the report totally blow off the burn scar that should be on the scalp? Only thing I read about the scalp was a tatoo like color or something and they mentioned alot of scars elsewhere and we all know burns leave scars so where is the burn scar on his head? And WTF is with a urinary cath? You dont cath for a nap I see lots that dont add up here.
The cath made me think it must have been for somebody bed bound you could not dance like that with one in it would be impossible it must have been for another person not Michael
Hi
I'm glad to find this thread - I have read and translate the report today (wasn't easy for me with all this medical words in english).
This was odd to me:
Driver licence - he looks total different on photos than in hospital, I think
Missing scarv from burning
CPR on the floor? I thougt Murray tried on the bed?
Mortuary 7/8/09 - not in September?
Propofol in the stomach
No clothes?? I agree, where was the driver licence?
He's shy, pyjamas - ok, the propofol was administered trough the famoral aorta, than its better not to wear a pyjama but even not underwear?
This report says he was fine except lung injury. I will never get it why he should ask from narcotic by an unknown doctor - and why this doctor should be so silly not to take care about the breathing etc.
Excuse my English I hope you understand what I want to say <!-- s:oops: -->:oops:<!-- s:oops: -->
I think this report is a fake. Because of the reasons said Tenderoni, and why a tabloid magazine like TMZ has the autopsy report of a superstar and not website like CNN or another, it's not make sense, the authorities would never have published the report of MJ and even less on TMZ...
I thouhgt they said the autopsy report would never be released to the press. <!-- s:? -->:?<!-- s:? -->
I still don't know what to think about all this that's happened. Wouldn't all these official persons, like a judge, a coroner lose their jobs over doing such a thing(hoax) if it comes out. A secret can only remain if few people are part of it. Someone by now would have (un)intentionately released something. They do it for the money. By reading the report I saw a lot of photo's were taken of him in the hospital and at the coroners <!-- s:? -->:?<!-- s:? -->
I'll just sit this out till 26 june but after that (if he isn't back) I'll let him rest in peace.
I guess it is possible to write a fake autopsy report.... I am sure Dr. Klein or White Dr. Murray have friends who would help here! LOL <!-- s:D -->:D<!-- s:D -->
They probably took a real autopsy report of someone who died because of drugs, they took Michael's medical records, asked him a few questions considering his health and wrote everything carefully down.
All we can do is check the names of the doctors who signed the report... Do they really exist?
Although it was very hard for me to read it, I still have a lot of hope! But I must admit - this was HUGE!
Don't you think that as for a "long term drug addict" Michael "was" quite a healthy man???
I hope so. The doctors are all real existing <!-- s:( -->:(<!-- s:( -->.
What is odd too: I google for the doctors and healthgrade.com shows mj-advertisement everywhere on the site <!-- s:? -->:?<!-- s:? -->
Ok this is an possibility - waiting for the 25th of June and than let him rest in peace - but how should I let him rest with all this doubts??????
-->
Comments
There is still nothing specifically identifiable--it could have been ANYONE in that autopsy! Especially because the report says he was 5'9". MJ is taller than that!
<!-- m -->http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/ye ... kson1.html<!-- m -->
Hoax not over for me....and I notice that there isn't much coverage about this today.
Bravo Tenderoni!! I agree!
I completely agree...for years I always thought MJ was 5'11, but now they say 5'9...strange...
However, since the report is to account for all markings and scars, why is there no mention of the burn on his scalp? And even if the burned area was removed during the scalp surgeries MJ reportedly had, wouldn't those markings be listed as well? Link 8 would seem to be the place this should appear in the text, but there is no mention.
There is a mention of "pigmentation" on the diagram on Link 20, but shouldn't MJ have more scars or markings on his scalp in this report?
Just some observations.
You know, people shrink with age, espesilly if arthritis is in the spine, not to mention a thing called gravity, Fact!
The report might not even be real. And really... If this is a hoax... What are we all thinking? There have to be tons of people involved. Don't you think the coroner's office would've spoken out by now, saying they've never seen no Michael Jackson, the hospital, the LAPD, everyone has to be involved. This has to be huge, otherwise you can't really explain any of this. Nobody could pull this off, not even Michael, unless they're involved. So, if you believed he hoaxed his death before this report came out, you might as well believe it now. You know what I mean?
Me, I still believe. I don't say he is alive, I say he might be. And as long as he might be, I'll believe he is, because I couldn't possibly say goodbye to him if I don't even know he's dead for sure.
Page 1: Facial Hair - Unshaven
unshaven - not shaved
shaved, shaven - having the beard or hair cut off close to the skin
Page 14: A mustache and beard are absent
He looked clean shaven to me in the ambulance photograph..
So someone gave him a shave between the initial observation and the autopsy?
Page 3: I preformed an external body examination at the hospital on 6/25/09. The body was positively identified as Michael Joseph Jackson by visual comparison to his California drivers license on 6/25/09.
If this identification was taking place at the hospital, there were many family members present etc why would identification be made using his drivers license? not just that, the next one too...
Page 15: The body was not clothed and no clothing is available for review.
If he was unclothed, where did the drivers licence come from that was used to identify him? It is not like he had pockets to have this item on him at the time. It also seems unlikely it would have been a priority to locate this piece of identification during the efforts to revive him.
I do not know Michael personally but didn't he wear pyjamas a lot? Why would he not have some garment on as he was a modest, shy man and especially as Murray was supposed to be watching over him during the entire "induced sleep". There seemed to be many other medical supplies present why not a hospital gown at least? IDK seems odd...
Page 18: Residual Brain tissue is released to the mortuary 7-8-09.
So if the brain tissue was released 7-8-09 why was the internment ceremony (funeral) delayed until Sept 3. We were told that the family was awaiting the release of this tissue to proceed with his internment. The stories do not coincide.
Page 51: August 6, 2009at approximately 1300 hours I was notified by Chief of Laboratories Joseph Muto that a Coroner's Criminalist was requested to collect hair samples from the above listed decadent for potential toxicology testing.
The coroner had the body from June 25/09 and it appeared that the decedent may have died from drugs but they never took hair samples at the autopsy? I am not a forensic expert but you would think this would be something that would have been done at autopsy as someone who is a long time drug user would have deposits of these drugs in their hair follicles.
Page 51: The majority of the decedent was covered with multiple white towels/sheets leaving only the hands and the top of the head exposed.
I have never heard of anyone being placed in a casket covered by such items. Could the criminalist not distinguish between whether these where towels or sheets? I mean seriously towel and sheet material are 2 completely different things and what purpose did they serve? The criminalist mentions moving the wig but not the sheet/towel items covering the face, how does he even know he is taking hair samples from the right body?
Nowhere are there any test results for the hair samples that were taken included in this report...
A big deal seems to be made about substances on the hair and some sort of adhesive on the head but we see no results of any tests or anything.
Page 3: Scene description - Various medical supplies including a box a catheters...Also at the foot of the bed,there was a closed bottle of urine atop a chair.
Body Examination - There was also an external urine catheter present.
Ok so when this supposed home infusion of anaesthetic was taking place, a catheter was being used to collect urine. Nowhere in the report does it say that this catheter was attached to any sort of collection bag. We have a bottle of urine which has been closed and capped sitting there, nothing is described as having been attached to it etc. TMZ peeing in cups story anyone?
Page 27:
A. Mild cerebral vascular congestion
Cerebral - relating to the brain
Vascular - vessels that conduct and circulate fluids
Congestion - accumulation of blood or other fluid in a body part
Page 26: There is a mild degree of leptomeningeal vascular congestion.
Leptomeningeal - the meninges; membranes surrounding the central nervous system. Cerebrospinal fluid circulates between these layers.
So we have some fluid that has accumulated in this brain area but the report does include a description of this fluid nor any possible cause for the fluids accumulation.
B. Mild diffuse brain swelling without herniation syndrome
Diffuse - spread out not concentrated in one place
herniation syndrome -Inter cranial pressure
So we have mild spread out swelling within the brain without any pressure but such swelling is an indication of some sort of head and/or brain injury. Yet there are no outward indications of any head injury occurring and no explanation for this swelling is given in the report.
Page 45: Stomach Contents
SERVICE DRUG LEVELS UNITS
Bases Lidocaine 1.6 mg
Propofol Propofol 0.13 mg
Again I do not know a lot about forensics but if propofol was being administered intravenously and lidocaine is given at an injection site how did they get in to the actual stomach contents, was he sipping on them?
Propofol is found throughout the blood, tissue, fluids samples etc. There seems to be a problem with this scenario though.
The most important advantage of propofol is its rapid onset and offset of action. This behavior of a "rapid on, rapid off" feature, not available with the intravenous opiates or benzodiazepines, accounts for the increasing popularity of propofol. Because the onset of action after a single dose is rapid, and its effect brief (~ 10-15 minutes) due to high lipophilicity and central nervous system penetration, propofol is given only by continuous infusion when used for sedation. Propofol is a complex drug that actually has three half-lives. Its a half-life, the distribution of the drug from the blood to the tissues after intravenous administration, is very short, perhaps 2 to 3 minutes. The ß half-life of the drug, which is basically the elimination half-life, ranges from 30 to 60 minutes. The half-life, or terminal half-life, during which the drug is eliminated from the third compartment, or tissue fat, ranges from 300 to 700 minutes. Clearance is by hepatic elimination. The large contribution of (about 50%) to the fall of plasma levels means that after very long infusions (at steady state), only about half the initial is needed to maintain the same plasma levels. The large volume of distribution normally seen in the septic or injured host, in combination with the lessened ability to clear the drug in the elderly, can result in a prolonged recovery phase of days due to drug accumulation. Failure to the infusion rate in patients receiving propofol for extended periods may result in excessively high blood concentrations of the drug. Thus, titration to clinical response and daily evaluation of sedation levels are important during extended use of propofol in the ICU.
http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/410884_3
Propofol is given intravenously infusing this drug slowly over a period of time to maintain the anaesthetic effects and it is being continuously and quickly removed by the body. So either it built up over time in the blood or a big dose was given at once for there to be such a traceable amount found in all these tissues and fluids. There is also one other possibility... The propofol was poured into/onto blood and tissues samples after they were taken. If this is the case then explains why propofol and lidocaine were both found in the stomach contents.
I am going to reread it again and see if i notice anything else that seems unusual. I will get back to you on this.
<!-- s:o -->:o<!-- s:o --> Is it just me or did the report totally blow off the burn scar that should be on the scalp? Only thing I read about the scalp was a tatoo like color or something and they mentioned alot of scars elsewhere and we all know burns leave scars so where is the burn scar on his head? And WTF is with a urinary cath? You dont cath for a nap I see lots that dont add up here.
WHY DID HE HAD PROPOFOL IN HIS STOMACH?
I'm glad to find this thread - I have read and translate the report today (wasn't easy for me with all this medical words in english).
This was odd to me:
Driver licence - he looks total different on photos than in hospital, I think
Missing scarv from burning
CPR on the floor? I thougt Murray tried on the bed?
Mortuary 7/8/09 - not in September?
Propofol in the stomach
No clothes?? I agree, where was the driver licence?
He's shy, pyjamas - ok, the propofol was administered trough the famoral aorta, than its better not to wear a pyjama but even not underwear?
This report says he was fine except lung injury. I will never get it why he should ask from narcotic by an unknown doctor - and why this doctor should be so silly not to take care about the breathing etc.
Excuse my English I hope you understand what I want to say <!-- s:oops: -->:oops:<!-- s:oops: -->
I still don't know what to think about all this that's happened. Wouldn't all these official persons, like a judge, a coroner lose their jobs over doing such a thing(hoax) if it comes out. A secret can only remain if few people are part of it. Someone by now would have (un)intentionately released something. They do it for the money. By reading the report I saw a lot of photo's were taken of him in the hospital and at the coroners <!-- s:? -->:?<!-- s:? -->
I'll just sit this out till 26 june but after that (if he isn't back) I'll let him rest in peace.
They probably took a real autopsy report of someone who died because of drugs, they took Michael's medical records, asked him a few questions considering his health and wrote everything carefully down.
All we can do is check the names of the doctors who signed the report... Do they really exist?
Although it was very hard for me to read it, I still have a lot of hope! But I must admit - this was HUGE!
Don't you think that as for a "long term drug addict" Michael "was" quite a healthy man???
who is detective scott smith?
What is odd too: I google for the doctors and healthgrade.com shows mj-advertisement everywhere on the site <!-- s:? -->:?<!-- s:? -->
Ok this is an possibility - waiting for the 25th of June and than let him rest in peace - but how should I let him rest with all this doubts??????