@alsmom380 i hear ya, i pray to God to protect Michael form evil people, to give him srength and health, if he is alive and if he is dead <!-- s --><!-- s --> , to punish those who are responsible for his death.I don't even wanna think that he was murdered <!-- s --><!-- s --> if so, we've been going the wrong direction all this time, i guess we will never know the truth if he doesnt come back or show 100% proof to us. But you know what, i'm absolutely positive, my heart feels that MJ was able to escape, we have some very good clues, let's just hope and wait
IMP[/color][/size][/font]<br />[font=cursive:2uwkmhwj]I've been trying to force my mind to think backward. It's not easy to go against what you feel and believe and have learned and processed. But, I'm trying. <br />I'm placing myself in Michael's place. Say that I have a plan to do this hoax, for whatever reasons...to escape the illuminati. I tell people I'm afraid that "they' are going to kill me for my catalog". ( Now, the illuminati don't want that catalog, but I think Sony would.)<br />So I am so stressed, that I can't sleep. I try everything. It even effects my eating and I lose weight. I hate to tour, but I need to, for my kids, and money (is always great cuz I love to spend) and it's been a long time. But, I'll just do a few, maybe 10 because I'm really terrified of being killed and also, I'm not feeling too good with stressers and I DO hate to tour. But, I'll have to have a doctor to watch over me physically as I really am NOT feeling my best...I AM after all 50 now and have not been active like when I was young. (THAT does make a difference too, believe ME) I've passed a physical though, because I don't have anything wrong with me...I'm just getting older and am stressed because I think they're after me. I get meds so I can be less stressed and maybe sleep. YES, you would too.<br />Then I find out, they've committed me to 50 shows! UP goes my stress level.<br />I have the doctor with me nights, so I feel safe. I have security at the gates. I have surveillance going. There are others in the house with me. My kids have a dog. I even have a cell phone to call for help. I'm alright. <br /><br />BUT!! This is where my thoughts think...this is not right. I can't agree with this theory, and perhaps that's TS point. If it don't fit, you can't wear it. <br />There were others in the home. (if you believe that Michael was really at Carolwood) The kids were there. The cook too at the time of death. Murray. Security. A dog. It don't matter if the illuminati got him on the 25th or before, he is NEVER alone. He wasn't shot out of mid-air like Kennedy. It was some secret death. But, no one could sneak in and do it with him watched over. So, what, one of them did it?? Murray?? You'd have to believe Murray wanted Michael to die...or is illuminait? Well, how obvious is THAT?? Okay, then we have to say for this to happen, Murray killed Michael (the very one the cops would pin it on, and sacrifice 4 years of his life, and the time not and stigma after the 4 years) knowing it would and could only be pinned on him. OR, he let someone in there to do it. Which, he'd again, take the fall for and lose so much of his life. (oh, geez, like Michael has from all the false charges...oops, I'm again thinking hoax)<br />I do want to say, IF I were to believe in a hoax that was planned by Michael to escape the illuminati, but the illuminati thwarted it by killing him, then, I'd have to believe that Sony is the illuminati, because THAT was WHO Michael thought was trying to kill him for his catalog wasn't it? That was who he was afraid of. <br />Either that or you'd have to believe that the illuminai would gain hold of the catalog by killing Michael. <br />Nope, I don't think this idea FITS. <br />I'll just let you who maybe to..try to prove it to me.<br />LOVE<br /> [/font:2uwkmhwj]
[font=cursive:355mwyao] "I've been trying to force my mind to think backward. It's not easy to go against what you feel and believe and have learned and processed. But, I'm trying.<br /> <br />..."BUT!! This is where my thoughts think...this is not right. I can't agree with this theory, and perhaps that's TS point. If it don't fit, you can't wear it." <br /> [/font:355mwyao]
<br /><br />This reminds me of Judge Judy saying, "If it doesn't sound right, it usually isn't true".
There has been many great comments in the thread so far and some of what I might say may have already been said by other members. The difficult thing, at this point, is that no matter which theory we try to defend or debunk, none of us has concrete proof to back up what we say…all we can do is put forth what seems more plausible, based on things that have actually occurred.
Having said that, though, there are certain ‘facts’ that TS has embedded within his post that many could argue are assumptions. But for the sake of sticking with The Scenario put forth by TS (murder theory), I will take these ‘facts’ as truths. So, here is what we can say both sides agree on, and are not contesting, for the purpose of this debate:
‘Facts’ (taken directly from TS’ post):
F1 – MJ had planned a hoax
F2 – The hoax ‘timing’ was planned up to 9-9-09
F3 – The family is/was aware of the hoax
F4 – The Illuminati do exist AND they were after MJ
Furthermore, for the purpose of this debate, I will also take as ‘fact’ findings from levels 1-3 that TS summarized in the May 1st post. (I am not including level 4 because the jury is still deliberating on that one lol). These ‘facts’ are as follows:
Level findings (take directly from May 1st post):
L1 – The ambulance photo was staged in advance
L2 – At least a few people in the FBI are helping with the hoax
L3 – While not conclusive, most agree that no corpse was used
The above is the foundation that both sides are working on as the basis for both the hoax and murder theory (i.e. the ‘facts’ and ‘level findings’ are not being contested here by either side, rather we are taking them as ‘truths’). Now, then, we have The Scenario, which TS put in very general terms, without much detail (but as with everything in this hoax, the beauty lies in the details!). At this point, TS has really only stated a 2-step scenario, as follows:
Scenario for murder:
S1 – The Illuminati found out about MJ’s hoax plans
S2 – They killed MJ according to the exact timing that he had planned
Taking all the above into consideration, here are some points of debate that TS can hopefully explain (I say ‘some points’ because an entire book can be written on defending a hoax theory above a murder theory and probably vice versa…so I’m only going to bring up a few for now. I welcome any members to add on any ‘points of debate’ that TS can address).
Points of debate:
1) Although FI (MJ’s hoax plan) was in place, the majority of people knew nothing about it. Even if most thought MJ was up to something, based on things he said in interviews and especially the Sony kills music speech, I highly doubt that the majority imagined he was planning a death hoax. So very few people, probably only those that MJ trusted with F1, actually knew what he was planning and probably even fewer knew of exact timing.
Why, then, would the Illuminati have killed him according to MJ’s exact hoax timing? Was it to fool those few people that actually knew of the hoax AND the timing of things? If so, for what purpose? The only motive for that, that I can think of, would be to fool those few people into thinking that no murder had taken place, but rather MJ was carrying out the hoax he had told them about. But that doesn’t really make sense. While these people may have initially thought that MJ’s ‘death’ was part of his hoax, wouldn’t they have, sooner or later, figured out that the hoax was not taking place when absolutely no contact with MJ could be made?
2) Based on F2 (exact timing of hoax planned until 9-9-09), then MJ not only planned the exact time of death but he also planned the exact timing of the memorial and the funeral. We also know, based on F3, that the family would have been aware of MJ’s plans.
Following the 1st point of debate, the family would’ve had 3 months to realize that MJ was nowhere to be found. Sure, we can assume that part of the plan was that MJ would have absolutely no contact with anyone from June 25th to Sept 9, but considering the intricacy of the hoax and MJ’s perfectionism, I highly doubt that there would be no contact at all. Would the family have continued on with the exact hoax timing, up til 9-9-09, knowing that MJ’s hoax had been thwarted and something entirely different was going on? Why would they stick to the exact planned timing of the memorial and the funeral? While the Illuminati may have killed him according to his hoax plans, it was the family who continued with the exact hoax timing of events that followed the ‘death’. Were they being threatened by the Illuminati to carry out these plans according to MJ’s exact timing? If so, for what purpose?
3) Not only did they kill MJ according to exact hoax timing, but they also went to the trouble of L1, staging the ambulance photo.
If MJ was murdered, why the need to stage the ambulance photo in advance? Wouldn’t they have required ‘proof’ that the ‘hit’ had been carried out? If the murder theory is correct, then MJ would’ve really been in the ambulance, either dead or close to death. What better ‘proof’ than to take a pic of him in the ambulance to show that the ‘hit’ was completed? Why the need to stage the photo the ‘other day’? Was Ben, therefore, helping the Illuminati, since he was there that day and the other day?
4) Based on the 333 pages released by the FBI, it didn’t look like they were helping those people (Illuminati?) that were out to get MJ. If they were helping them, they most definitely would’ve found ‘evidence’ to ‘prove’ MJ was guilty of the molestation charges. Instead, there’s many pages which show they repeatedly reported to the prosecution that there was absolutely no evidence even hinting that MJ was guilty.
But based on L2, we know that at least a few people in the FBI were helping with the hoax. So, were they helping MJ or were they helping the Illuminati? If it's the latter, what specifically did they do to help the Illuminati pull this off?
5) In L3, most argued that there was no corpse used on June 25th, but as with everything else, there’s no concrete proof, at this point, either way.
But, if they murdered him, and there was a body…that of MJ’s…then why all the craziness of what followed (i.e. why didn’t any doctor announce his death at the hospital? Why all the discrepancies with official documents and the autopsy?)
If they murdered him and there was no corpse, why would they have taken the body and what the heck did they do with it? No corpse would mean that he was killed and his body was taken away, for whatever reason. So everyone in the house at that time would have to be in on the murder (obviously Murray, but also the ambulance guys, and at least Alberto Alvarez and any other security that stayed behind after everyone was sent home). How did they dispose of the body? Would the family, not to mention the hospital staff, not notice that there was no body? The family, among others, have stated that they saw the body, were they lying?
Even within the points of debate I’ve listed, there’s a whole host of other questions that arise with this scenario (i.e. like others suggested, why would the Illmuninati want a message of L.O.V.E. to come out of all this?). I’m hoping that TS will soon respond to our comments because without the details of his scenario, it is difficult to pinpoint what parts of his theory don’t hold up.
Regardless, whether this was murder or a hoax, several ‘key’ people (including the family), HAD to be involved to carry out the plans. Even if the same amount of people were needed for either scenario (although IMO it would take more people to cover up a murder), my biggest issue with the murder theory is that all these people knowingly helped a group of people (the Illuminati) carry out the murder of an innocent man and continue, to this day, to remain silent about it. Sure, one could argue that they are all being threatened by the Illuminati…but how many did they threaten? The family, Murray, the ambulance guys, Alvarez, the hospital staff, the LAPD, the FBI, the coroner, etc etc??? It seems much more plausible to me that the ‘key’ people who know what really happened, went along with a well-intentioned hoax rather than a cold-blooded murder.
With L.O.V.E. always.
P.S. @TS….be very careful with ‘proving’ a murder theory too well…for if you do, there would be no reason to continue reading one more word you write <!-- s;) -->;)<!-- s;) -->
@alsmom380 i hear ya, i pray to God to protect Michael form evil people, to give him srength and health, if he is alive and if he is dead <!-- s --><!-- s --> , to punish those who are responsible for his death.I don't even wanna think that he was murdered <!-- s --><!-- s --> if so, we've been going the wrong direction all this time, i guess we will never know the truth if he doesnt come back or show 100% proof to us. But you know what, i'm absolutely positive, my heart feels that MJ was able to escape, we have some very good clues, let's just hope and wait
I'm getting a bit worried for myself AND Michael now because I'm starting to sound like a "wisher" instead of a beLIEver. I need to take a break and re-examine the clues. I'm beginning to think some of them was just wishful thinking. I need to snap out of it!!!! <!-- spale/ -->pale/<!-- spale/ -->
TS says In fact, this level is not for newbie’s, or those with WEAK FAITH; because in this level, I am going to take sides with Jermaine—and say that there is no hoax, MJ is really dead. If you can’t handle this level!
Yes he really is DEAD just like Elisa Presley said ELVIS/jessie <!-- selvis_/ -->elvis_/<!-- selvis_/ --> he did die that day as well in one of the redirects. The star,the icon, the millionaire. Michael has giving up his riches and materialistic items" remember in THIS IS IT he put his jacket on the ground and burned it showing how MJ felt about that item. Just recently the thriller jacket sold for 1.8 million, hmmm. Who is making that money, I am sure it is not in MJs pockets.I have faith that Michael lives. Just not with the same name he had before. Was he forced out by the Illuminatis? I remember reading if JEssie/Elvis wanted to come back THEY would not let him. Who is THEY? We have heard plenty of times this person is worth more dead than alive. Which is a horrible way for people to think of you like a object=money.But that is how these people think. So yeah I think there is no hoax MJ is dead! But his body lives on with a new identity,the master of disguise "MORPH" <!-- smj_bad/ -->mj_bad/<!-- smj_bad/ --> .
Are there really enough hoaxers for an Agent to spend time 'messing' with our minds. Does anyone really listen to us anyway? So far, the people I have told about the hoax don't seem to care whether it is the truth or not, which I find sad but it is what it is. If Michael was murdered than what about all of the other events that point to a hoax. You can't just erase those to make a Murder theory seem plausible. Just like you can't ignore the family sayin he is dead and the supposed autopsy reports and death certificate. Why is it that every legitimate document has Michael JOE and every seemingly fake document has Michael JOSEPH? Why did Ben slip and almost say 'the other day'? Why so much talk of the children being great actors? And Prince wanting to be a director? None want to pursue singing/dancing like their father has done for 40 yrs of his life? Why is everyone wirting a damn book instead of going to authorities about MJ's killer? Why do we see no tears from them? Why are new people still coming out about 6.25.09, like Kathy Hilton? Why is Teddy Riley saying he KNOWS Mike is alive? Why is Teddy saying Michael album is all MJ? Why are family members saying it is not all MJ? Why are the Cascio's saying that Michael recorded the songs in their basement/studio? Why would they lie if they have never once shown any signs of wanting to exploit MJ for their own gain? Why is it there is still NO name on MJ's grave?!?! Why does Forest Lawn say that Michael was never buried there? Why is that Diana Ross did not make it to his funeral or memorial? Why is it that the funeral only uses Liberian Girl pictures? Why is it the memorial is filled with people who had never even met MJ? Why is the memorial exactly 7 years apart from his supposed Will (with incorrect names) on 7-7-07? Why is it that Michael was staying in a house so close to Sunset Blvd, one of the busiest streets in America? Why were there no paparazzi on 6.25 when they are always outside of his house? Why is there one picture, and it is photoshopped?
I think of myself as a pretty good judge of people and I can usually tell when someone is lying to my face. A murder theory would only be possible to me if none of the other things mentioned by me (and others) had occured.
If someone wanted MJ dead, they picked one hell of a time to do it! why not sooner, why not later after the concerts when he had more money to take? I think the TII announcement was simply a wake up call to the world to direct attention once more at a man that hadn't had an album out since 2001. Everything is planned carefully and you can see it better when you get rid of all the doubt.
Why do you think in "This time around" he says about control and about "they" who want to use him.
Anyway, I think they tried hard to control and use Michael but he was just too independent. Maybe it was also them who planned the false accusations as a way to make him say yes to them in exchange for it's obedience.
I've always associated This Time Around with Tom Sneddon, among other tracks. But he may have written the song with ALL of 'em in mind. The album/albums were riddled with injustices in mind. Not just Sneddon but Evan Chandler. Pure evil! I may sound cruel but at least Evan is out of his own misery now, if you know what I mean....
Control and use are the key words for me.
Maybe I am paranoid but from my limited experience I think a person is good for them if it's controlable and of use, no matter the inteligence or the skills or whatever.
When MJ made TDCAU - it was intended against ILLuminati, at least in my mind is so. THEY are not even the governments, but the ones behind it all, including governments. Or he just "picked up" that song out of the air and did it because GOD told him so and he didn't realise what he was singing? I don't think so.
@alsmom380 dont be sad plz, may be some of the clues have already been debunked but it doesnt mean that all the clues we've had so far are just wishful things, remember about Dave Dave(though we dont have a 100% proof that it was MJ, it's obvious that it was not the real Dave Dave on LKL), remember about what MJ said to Paris a couple of days before his 'death", Jermaine's slip-up about the airport, which, judging by his smile,he did on purpose... the list goes on and on, so be strong and do not allow moments of despair like this shaken your belief and hope, we are not dellusional fans who cannot move on, we're just open-minded and wanna know the truth: what really happened to MJ on june 25 <!-- sbearhug -->bearhug<!-- sbearhug -->
Warning: This is a long post.<br /><br />There has been many great comments in the thread so far and some of what I might say may have already been said by other members. The difficult thing, at this point, is that no matter which theory we try to defend or debunk, none of us has concrete proof to back up what we say…all we can do is put forth what seems more plausible, based on things that have actually occurred.<br />Having said that, though, there are certain ‘facts’ that TS has embedded within his post that many could argue are assumptions. But for the sake of sticking with The Scenario put forth by TS (murder theory), I will take these ‘facts’ as truths. So, here is what we can say both sides agree on, and are not contesting, for the purpose of this debate:<br />‘Facts’ (taken directly from TS’ post):<br /><br />F1 – MJ had planned a hoax<br />F2 – The hoax ‘timing’ was planned up to 9-9-09<br />F3 – The family is/was aware of the hoax<br />F4 – The Illuminati do exist AND they were after MJ quote]<br /><br />Although we consider that Michael have planned hoax long time ago, it is also possible that due to emergency circumstances, Michael's death hoax was realized randomly. Thus, there is no numerology involved. I have been sceptical to the timing in hoax from the beginning. Why? First, I do believe in numerology in general, but not in hoax related theory. Simply because it is not 100 % accurate. For example, MJ chose to "die" in June 25,2009, I see calculation goes 2+5+2+9=18, then "see Conrad wears t-shirt with number 18". The right numerelogy should include 6=month of June, in that case that would be 6+2+5+2+9=24=2+4=6. That's how numerology works, adding up ALL numbers, not half of them.<br />Second, the process of faking death to fool the world is already stressful, why make that stress worse following exact timing, dates, etc. There is also no guarantee that everybody else who involved in hoax would remember and do exactly as written in MJ's scenario of TIMING. Come on, I don't buy this. Third, if hoax was realized due to emergency circumstances, like Conrad tried to kill Michael (no matter who ordered), then numerology could not be followed. If there was no emergency situation, then still no need this numerelogy, esp. when it is accurate, i.e. not based on true numerology principles. Thus, 9-9-9 basis of calculation is also wrong to be constantly mentioned. <br />And especially IF Michael was killed by whomever, there is no way they whould bother with that numerology headache.<br />In either case, MJ outsmarted them or was outsmarted by them, there is no numerology. Tere is NO point to keep numerology in the plan. Simple as that. Somebody can explain the POINT, MEANING, REASON, GOAL of that in hoax? Just to demonstrate mastermind? Nonsense. Esp. If Michael does not plan to come back, even worse, no point again. To give us a clue that it is a hoax? We have more than enough facts to cosider hoax without numerology .<br /> Another fact I want to point out. As many memebers mentiioned, Sony most probably is a member of masons and have a motive to kill MJ. The most reasonable motive to kill MJ I can think of is $$$$$$$$. Sony has money interest. Did they get catalog or their 50% killing MJ? NO, THEY DID NOT. The only way Sony can get his interest along with catalogs back is to BUYBACK it for very large $$$. So, the motive is weak to kill Michael and be at risk of conviction. What about Jacksons? If they believe MJ was killed, so far they are OK with involuntary manslaughter charges ONLY, NOT MURDER as they claim, which is very weird.<br /><br />"Murder is a form of criminal homicide that has a precise legal meaning. Murder is usually defined as the "unlawful killing of another with malice aforethought (or "an abandoned and malignant heart"). Malice aforethought refers to the perpetrator's intention of doing harm.<br />Involuntary manslaughter is manslaughter resulting from a failure to perform a legal duty expressly required to safeguard human life, from the commission of an unlawful act not amounting to a felony.<br />The difference between murder and manslaughter is in the element of intent. (We know that there are facts that it might be done intentionally if there were no hoax theory: not calling 911 right away, talking over the phone when MJ was dying at that time,not doing proper CPR, giving mix of medications that in very risky, giving Propofol at home without proper monitoring, hiding bottles, not evaluating patience health history...).<br /> Murder and manslaughter also differ in the sentences imposed for each crime. (Minslaughter has max. 4 years. Are Jacksons OK with that? Cause I am not OK. I want minimum life sentence for CM IF he MURDERED Michael. Thus, CM has to be charged with murder.
*1. MJ investigation complete, only two days after TIAI announced Update #1.
*2. 333 pages of FBI files, planned release on same day as TIAI Revealed.
*3. $9.99 while LaToya shopping, connecting with “99” days after 9-9-09.
#4. Six 911 articles on TMZ, the day after TIAI conspiracies on Google (911, etc).
#5. Murray on TMZ news four times, the same day as the TIAI Murray redirect.
*6. Vendetta on 11-5; Evan Chandler / Emerald City on 11-17 (70th anniversary).
*7. 2012 trailer, a week before “Jackson” and many other MJ parallels came out.
*8. TII Resurrection scene in a graveyard (not funeral & casket, etc).
*9. TII would Reveal the hoax (Smooth Criminal, no RIP, BAM statement, etc).
*10. TII would show the MJ “Return” (this very word is now on the DVD).
*11. 1998 autograph codes; 77 days & 7 days all pointed to 9-9-09, fulfilled by several TII and MJ related events.
*12. ALLJACK5ONS tweet on 1-18 about TIAI “Revealed” (also the 3-11 tweet).
#13. TMZ clue on January 25.
#14. TMZ, Murray, and murder versus hoax clue on February 5.
*15. High probability of “piece by piece” return starting in January (see #12, etc).
*16. Autopsy finalized 9-9-09, released just one day after I said “9-9-09 update”.
#17. TIAI redirect to TMZ, less than an hour before the big MJ Killed Himself post.
#18. Update #4 (4-44), #17 article posted on 4-4 at 4:00 AM (444).
*19. Elvis redirect on 5-10, several Elvis events happen from 5-12 to 5-20 (next).
*20. Update 5 (with 12 sections) on 5-12 at 5:12 AM; later that day TMZ starts LMP series from 5-12 to 5-17. Also, Linda talks to Jesse on 5-12.
*21. The final part of TIAI Update (#5d) is posted evening of 5-19 (CA time). On 5-19, Eliza posted a message on her homepage, for the first time in about four months; then on 5-20, the article by attorney Mayoras was posted (6-1, above).
*22. “Strong Evidence of TS’s Authenticity” {http://michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?f=72&t=13541; viewtopic.php?f=0&t=13541&p=232799#p232795}
the murder theory "crash" with all this and all these events are no coincidence that certainly is a widely used resource for those who are unable to find a coherent explanation for situations which apparently do not. The more we learn we find less "casual" ... then "all" the family would have to agree on a plan to murder all makes logical
This has to be one of the most saddest and unnecessary threads I've ever read or participated in on this website. It's nothing against Souza, because I love her logic and writing style the most out of all participants, and I'm not kissing up. It's just fact. But I do wonder about what TS is about these days. What is the purpose really of this thread? Level X my hind parts. It sucks big toe nails. Not knocking the ones that delight in it at tall by the way. This is between me and TS.
MJ = LOVE period. He is a very Positive person as I believe I am. I say he's Brilliant, because of the Light he has always exuded. The word genius is thrown around too much for my taste. He is a Brilliant man that emits a lot of Light and always has. He is an Enlightened and Awakened individual.
The theme of today is Unity Consciousness. So how can discussing such a depressing and sad topic be helpful, beneficial or enlightening in the positive sense? It defeats the purpose of what Michael Jackson is all about. He is about love and unity - period.
Maybe it's me, but I think this topic stinks to depths of meaningless banter. I know, I don't have to read up, and believe me, I haven't read most posts at all, because it's so depressing to read such negative things.
I often wondered why some on here thinks that TMZ is only posting articles for us hoaxers. They have a much larger audience than the people on this board. They are posting many of these BS articles concerning Murray and other MJ related things just to mess with people. MJ wrote a song entitled Tabloids Junkie, because he was sick of how people would believe anything the lying tabloids and MSM told about him. It hurt him that many believed the lies its true - but with this hoax - and when it pertains to much of the news about this case (MJ's hoax), it's put out there as a documentation as to how easy some can be fooled, how gullible some are and how ignorant people are to believe anything that's in print without any investigation.
Again, this website and others like it is not why TMZ exists. It existed and had a large readership before 6-25-09. MJ is punking his haters, many in all areas and types of media - and the ones that rely on their governments or the lying and scheming media for truth.
In my opinion, TS is doing partly the same thing. I said a couple of weeks ago, that MJ wants for people interested in the hoax to prove why he is alive, not why and how he died. That defeats the purpose.
And TS, I do feel sorry for the Newbies. Many folks will run away from this website rather than embrace it. It's like now we want them to doubt us even further. We want them to think us crazy. I know I was getting a few recruits to wonder what if MJ is alive. Many of them were getting hopeful. Many still don't want to. Why? Why should it matter to anyone really?
I think it matters to a lot of people, because many of us always felt MJ's brilliance and radiance, and the love he had for humanity and his God. Many people loved his music, yes, but many more also loved his HEART. So how does it seem right to mess with the newbies to this website and to the idea that MJ is alive - for believe me, many want so desperately for it to be true. They may not understand it themselves, but they know that there was always something so special about the man. They now in retrospect realize that when they used to hear him speak from his heart more so than hear him sing (many already felt he sang like an angel since 5 or 6 years old), they were drawn to him.
These are the ones I feel sorry for. The ones that are new to the idea. Well I suppose, they may need to bypass this website, for they won't get any true feelings of convictions from most. They won't get any CORE BELIEFS from many. Many are wishy-washy, and therefore are not more of an inspiration than the ones that call MJ names, think he molested children - and last but not least, think he was a druggie. They would be wrong on all counts of course, but to believe that he is dead is to believe that he took this drug - PROP FOR FOOL - and demoral and other such drugs.
Some lose the plot every other day and forget that in all movies that are screened have to have a story to tell in the way the author envisions it. It has a beginning, middle and an ending.
Some say they can't be sure of this and that concerning this HOAX/ARG/DOCUMENTARY - let alone that the man is alive. Some of the older posters are still trying to figure out if he is alive? It is almost turning into some kind of draconian joke. And it's sad that it has come to this. Well I can be sure of this and that. No one could have had the BRILLIANCE to pull off a hoax that he has been planning for years but Michael Jackson. I've seen him alive in the flesh after 6-25-09 - and that's enough for me.
TS - You can take this level and either fill in the blank or get of the pot.
I'm wracking my brain trying to figure out why the Illuminati would be so interested in Michael. I'm not completely convinced that they exist at all and if they do that they are as cracked up as everyone makes them, try to remember people in general sort of form their own opinions about things when they aren't educated about it completely. If the Illuminati are so secretive, people can say what they want about them and who is going to correct them? No one, why because they don't want to be pointed out, so we as the general public continue to believe in what we are told and what we can find out in books or on the web by those who think they are in the know but in fact no nothing. Has there ever been one single person who stood up and said "yes I am with the Illuminati and this is what we are all about"? No, why because they would be hounded by everyone who has ever been interested in conspiracy theories, secrets and the unknown. Hell for that matter the same person that comes clean about being in the Illuminati would have to go into hiding! So let's for argument sake say that the Illuminati exist, what would they possibly want with Michael? His catalog? Why what purpose would it suit them? Sony, well yes they could profit from having it so I can see where the concern is that he would want to keep it from them. In fact that is his money maker after all. Michael doesn't have to come out with a new album or produce anything of his own for years on end and still is able to rake in money because of his catalog. So are we suppose to believe that Sony has direct contact with someone in the Illuminati and they put together an extensive plan to dispose of Michael in the best way they sought fit?
Michael himself said in an interview or threw a conversation about how he can say one thing and no one would believe him, BUT if the media said the same exact thing it would be considered the truth. Now, with that being said, I question everyone who has said in the last two years that Michael was in fear for his life. Why? Did they personally believe that? Did they have any indication themselves that he was in danger? OR was it told by him? After all, we the general public who have had no personal conversations with Michael and came up with the conclusion on our own that he was in danger, were told by him through interviews. Yes Michael is first human but he has also had the spotlight on him his entire life, so he has trained himself to present himself in a certain manner. He as well as all entertainers, politicians, the President (ANYONE who is in the spotlight) show us what they want us to see. We perceive them the way they want us to. So again, we were told by Michael himself that he was in danger and feared for his life. His family I'm sure was told the same, not that they picked it up on their own, he told them. Could it be that he did it on purpose? It's been said that this hoax took years in the making, what better way to steer everyone to think that there was a conspiracy against him, what better way to steer everyone that he was murdered but to first put it in their head that there was danger in the first place. All it takes is for someone to plant the seed, feed it a little bit and then watch it blossom from there.
[font=cursive:3e9mklz8]Peacock7...I feel your pain and also feel you are a pot simmering yourself. I thought when TS posted this thread it was one I'd skip. I thought it was morbid and, really actually you wrote my feelings very well.<br />BUT, then members have written so VERY well it drew me in.<br />Now, I realize that...IMO, that TS has posted this for us to be spared the pain we surely will feel in the trial when all these murder stories come up. We need to try this before so we can handle it. We've pretty much done the prosecution side..now is the time for the defense. What they'll say -- how we'll, as the prosecution shoot it down. Because if we don't work this out now...reason it out, we could be drawn into believing he's been killed.<br />I think this will strengthen us. I think already, we are proving to each other that a murder by the illluminati or Murray..is practically impossible and unreasonable on their part to have done.<br />My opinion has changed, I hope you too peacock will find strength in all the research and know that dealing with it now together will be much easier after we debunk it now.<br />LOVE out to you.[/font:3e9mklz8]
Are there really enough hoaxers for an Agent to spend time 'messing' with our minds. Does anyone really listen to us anyway? So far, the people I have told about the hoax don't seem to care whether it is the truth or not, which I find sad but it is what it is. If Michael was murdered than what about all of the other events that point to a hoax. You can't just erase those to make a Murder theory seem plausible. Just like you can't ignore the family sayin he is dead and the supposed autopsy reports and death certificate. Why is it that every legitimate document has Michael JOE and every seemingly fake document has Michael JOSEPH? Why did Ben slip and almost say 'the other day'? Why so much talk of the children being great actors? And Prince wanting to be a director? None want to pursue singing/dancing like their father has done for 40 yrs of his life? Why is everyone wirting a damn book instead of going to authorities about MJ's killer? Why do we see no tears from them? Why are new people still coming out about 6.25.09, like Kathy Hilton? Why is Teddy Riley saying he KNOWS Mike is alive? Why is Teddy saying Michael album is all MJ? Why are family members saying it is not all MJ? Why are the Cascio's saying that Michael recorded the songs in their basement/studio? Why would they lie if they have never once shown any signs of wanting to exploit MJ for their own gain? Why is it there is still NO name on MJ's grave?!?! Why does Forest Lawn say that Michael was never buried there? Why is that Diana Ross did not make it to his funeral or memorial? Why is it that the funeral only uses Liberian Girl pictures? Why is it the memorial is filled with people who had never even met MJ? Why is the memorial exactly 7 years apart from his supposed Will (with incorrect names) on 7-7-07? Why is it that Michael was staying in a house so close to Sunset Blvd, one of the busiest streets in America? Why were there no paparazzi on 6.25 when they are always outside of his house? Why is there one picture, and it is photoshopped? <br />I think of myself as a pretty good judge of people and I can usually tell when someone is lying to my face. A murder theory would only be possible to me if none of the other things mentioned by me (and others) had occured.<br />If someone wanted MJ dead, they picked one hell of a time to do it! why not sooner, why not later after the concerts when he had more money to take? I think the TII announcement was simply a wake up call to the world to direct attention once more at a man that hadn't had an album out since 2001. Everything is planned carefully and you can see it better when you get rid of all the doubt.
<br /><br />I agree with everything you wrote. And all these people who attended the memorial and the funeral had to be illuminati or they ALL (including family) should be so happy that Michael died because everyone was laughing!<br /><br /><br /><br />And YAY Michael Died Party?!<br /><br /><br /><br />Yes, people can have different emotions when they lose someone they love but NOT everyone can look happy and fine with it! And Michael's "death" was a sudden death and he was young. People needed to be shocked and so sad. I see no sad faces in the pictures and videos.<br /><br />
Why is that Diana Ross did not make it to his funeral or memorial?
<br /><br />During the "tribute" she did to Michael she said: "Michael, call me if you need me." <!-- s --><!-- s --> <br /><br />I really do not know how people still can think about a murder/death possibility. After all of these things, what else should the man do to let us know that he is really alive and fine. I think nothing can make some understand it. Well...
Do you think all these people would know of the hoax, PureLove? Too risky. I think some outside the family, yes, but all of them?
TS always warned a few people to know about the hoax. I really do not know.
Do you think all these people would know of the hoax, PureLove? Too risky. I think some outside the family, yes, but all of them?
TS always warned a few people to know about the hoax. I really do not know.
These people in the pictures know IMO. TS made an explanation what he meant with "few" people.
It's been said that this hoax took years in the making, what better way to steer everyone to think that there was a conspiracy against him, what better way to steer everyone that he was murdered but to first put it in their head that there was danger in the first place. All it takes is for someone to plant the seed, feed it a little bit and then watch it blossom from there.
You make a very good point here and one that has often gone through my mind. It is frequently said, as if it's proven fact, that MJ was in danger, he had to get away etc etc, but my common sense tells me that if that were the case he wouldn't have taken decades to plan his getaway, for safety's sake he would have left no clues and he wouldn't have chosen a suspicious death. The numerology that many have a hard time accepting, me included at times, is I think the best proof we have of this being planned and therefore not a last minute bid for freedom or safety.
This has to be one of the most saddest and unnecessary threads I've ever read or participated in on this website. It's nothing against Souza, because I love her logic and writing style the most out of all participants, and I'm not kissing up. It's just fact. But I do wonder about what TS is about these days. What is the purpose really of this thread? Level X my hind parts. It sucks big toe nails. Not knocking the ones that delight in it at tall by the way. This is between me and TS.
MJ = LOVE period. He is a very Positive person as I believe I am. I say he's Brilliant, because of the Light he has always exuded. The word genius is thrown around too much for my taste. He is a Brilliant man that emits a lot of Light and always has. He is an Enlightened and Awakened individual.
The theme of today is Unity Consciousness. So how can discussing such a depressing and sad topic be helpful, beneficial or enlightening in the positive sense? It defeats the purpose of what Michael Jackson is all about. He is about love and unity - period.
Maybe it's me, but I think this topic stinks to depths of meaningless banter. I know, I don't have to read up, and believe me, I haven't read most posts at all, because it's so depressing to read such negative things.
I often wondered why some on here thinks that TMZ is only posting articles for us hoaxers. They have a much larger audience than the people on this board. They are posting many of these BS articles concerning Murray and other MJ related things just to mess with people. MJ wrote a song entitled Tabloids Junkie, because he was sick of how people would believe anything the lying tabloids and MSM told about him. It hurt him that many believed the lies its true - but with this hoax - and when it pertains to much of the news about this case (MJ's hoax), it's put out there as a documentation as to how easy some can be fooled, how gullible some are and how ignorant people are to believe anything that's in print without any investigation.
Again, this website and others like it is not why TMZ exists. It existed and had a large readership before 6-25-09. MJ is punking his haters, many in all areas and types of media - and the ones that rely on their governments or the lying and scheming media for truth.
In my opinion, TS is doing partly the same thing. I said a couple of weeks ago, that MJ wants for people interested in the hoax to prove why he is alive, not why and how he died. That defeats the purpose.
And TS, I do feel sorry for the Newbies. Many folks will run away from this website rather than embrace it. It's like now we want them to doubt us even further. We want them to think us crazy. I know I was getting a few recruits to wonder what if MJ is alive. Many of them were getting hopeful. Many still don't want to. Why? Why should it matter to anyone really?
I think it matters to a lot of people, because many of us always felt MJ's brilliance and radiance, and the love he had for humanity and his God. Many people loved his music, yes, but many more also loved his HEART. So how does it seem right to mess with the newbies to this website and to the idea that MJ is alive - for believe me, many want so desperately for it to be true. They may not understand it themselves, but they know that there was always something so special about the man. They now in retrospect realize that when they used to hear him speak from his heart more so than hear him sing (many already felt he sang like an angel since 5 or 6 years old), they were drawn to him.
These are the ones I feel sorry for. The ones that are new to the idea. Well I suppose, they may need to bypass this website, for they won't get any true feelings of convictions from most. They won't get any CORE BELIEFS from many. Many are wishy-washy, and therefore are not more of an inspiration than the ones that call MJ names, think he molested children - and last but not least, think he was a druggie. They would be wrong on all counts of course, but to believe that he is dead is to believe that he took this drug - PROP FOR FOOL - and demoral and other such drugs.
Some lose the plot every other day and forget that in all movies that are screened have to have a story to tell in the way the author envisions it. It has a beginning, middle and an ending.
Some say they can't be sure of this and that concerning this HOAX/ARG/DOCUMENTARY - let alone that the man is alive. Some of the older posters are still trying to figure out if he is alive? It is almost turning into some kind of draconian joke. And it's sad that it has come to this. Well I can be sure of this and that. No one could have had the BRILLIANCE to pull off a hoax that he has been planning for years but Michael Jackson. I've seen him alive in the flesh after 6-25-09 - and that's enough for me.
TS - You can take this level and either fill in the blank or get of the pot.
Peacock,
I hate to put you on the spot but am I understanding you correctly when you wrote above: "I've seen him alive in the flesh after 6-25-09-and that's enough for me."???????
TS, I cannot debunk a murder, but since you brought up the illuminati, there are more options about what could have happenend:<br /><br /><!-- m -->http://allilluminati.wordpress.com/2011 ... ns-murder/<!-- m --><br /><br />The Truth Behind Michael Jackson’s Murder<br />Jan 13,2011<br />Posted by Grace<br />.<br /><br />Michael Jackson, the King of Pop, died on June 25, 2009. The Los Angeles County Coroner declared Michael’s death a homicide caused by drugs that had been administered to him. Dr. Conrad Murray was charged with his death. And if the Illuminati had their way, that would be the end of the story. But the truth is much more sinister. Conrad Murray is simply a scapegoat of … the Illuminati.<br /><br />The story they don’t want you to hear involves Michael’s lifelong affiliation with the Illuminati, an affiliation that ended in his untimely death. Since his days in the Jackson Five, Michael was taught the secrets of the Illuminati. This is part of the Illuminati’s longstanding plan to recruit popular performers. The Illuminati use these performers to insert subliminal mind control messages in their songs. After achieving the rank of King of Pop, Michael began to realize the danger the Illuminati presented to mankind and approached the CIA offering to spill the secrets in exchange for protection.<br />Michael knew he could not speak out directly against the Illuminati. His only course of action was to hide hidden messages in his album artwork as a means to pass information to the public and his CIA handler. He did so at great risk to himself, and he paid the ultimate price when the Illuminati were tipped off by some of the song titles on the Dangerous album. ”Remember the Time” was written as an ode to Michael’s pre-Illuminati days. ”Keep the Faith” was a coded message to like minded Illuminati defectors to keep the faith. Michael sensed his days were numbered.<br /><br />Fearing the Illuminati could shut him down at any moment, Michael included “Will You Be There” in the Free Willy soundtrack as a signal to his CIA handler that he needed immediate extraction and requesting confirmation that the CIA would be at the predetermined meeting place to take him into protective custody. Unfortunately, “Will You Be There” became known to almost everyone as “The Free Willy Song.” The tragic result was the CIA failed to catch the message. When Michael showed up at the meet, his cover was blown. The Illuminati initially attempted to discredit him through child molestation charges. When that failed, killed him.<br /><br />With Michael out of the way, the Illuminati plan continues today through Kanye West, Jay-Z, Rihanna, Ice Cube, Lady Ga-Ga, Britney Spears, and possibly Mission Man. It is imperative that all fans of Michael Jackson share this page to ensure that this hero did not die in vain.<br /><br />And<br /><br /><!-- m -->http://earthenigma.wordpress.com/2009/0 ... n-in-2012/<!-- m --><br /><br />Will Michael Jackson Return in 2012?<br /> i11 Votes<br /><br />UPDATED CONTENT – READ<br /><br />Michael Jackson will be back at 11:11 on December 21, 2012<br /><br />The Gospel of Michael Jackson will be the death of Jesus<br /><br />Everyone who has researched 2012 is expecting the world to end, to plummet to new lows, for earthquakes to shake and wars to rage. Others think that enlightenment will descend upon us like the soft landing of a beautiful white dove, for our minds to expand, to reach new levels of consciousness…<br /><br />What I can say for sure is that the Illuminati will undoubtedly do something to fulfil the prediction. They probably will orchestrate the next world war, they probably will cause extreme weather and earthquakes with the help of HAARP but I think the Illuminati will use their most useful tool to unite the world into a New World Order – Michael Jackson.<br /><br />The establishment want you to think MJ is dead – they put a lot of work into this lie but Michael Jackson is alive. If you think Dave Dave wasn’t Michael Jackson on Larry King Live – you’ve got a screw loose. If you think Michael Jackson wasn’t the blonde woman at his tribute show, holding Chris Tucker’s hand, you also have a screw loose.<br /><br />Michael Jackson’s return is imminent and I urge you to watch the media intently over the next 18 months, because the media will prepare you for his ‘second coming.’<br /><br />His re-emergence won’t be for the good of the world though – that’s my worry. MJ has so many adoring fans across the globe already, and I suspect that the media will work to change the perception of the many MJ-haters so they all sympathise with him, so they all love him too. It may come to light that he was set up for the so-called child molestation accusations and some illuminati stooge will take the fall for this. It will come to light that his skin condition was due to someone’s foul-play. We will all come to sympathise with him, we will all hate ourselves for doubting him and we will all love him while thinking he is dead.<br /><br />And then the greatest show on earth will begin. The most ground-breaking CGI spectacle of all time will get the green light. It really will be like ‘the second coming.’<br /><br />If Michael Jackson is indeed alive, he is without doubt the most powerful tool at the illuminati’s disposal and he will be used to full effect.<br /><br />No media-fronting superstar has ever gained his level of popularity and exposure – never – and for that reason, the illuminati will use him for all his worth. He really is bigger than Jesus – you saw the world’s reaction when he died. Nobody in such a high profile position can fake their own death without the illuminati establishment knowing about it – absolutely no chance! He appeared as Dave Dave on Larry King so the establishment could see whether or not he had the ability to fool the world – he succeeded. It was also a way to play with the people of the earth. The Illuminati like playing games – remember that – that is why the illuminati symbolism appears in every mainstream music video.<br /><br />He died in 2009, he will re-emerge in 2012 after 3 years of intense MK-Ultra mind control, 3 years of rehearsals in a secret location for his comeback ‘show. (="HOAX"?)’ The world loves him, but we know what the Illuminati are like. They will use this love and use it to create fear, use it to further their agenda – to complete their agenda in fact, and create the one world, unified government and unified religion.<br /><br />This brings us to what the Illuminati has used Michael Jackson for all along. They want to unify the world with a new world religion – with MJ as the new Christ and saviour.<br /><br />We are watching and living through the gospel of Michael Jackson. The story will be written that he died and three years later he rose from the dead to ‘save the world.’ He is the new god-head. Like Jesus he had a life of trials and tribulations. Michael was falsely hated and accused (like Jesus) and lived to tell the tale. He taught about love and has many parables, but nobody listened (like Jesus). He was persecuted. He died because somebody betrayed him (his doctor-bloke) and three years later (like Jesus’ three days) he rose from the dead to ‘heal the world.’ The Jesus Gospel marked the Age of Pisces and the Michael Gospel will mark the dawning of the Age of Aquarius. He will probably arrive with the music of ‘Heal the World.’<br /><br />By Decemeber 21, 2012, I imagine the world’s population will be greatly diminished. World Wars, numerousFukushima’s and major natural disasters will leave humanity turning their back on faith. We will all want something, someone, to help us, to save us and then the illuminati will drop a bomb bigger thanHiroshima. They will drop MJ from the clouds. Everyone will stop and watch the CGI spectacle in awe. Weapons will fall from hands, the earth will stop trembling and Michael will unify the world in love – false love…<br /><br />The illuminati know we are waking up and are beginning to see through their lies so when Michael returns – be wary, be afraid and question whatever the news networks tell us is ‘truth.’ It won’t be a miracle that he returned from the dead because he didn’t even die… I imagine they will say he ‘did die’ but he didn’t – we know that.<br /><br />Many of you will be OVER THE MOON when Michael returns but I strongly believe he will be USED to dupe YOU into a new way of thinking. Don’t trust it. EarthEnigma told you now what is going to happen. If I am right (a big IF), I don’t want to say ‘I told you so.’<br /><br />Michael Jackson will bring about the end to the world’s problems when he returns – but this is what the illuminati are planning. He will bring about a new spiritual era, for he will fulfil the Mayan prophesy, he will be here to save us, but it will all be part of a larger plot, a plan by the elite to gain total control over your lives.<br /><br />I do not want to believe in what was written above, but since you came up with the involvement of the illuminati, and the fact THAT (maybe) THERE IS NO HOAX, there might be something else going on.<br /><br />You ask us to debunk murder, but I want you to ask to debunk the fact that you might be not genuine/fake. If you are really sincere, AN INSIDER WITH GOOD INTENTIONS, AND ON THE RIGHT SIDE and are trying to help us through this hurtfull yourney, than this is not a hard task to do.
TS, I cannot debunk a murder, but since you brought up the illuminati, there are more options about what could have happenend:<br /><br /><!-- m -->http://allilluminati.wordpress.com/2011 ... ns-murder/<!-- m --><br /><br />The Truth Behind Michael Jackson’s Murder<br />Jan 13,2011<br />Posted by Grace<br />Michael Jackson, the King of Pop, died on June 25, 2009. The Los Angeles County Coroner declared Michael’s death a homicide caused by drugs that had been administered to him. Dr. Conrad Murray was charged with his death. And if the Illuminati had their way, that would be the end of the story. But the truth is much more sinister. Conrad Murray is simply a scapegoat of … the Illuminati.<br /><br />The story they don’t want you to hear involves Michael’s lifelong affiliation with the Illuminati, an affiliation that ended in his untimely death. Since his days in the Jackson Five, Michael was taught the secrets of the Illuminati. This is part of the Illuminati’s longstanding plan to recruit popular performers. The Illuminati use these performers to insert subliminal mind control messages in their songs. After achieving the rank of King of Pop, Michael began to realize the danger the Illuminati presented to mankind and approached the CIA offering to spill the secrets in exchange for protection.<br />Michael knew he could not speak out directly against the Illuminati. <br /><br />IF believe this article, all stars are supervised by illuminati to spread NWO. However, as I recall, they ALL sing about LOVE, except for Michael who has songs about social problems. Michael, though, realized that he is controlled suprisingly pretty late than it should have been and approached to CIA for help? The organization that made of masons..... <!-- s:roll: -->:roll:<!-- s:roll: --> <br /> His only course of action was to hide hidden messages in his album artwork as a means to pass information to the public and his CIA handler. He did so at great risk to himself, and he paid the ultimate price when the Illuminati were tipped off by some of the song titles on the Dangerous album. ”Remember the Time” was written as an ode to Michael’s pre-Illuminati days. ”Keep the Faith” was a coded message to like minded Illuminati defectors to keep the faith. Michael sensed his days were numbered.<br /><br />Then Michael started to play double game; fooling fans and illuminati singing hidden messages to them, but sending message to people against illuminati. Wow. He is a monster. <!-- s:roll: -->:roll:<!-- s:roll: --> <br /><br />Fearing the Illuminati could shut him down at any moment, Michael included “Will You Be There” in the Free Willy soundtrack as a signal to his CIA handler that he needed immediate extraction and requesting confirmation that the CIA would be at the predetermined meeting place to take him into protective custody. Unfortunately, “Will You Be There” became known to almost everyone as “The Free Willy Song.” The tragic result was the CIA failed to catch the message. When Michael showed up at the meet, his cover was blown. The Illuminati initially attempted to discredit him through child molestation charges. When that failed, killed him.<br /><br />So, Michael could not just pick up the phone and call CIA and meet with them to say something in words, he needed to SING that message. But then CIA was dumb fool to catch message as a ball it passed to illuminati who caught it as a perfect goalkeeper. Hmmmmm<br /><br /><!-- m -->http://earthenigma.wordpress.com/2009/0 ... n-in-2012/<!-- m --><br /><br />Michael Jackson’s return is imminent and I urge you to watch the media intently over the next 18 months, because the media will prepare you for his ‘second coming.’<br />His re-emergence won’t be for the good of the world though – that’s my worry. If Michael Jackson is indeed alive, he is without doubt the most powerful tool at the illuminati’s disposal and he will be used to full effect.<br /> And then the greatest show on earth will begin. The most ground-breaking CGI spectacle of all time will get the green light. It really will be like ‘the second coming.’<br />No media-fronting superstar has ever gained his level of popularity and exposure – never – and for that reason, the illuminati will use him for all his worth.The Illuminati like playing games – remember that – that is why the illuminati symbolism appears in every mainstream music video.<br />He died in 2009, he will re-emerge in 2012 after 3 years of intense MK-Ultra mind control, 3 years of rehearsals in a secret location for his comeback ‘show. (="HOAX"?)’ The world loves him, but we know what the Illuminati are like. They will use this love and use it to create fear, use it to further their agenda – to complete their agenda in fact, and create the one world, unified government and unified religion.This brings us to what the Illuminati has used Michael Jackson for all along. They want to unify the world with a new world religion – with MJ as the new Christ and saviour.<br /><br />We are watching and living through the gospel of Michael Jackson. He will probably arrive with the music of ‘Heal the World.’<br /><br />Here we see that Michael's desparate attempts to confront with illuminati fails and ends up with give up and be controlled and used by illuminati to fool us. OK! <!-- s:roll: -->:roll:<!-- s:roll: --> <br /><br />Michael Jackson will bring about the end to the world’s problems when he returns – but this is what the illuminati are planning. He will bring about a new spiritual era, for he will fulfil the Mayan prophesy, he will be here to save us, but it will all be part of a larger plot, a plan by the elite to gain total control over your lives.<br /><br />I do not want to believe in what was written above, but since you came up with the involvement of the illuminati, and the fact THAT (maybe) THERE IS NO HOAX, there might be something else going on.<br /><br />You ask us to debunk murder, but I want you to ask to debunk the fact that you might be not genuine/fake. If you are really sincere, AN INSIDER WITH GOOD INTENTIONS, AND ON THE RIGHT SIDE and are trying to help us through this hurtfull yourney, than this is not a hard task to do.
<br /><br />Do, don't take personal. I am just analysing the article. First I want to clear up that I do not care who TS is. <br />To me he/she is not more than any other member here with mistakes & uncertainty in its theories as we all have.<br /> I participate in analysys/consideration of cons and pros of hoax and murder theories as everyone else for myself and all fellow members & guests, not because I follow levels. We all want the truth. To be honest, this article seems total nonsense to me as I already commented about contradictions of the story above. Finally, as long as Michael is alive, I don't care what is behind, we will figure THAT out later. Because whoever does whatever, there is no 100% guarantee in the success and goal achievement anyway. Then question arises, is it worth it?
This has to be one of the most saddest and unnecessary threads I've ever read or participated in on this website. It's nothing against Souza, because I love her logic and writing style the most out of all participants, and I'm not kissing up. It's just fact. But I do wonder about what TS is about these days. What is the purpose really of this thread? Level X my hind parts. It sucks big toe nails. Not knocking the ones that delight in it at tall by the way. This is between me and TS.
MJ = LOVE period. He is a very Positive person as I believe I am. I say he's Brilliant, because of the Light he has always exuded. The word genius is thrown around too much for my taste. He is a Brilliant man that emits a lot of Light and always has. He is an Enlightened and Awakened individual.
The theme of today is Unity Consciousness. So how can discussing such a depressing and sad topic be helpful, beneficial or enlightening in the positive sense? It defeats the purpose of what Michael Jackson is all about. He is about love and unity - period.
Maybe it's me, but I think this topic stinks to depths of meaningless banter. I know, I don't have to read up, and believe me, I haven't read most posts at all, because it's so depressing to read such negative things.
I often wondered why some on here thinks that TMZ is only posting articles for us hoaxers. They have a much larger audience than the people on this board. They are posting many of these BS articles concerning Murray and other MJ related things just to mess with people. MJ wrote a song entitled Tabloids Junkie, because he was sick of how people would believe anything the lying tabloids and MSM told about him. It hurt him that many believed the lies its true - but with this hoax - and when it pertains to much of the news about this case (MJ's hoax), it's put out there as a documentation as to how easy some can be fooled, how gullible some are and how ignorant people are to believe anything that's in print without any investigation.
Again, this website and others like it is not why TMZ exists. It existed and had a large readership before 6-25-09. MJ is punking his haters, many in all areas and types of media - and the ones that rely on their governments or the lying and scheming media for truth.
In my opinion, TS is doing partly the same thing. I said a couple of weeks ago, that MJ wants for people interested in the hoax to prove why he is alive, not why and how he died. That defeats the purpose.
And TS, I do feel sorry for the Newbies. Many folks will run away from this website rather than embrace it. It's like now we want them to doubt us even further. We want them to think us crazy. I know I was getting a few recruits to wonder what if MJ is alive. Many of them were getting hopeful. Many still don't want to. Why? Why should it matter to anyone really?
I think it matters to a lot of people, because many of us always felt MJ's brilliance and radiance, and the love he had for humanity and his God. Many people loved his music, yes, but many more also loved his HEART. So how does it seem right to mess with the newbies to this website and to the idea that MJ is alive - for believe me, many want so desperately for it to be true. They may not understand it themselves, but they know that there was always something so special about the man. They now in retrospect realize that when they used to hear him speak from his heart more so than hear him sing (many already felt he sang like an angel since 5 or 6 years old), they were drawn to him.
These are the ones I feel sorry for. The ones that are new to the idea. Well I suppose, they may need to bypass this website, for they won't get any true feelings of convictions from most. They won't get any CORE BELIEFS from many. Many are wishy-washy, and therefore are not more of an inspiration than the ones that call MJ names, think he molested children - and last but not least, think he was a druggie. They would be wrong on all counts of course, but to believe that he is dead is to believe that he took this drug - PROP FOR FOOL - and demoral and other such drugs.
Some lose the plot every other day and forget that in all movies that are screened have to have a story to tell in the way the author envisions it. It has a beginning, middle and an ending.
Some say they can't be sure of this and that concerning this HOAX/ARG/DOCUMENTARY - let alone that the man is alive. Some of the older posters are still trying to figure out if he is alive? It is almost turning into some kind of draconian joke. And it's sad that it has come to this. Well I can be sure of this and that. No one could have had the BRILLIANCE to pull off a hoax that he has been planning for years but Michael Jackson. I've seen him alive in the flesh after 6-25-09 - and that's enough for me.
TS - You can take this level and either fill in the blank or get of the pot.
[highlight=#ff40ff:16yzxj4q]Peacock,
I hate to put you on the spot but am I understanding you correctly when you wrote above:
"I've seen him alive in the flesh after 6-25-09-and that's enough for me."???????
Really????? If so, can you tell us more?
Thank you!!!!!!
[/highlight:16yzxj4q]
So sorry to re-post this but my original post above (in this thread) did not discriminate Peacock's original post from my question. Thank you.
[font=cursive:16wx31zr]Peacock7...I feel your pain and also feel you are a pot simmering yourself. I thought when TS posted this thread it was one I'd skip. I thought it was morbid and, really actually you wrote my feelings very well.<br />BUT, then members have written so VERY well it drew me in.<br />Now, I realize that...IMO, that TS has posted this for us to be spared the pain we surely will feel in the trial when all these murder stories come up. We need to try this before so we can handle it. We've pretty much done the prosecution side..now is the time for the defense. What they'll say -- how we'll, as the prosecution shoot it down. Because if we don't work this out now...reason it out, we could be drawn into believing he's been killed.<br />I think this will strengthen us. I think already, we are proving to each other that a murder by the illluminati or Murray..is practically impossible and unreasonable on their part to have done.<br />My opinion has changed, I hope you too peacock will find strength in all the research and know that dealing with it now together will be much easier after we debunk it now.<br />LOVE out to you.[/font:16wx31zr]
<br /><br /><br />fordtocarr you took the words out of my mouth. I was about to reply to Peacock7 and try to explain her the same thing. I to was a little upset why is TS telling us the the Illuminati killed Michael? I am not so sure the Illuminati did it, but like you said this is a good preperation for the trial . IF THERE WILL BE A TRIAL. I hope Peacock7 will have a change of heart, I do understand her 100% it is very harsh and a weird predicament Ts put us through. In my heart Michael is alive, if he does not come back I listen to my heart. Blessings to all...
It's not so hard to understand why TS made this post. He simply wanted to learn what we learned during the past 2 years, and how this hoax changed us. When he wrote "I'm on Jermaine's side now", it doesn't mean that he is really on Jermaine's side or he thinks that Michael is dead. He is playing the devil's advocate and this is not the first time he's doing this. He wants us to question what exactly we know about the hoax. I really can not believe to see that some of you lose faith over this and/or question why TS gave this topic to discuss about. Everything is day light clear, and there is nothing to be depressed. This is a great topic where we can also discuss if a murder could be possible. We are looking at the hoax from all aspects. TS doesn't want us to believe anything blindly but to examine every little detail from all aspects. We should know why we believe Michael is alive. This is what's going to keep our faith strong. Remember TS wrote: "Whatever happens, keep the faith."
And as much as I read the posts on this thread, I become more and more sure that a murder plot is impossible and Michael is behind this huge project. But still if the thread is depressing you, maybe you'd better skip it.
Comments
There has been many great comments in the thread so far and some of what I might say may have already been said by other members. The difficult thing, at this point, is that no matter which theory we try to defend or debunk, none of us has concrete proof to back up what we say…all we can do is put forth what seems more plausible, based on things that have actually occurred.
Having said that, though, there are certain ‘facts’ that TS has embedded within his post that many could argue are assumptions. But for the sake of sticking with The Scenario put forth by TS (murder theory), I will take these ‘facts’ as truths. So, here is what we can say both sides agree on, and are not contesting, for the purpose of this debate:
‘Facts’ (taken directly from TS’ post):
F1 – MJ had planned a hoax
F2 – The hoax ‘timing’ was planned up to 9-9-09
F3 – The family is/was aware of the hoax
F4 – The Illuminati do exist AND they were after MJ
Furthermore, for the purpose of this debate, I will also take as ‘fact’ findings from levels 1-3 that TS summarized in the May 1st post. (I am not including level 4 because the jury is still deliberating on that one lol). These ‘facts’ are as follows:
Level findings (take directly from May 1st post):
L1 – The ambulance photo was staged in advance
L2 – At least a few people in the FBI are helping with the hoax
L3 – While not conclusive, most agree that no corpse was used
The above is the foundation that both sides are working on as the basis for both the hoax and murder theory (i.e. the ‘facts’ and ‘level findings’ are not being contested here by either side, rather we are taking them as ‘truths’). Now, then, we have The Scenario, which TS put in very general terms, without much detail (but as with everything in this hoax, the beauty lies in the details!). At this point, TS has really only stated a 2-step scenario, as follows:
Scenario for murder:
S1 – The Illuminati found out about MJ’s hoax plans
S2 – They killed MJ according to the exact timing that he had planned
Taking all the above into consideration, here are some points of debate that TS can hopefully explain (I say ‘some points’ because an entire book can be written on defending a hoax theory above a murder theory and probably vice versa…so I’m only going to bring up a few for now. I welcome any members to add on any ‘points of debate’ that TS can address).
Points of debate:
1) Although FI (MJ’s hoax plan) was in place, the majority of people knew nothing about it. Even if most thought MJ was up to something, based on things he said in interviews and especially the Sony kills music speech, I highly doubt that the majority imagined he was planning a death hoax. So very few people, probably only those that MJ trusted with F1, actually knew what he was planning and probably even fewer knew of exact timing.
Why, then, would the Illuminati have killed him according to MJ’s exact hoax timing? Was it to fool those few people that actually knew of the hoax AND the timing of things? If so, for what purpose? The only motive for that, that I can think of, would be to fool those few people into thinking that no murder had taken place, but rather MJ was carrying out the hoax he had told them about. But that doesn’t really make sense. While these people may have initially thought that MJ’s ‘death’ was part of his hoax, wouldn’t they have, sooner or later, figured out that the hoax was not taking place when absolutely no contact with MJ could be made?
2) Based on F2 (exact timing of hoax planned until 9-9-09), then MJ not only planned the exact time of death but he also planned the exact timing of the memorial and the funeral. We also know, based on F3, that the family would have been aware of MJ’s plans.
Following the 1st point of debate, the family would’ve had 3 months to realize that MJ was nowhere to be found. Sure, we can assume that part of the plan was that MJ would have absolutely no contact with anyone from June 25th to Sept 9, but considering the intricacy of the hoax and MJ’s perfectionism, I highly doubt that there would be no contact at all. Would the family have continued on with the exact hoax timing, up til 9-9-09, knowing that MJ’s hoax had been thwarted and something entirely different was going on? Why would they stick to the exact planned timing of the memorial and the funeral? While the Illuminati may have killed him according to his hoax plans, it was the family who continued with the exact hoax timing of events that followed the ‘death’. Were they being threatened by the Illuminati to carry out these plans according to MJ’s exact timing? If so, for what purpose?
3) Not only did they kill MJ according to exact hoax timing, but they also went to the trouble of L1, staging the ambulance photo.
If MJ was murdered, why the need to stage the ambulance photo in advance? Wouldn’t they have required ‘proof’ that the ‘hit’ had been carried out? If the murder theory is correct, then MJ would’ve really been in the ambulance, either dead or close to death. What better ‘proof’ than to take a pic of him in the ambulance to show that the ‘hit’ was completed? Why the need to stage the photo the ‘other day’? Was Ben, therefore, helping the Illuminati, since he was there that day and the other day?
4) Based on the 333 pages released by the FBI, it didn’t look like they were helping those people (Illuminati?) that were out to get MJ. If they were helping them, they most definitely would’ve found ‘evidence’ to ‘prove’ MJ was guilty of the molestation charges. Instead, there’s many pages which show they repeatedly reported to the prosecution that there was absolutely no evidence even hinting that MJ was guilty.
But based on L2, we know that at least a few people in the FBI were helping with the hoax. So, were they helping MJ or were they helping the Illuminati? If it's the latter, what specifically did they do to help the Illuminati pull this off?
5) In L3, most argued that there was no corpse used on June 25th, but as with everything else, there’s no concrete proof, at this point, either way.
But, if they murdered him, and there was a body…that of MJ’s…then why all the craziness of what followed (i.e. why didn’t any doctor announce his death at the hospital? Why all the discrepancies with official documents and the autopsy?)
If they murdered him and there was no corpse, why would they have taken the body and what the heck did they do with it? No corpse would mean that he was killed and his body was taken away, for whatever reason. So everyone in the house at that time would have to be in on the murder (obviously Murray, but also the ambulance guys, and at least Alberto Alvarez and any other security that stayed behind after everyone was sent home). How did they dispose of the body? Would the family, not to mention the hospital staff, not notice that there was no body? The family, among others, have stated that they saw the body, were they lying?
Even within the points of debate I’ve listed, there’s a whole host of other questions that arise with this scenario (i.e. like others suggested, why would the Illmuninati want a message of L.O.V.E. to come out of all this?). I’m hoping that TS will soon respond to our comments because without the details of his scenario, it is difficult to pinpoint what parts of his theory don’t hold up.
Regardless, whether this was murder or a hoax, several ‘key’ people (including the family), HAD to be involved to carry out the plans. Even if the same amount of people were needed for either scenario (although IMO it would take more people to cover up a murder), my biggest issue with the murder theory is that all these people knowingly helped a group of people (the Illuminati) carry out the murder of an innocent man and continue, to this day, to remain silent about it. Sure, one could argue that they are all being threatened by the Illuminati…but how many did they threaten? The family, Murray, the ambulance guys, Alvarez, the hospital staff, the LAPD, the FBI, the coroner, etc etc??? It seems much more plausible to me that the ‘key’ people who know what really happened, went along with a well-intentioned hoax rather than a cold-blooded murder.
With L.O.V.E. always.
P.S. @TS….be very careful with ‘proving’ a murder theory too well…for if you do, there would be no reason to continue reading one more word you write <!-- s;) -->;)<!-- s;) -->
I'm getting a bit worried for myself AND Michael now because I'm starting to sound like a "wisher" instead of a beLIEver. I need to take a break and re-examine the clues. I'm beginning to think some of them was just wishful thinking. I need to snap out of it!!!! <!-- spale/ -->pale/<!-- spale/ -->
Yes he really is DEAD just like Elisa Presley said ELVIS/jessie <!-- selvis_/ -->elvis_/<!-- selvis_/ --> he did die that day as well in one of the redirects. The star,the icon, the millionaire. Michael has giving up his riches and materialistic items" remember in THIS IS IT he put his jacket on the ground and burned it showing how MJ felt about that item. Just recently the thriller jacket sold for 1.8 million, hmmm. Who is making that money, I am sure it is not in MJs pockets.I have faith that Michael lives. Just not with the same name he had before. Was he forced out by the Illuminatis? I remember reading if JEssie/Elvis wanted to come back THEY would not let him. Who is THEY? We have heard plenty of times this person is worth more dead than alive. Which is a horrible way for people to think of you like a object=money.But that is how these people think. So yeah I think there is no hoax MJ is dead! But his body lives on with a new identity,the master of disguise "MORPH" <!-- smj_bad/ -->mj_bad/<!-- smj_bad/ --> .
I think of myself as a pretty good judge of people and I can usually tell when someone is lying to my face. A murder theory would only be possible to me if none of the other things mentioned by me (and others) had occured.
If someone wanted MJ dead, they picked one hell of a time to do it! why not sooner, why not later after the concerts when he had more money to take? I think the TII announcement was simply a wake up call to the world to direct attention once more at a man that hadn't had an album out since 2001. Everything is planned carefully and you can see it better when you get rid of all the doubt.
I meant to write 7-7-09. I have 7 on the brain and got carried away <!-- s;) -->;)<!-- s;) --> <!-- s;) -->;)<!-- s;) --> <!-- s
Control and use are the key words for me.
Maybe I am paranoid but from my limited experience I think a person is good for them if it's controlable and of use, no matter the inteligence or the skills or whatever.
When MJ made TDCAU - it was intended against ILLuminati, at least in my mind is so. THEY are not even the governments, but the ones behind it all, including governments. Or he just "picked up" that song out of the air and did it because GOD told him so and he didn't realise what he was singing? I don't think so.
the murder theory "crash" with all this and all these events are no coincidence that certainly is a widely used resource for those who are unable to find a coherent explanation for situations which apparently do not. The more we learn we find less "casual" ... then "all" the family would have to agree on a plan to murder all makes logical
MJ = LOVE period. He is a very Positive person as I believe I am. I say he's Brilliant, because of the Light he has always exuded. The word genius is thrown around too much for my taste. He is a Brilliant man that emits a lot of Light and always has. He is an Enlightened and Awakened individual.
The theme of today is Unity Consciousness. So how can discussing such a depressing and sad topic be helpful, beneficial or enlightening in the positive sense? It defeats the purpose of what Michael Jackson is all about. He is about love and unity - period.
Maybe it's me, but I think this topic stinks to depths of meaningless banter. I know, I don't have to read up, and believe me, I haven't read most posts at all, because it's so depressing to read such negative things.
I often wondered why some on here thinks that TMZ is only posting articles for us hoaxers. They have a much larger audience than the people on this board. They are posting many of these BS articles concerning Murray and other MJ related things just to mess with people. MJ wrote a song entitled Tabloids Junkie, because he was sick of how people would believe anything the lying tabloids and MSM told about him. It hurt him that many believed the lies its true - but with this hoax - and when it pertains to much of the news about this case (MJ's hoax), it's put out there as a documentation as to how easy some can be fooled, how gullible some are and how ignorant people are to believe anything that's in print without any investigation.
Again, this website and others like it is not why TMZ exists. It existed and had a large readership before 6-25-09. MJ is punking his haters, many in all areas and types of media - and the ones that rely on their governments or the lying and scheming media for truth.
In my opinion, TS is doing partly the same thing. I said a couple of weeks ago, that MJ wants for people interested in the hoax to prove why he is alive, not why and how he died. That defeats the purpose.
And TS, I do feel sorry for the Newbies. Many folks will run away from this website rather than embrace it. It's like now we want them to doubt us even further. We want them to think us crazy. I know I was getting a few recruits to wonder what if MJ is alive. Many of them were getting hopeful. Many still don't want to. Why? Why should it matter to anyone really?
I think it matters to a lot of people, because many of us always felt MJ's brilliance and radiance, and the love he had for humanity and his God. Many people loved his music, yes, but many more also loved his HEART. So how does it seem right to mess with the newbies to this website and to the idea that MJ is alive - for believe me, many want so desperately for it to be true. They may not understand it themselves, but they know that there was always something so special about the man. They now in retrospect realize that when they used to hear him speak from his heart more so than hear him sing (many already felt he sang like an angel since 5 or 6 years old), they were drawn to him.
These are the ones I feel sorry for. The ones that are new to the idea. Well I suppose, they may need to bypass this website, for they won't get any true feelings of convictions from most. They won't get any CORE BELIEFS from many. Many are wishy-washy, and therefore are not more of an inspiration than the ones that call MJ names, think he molested children - and last but not least, think he was a druggie. They would be wrong on all counts of course, but to believe that he is dead is to believe that he took this drug - PROP FOR FOOL - and demoral and other such drugs.
Some lose the plot every other day and forget that in all movies that are screened have to have a story to tell in the way the author envisions it. It has a beginning, middle and an ending.
Some say they can't be sure of this and that concerning this HOAX/ARG/DOCUMENTARY - let alone that the man is alive. Some of the older posters are still trying to figure out if he is alive? It is almost turning into some kind of draconian joke. And it's sad that it has come to this. Well I can be sure of this and that. No one could have had the BRILLIANCE to pull off a hoax that he has been planning for years but Michael Jackson. I've seen him alive in the flesh after 6-25-09 - and that's enough for me.
TS - You can take this level and either fill in the blank or get of the pot.
Michael himself said in an interview or threw a conversation about how he can say one thing and no one would believe him, BUT if the media said the same exact thing it would be considered the truth. Now, with that being said, I question everyone who has said in the last two years that Michael was in fear for his life. Why? Did they personally believe that? Did they have any indication themselves that he was in danger? OR was it told by him? After all, we the general public who have had no personal conversations with Michael and came up with the conclusion on our own that he was in danger, were told by him through interviews. Yes Michael is first human but he has also had the spotlight on him his entire life, so he has trained himself to present himself in a certain manner. He as well as all entertainers, politicians, the President (ANYONE who is in the spotlight) show us what they want us to see. We perceive them the way they want us to. So again, we were told by Michael himself that he was in danger and feared for his life. His family I'm sure was told the same, not that they picked it up on their own, he told them. Could it be that he did it on purpose? It's been said that this hoax took years in the making, what better way to steer everyone to think that there was a conspiracy against him, what better way to steer everyone that he was murdered but to first put it in their head that there was danger in the first place. All it takes is for someone to plant the seed, feed it a little bit and then watch it blossom from there.
TS always warned a few people to know about the hoax. I really do not know.
These people in the pictures know IMO. TS made an explanation what he meant with "few" people.
You make a very good point here and one that has often gone through my mind. It is frequently said, as if it's proven fact, that MJ was in danger, he had to get away etc etc, but my common sense tells me that if that were the case he wouldn't have taken decades to plan his getaway, for safety's sake he would have left no clues and he wouldn't have chosen a suspicious death. The numerology that many have a hard time accepting, me included at times, is I think the best proof we have of this being planned and therefore not a last minute bid for freedom or safety.
MJ = LOVE period. He is a very Positive person as I believe I am. I say he's Brilliant, because of the Light he has always exuded. The word genius is thrown around too much for my taste. He is a Brilliant man that emits a lot of Light and always has. He is an Enlightened and Awakened individual.
The theme of today is Unity Consciousness. So how can discussing such a depressing and sad topic be helpful, beneficial or enlightening in the positive sense? It defeats the purpose of what Michael Jackson is all about. He is about love and unity - period.
Maybe it's me, but I think this topic stinks to depths of meaningless banter. I know, I don't have to read up, and believe me, I haven't read most posts at all, because it's so depressing to read such negative things.
I often wondered why some on here thinks that TMZ is only posting articles for us hoaxers. They have a much larger audience than the people on this board. They are posting many of these BS articles concerning Murray and other MJ related things just to mess with people. MJ wrote a song entitled Tabloids Junkie, because he was sick of how people would believe anything the lying tabloids and MSM told about him. It hurt him that many believed the lies its true - but with this hoax - and when it pertains to much of the news about this case (MJ's hoax), it's put out there as a documentation as to how easy some can be fooled, how gullible some are and how ignorant people are to believe anything that's in print without any investigation.
Again, this website and others like it is not why TMZ exists. It existed and had a large readership before 6-25-09. MJ is punking his haters, many in all areas and types of media - and the ones that rely on their governments or the lying and scheming media for truth.
In my opinion, TS is doing partly the same thing. I said a couple of weeks ago, that MJ wants for people interested in the hoax to prove why he is alive, not why and how he died. That defeats the purpose.
And TS, I do feel sorry for the Newbies. Many folks will run away from this website rather than embrace it. It's like now we want them to doubt us even further. We want them to think us crazy. I know I was getting a few recruits to wonder what if MJ is alive. Many of them were getting hopeful. Many still don't want to. Why? Why should it matter to anyone really?
I think it matters to a lot of people, because many of us always felt MJ's brilliance and radiance, and the love he had for humanity and his God. Many people loved his music, yes, but many more also loved his HEART. So how does it seem right to mess with the newbies to this website and to the idea that MJ is alive - for believe me, many want so desperately for it to be true. They may not understand it themselves, but they know that there was always something so special about the man. They now in retrospect realize that when they used to hear him speak from his heart more so than hear him sing (many already felt he sang like an angel since 5 or 6 years old), they were drawn to him.
These are the ones I feel sorry for. The ones that are new to the idea. Well I suppose, they may need to bypass this website, for they won't get any true feelings of convictions from most. They won't get any CORE BELIEFS from many. Many are wishy-washy, and therefore are not more of an inspiration than the ones that call MJ names, think he molested children - and last but not least, think he was a druggie. They would be wrong on all counts of course, but to believe that he is dead is to believe that he took this drug - PROP FOR FOOL - and demoral and other such drugs.
Some lose the plot every other day and forget that in all movies that are screened have to have a story to tell in the way the author envisions it. It has a beginning, middle and an ending.
Some say they can't be sure of this and that concerning this HOAX/ARG/DOCUMENTARY - let alone that the man is alive. Some of the older posters are still trying to figure out if he is alive? It is almost turning into some kind of draconian joke. And it's sad that it has come to this. Well I can be sure of this and that. No one could have had the BRILLIANCE to pull off a hoax that he has been planning for years but Michael Jackson. I've seen him alive in the flesh after 6-25-09 - and that's enough for me.
TS - You can take this level and either fill in the blank or get of the pot.
Peacock,
I hate to put you on the spot but am I understanding you correctly when you wrote above: "I've seen him alive in the flesh after 6-25-09-and that's enough for me."???????
Thanks you!!!!!!
So sorry to re-post this but my original post above (in this thread) did not discriminate Peacock's original post from my question. Thank you.
And as much as I read the posts on this thread, I become more and more sure that a murder plot is impossible and Michael is behind this huge project. But still if the thread is depressing you, maybe you'd better skip it.