<br />Can Obama over-rule them and give them a command? Then MJ needs Obama.<br />
<br /><br />no the president has no government control, presidents are puppets and they do what they are told to do. Michael doesn't need Obama or any other politician because they are all sold by banks and corporations, michael needs the people to abolishing corrupt system we live in (matrix)
<br /><br />Well, the thing going on in my brain since almost the beginning, is EITHER of two ways. One, this is all of the Illuminati/TPTB’s orchestration using MJ as a mind-conrolled slave since childhood, brilliantly using numerology as they have for centuries, moving behind the scenes, creating wars, dramas, social divides, seducing the public through Hollywood and the music industry, and moving us toward a scenario where MJ fulfills their Biblical Revelation prophecy for their world domination or NWO. After-all, even the Chilean minor’s story was riddled with numerology. <br /><br /> Or two, MJ is using some of ‘their’ techniques to beat them at their game, and that there are (like TS says) key secret players in each strategic place that are on side in this hoax, and that MJ has some kind of super-natural power on side for him, protecting him and covering the eyes of the enemy. On many posts, Back/Front/TS have hinted at this special protection and guidance from God. I know this sounds like a cop-out answer, just like the ‘FBI doesn’t tell MJ everything’, and ‘everybody’s in on the hoax’. But otherwise I can totally understand why this whole set-up just does not jive with the info we’ve been given. We have studied in depth the rabbit trails of all the people out to get MJ behind the scenes, which has totally convinced 95% of the MJ fan base that MJ has been murdered. Has all that been made up? The underside of web connections to other shadowy people involved in the 2005 trial run very deep, we’ve talked even the Vatican being involved. The crime rings of pedophilia involve world leaders and the most wealthy/powerful on earth. I feel there’s another layer involved that simply cannot be easily revealed to us by TS. Obviously I wouldn't be here if I truly believed the first option.<br /><br />
<br /><br /><br /><br />I've had very similar thoughts to you here.<br /><br />Option 1 - absolute WORST case scenario. I don't believe this one. <br /><br />Option 2 - absolute BEST case scenario. Good defeating evil.
<br />The FBI isn't equip to take down TPTB. For one reason, they are almost certainly under the control of TPTB. Every state law enforcement agency in the country answers to the FBI but the FBI answers to the Department of Justice in the United States and the Attorney General who is appointed by the President.<br /><br />The CIA is a civilian agency department of the government run by it's director that gathers intelligence. They are a little more mysterious then the FBI, but they are not subordinate to the agency. The CIA is independent and deal directly with the White House and Congress.<br />
Yes, I'm telling you, it ultimately and always goes back to Israel. I know it's not a pleasant topic, but even Back brought up the topic subtly, or not so subtly.<br /><br />Edit: took out video <br /><br />And MJ can't be under mind-control when he says this, that rules out option 1 for me.<br />Okay sorry, that video has been removed, and I wonder by who, since the content was highly "anti-blah-blah-blah" (as Back put it) on the part of MJ.<br /><br />Andrea, I remember your mention of 'who watches the FBI'.<br /><br />I really believe for the Bad cover MJ requested, he intuitively was getting this message out that there is a veil of protection/mystery/camouflage covering him so 'they' can't recognize him. His producers said 'We're not going to put a schmatka (polish/yiddish) over his face; he's got to have a tough image'. It didn't make sense to them.<br />
Who monitors or oversees the FBI?<br /><br />The FBI’s activities are closely and regularly scrutinized by a variety of entities. Congress—through several oversight committees in the Senate and House—reviews the FBI’s budget appropriations, programs, and selected investigations. The results of FBI investigations are often reviewed by the judicial system during court proceedings. Within the U.S. Department of Justice, the FBI is responsible to the attorney general, and it reports its findings to U.S. Attorneys across the country. The FBI’s intelligence activities are overseen by the Director of National Intelligence.
<br />The FBI isn't equip to take down TPTB. For one reason, they are almost certainly under the control of TPTB. Every state law enforcement agency in the country answers to the FBI but the FBI answers to the Department of Justice in the United States and the Attorney General who is appointed by the President.<br />
<br /><br />Possibly also some cross pollination.. but JMO. (have no proof, but tend to think these worlds collide, or at least indivuals do)<br /><br />Look like there are some awesome posts here for me to read. Thanks all for your great contributions. Abt to board a plane to NZ for 4 days. (MJ pls dont bam, lol) Hope I have good wifi where I am stayn so I can hoax internationally LOL. Really intrigued by some of the posts here re FBI, but only just scan reading. Looking fwd to landing and checking in so I can read your posts thoroughly.<br /><br />Peace :icon_razz:
<br />Andrea, maybe TS simply meant ‘no body’ in the casket or burial, yet still one on the way to UCLA. The FBI article was talking about graveyards afterall, not the 911 dying stage.<br /><br />Paula quoted Strike<br />
Besides, as much as MJ means to us, FBI has no competence of acting as personal bodyguard or favors for anyone unless it's professional. And so far I don't see the positive connection between this institution and Michael's persona. I guess if there were any, Michael's damaging trials would have never taken place.
<br />I wondered about why they didn't intervene but just let the jury do their thing, taking that chance. :icon_e_confused:<br /><br />Ellyd, are you suggesting a sting on the FBI? Because since the very first time TS mentioned their involvement, my first reaction was that they were linked to the CIA, corrupt US government, 911 cover-up, banker money, and consequently Israel. Afterall doesn’t the buck stop at the FBI? Aren’t they the ones US citizens should fear, the final authority? I recall many movies with FBI playing a small part, and ALWAYS without fail, they are seen as the good guys, almost like angels. What if that is all a big fat lie? There’s many lies Hollywood has been telling us for decades, that I don’t want to get into here.<br /><br />Well, the thing going on in my brain since almost the beginning, is EITHER of two ways. One, this is all of the Illuminati/TPTB’s orchestration using MJ as a mind-conrolled slave since childhood, brilliantly using numerology as they have for centuries, moving behind the scenes, creating wars, dramas, social divides, seducing the public through Hollywood and the music industry, and moving us toward a scenario where MJ fulfills their Biblical Revelation prophecy for their world domination or NWO. After-all, even the Chilean minor’s story was riddled with numerology. <br /><br />[size=12pt] Or two, MJ is using some of ‘their’ techniques to beat them at their game[/size], and that there are (like TS says) key secret players in each strategic place that are on side in this hoax, and that MJ has some kind of super-natural power on side for him, protecting him and covering the eyes of the enemy. On many posts, Back/Front/TS have hinted at this special protection and guidance from God. I know this sounds like a cop-out answer, just like the ‘FBI doesn’t tell MJ everything’, and ‘everybody’s in on the hoax’. But otherwise I can totally understand why this whole set-up just does not jive with the info we’ve been given. We have studied in depth the rabbit trails of all the people out to get MJ behind the scenes, which has totally convinced 95% of the MJ fan base that MJ has been murdered. Has all that been made up? The underside of web connections to other shadowy people involved in the 2005 trial run very deep, we’ve talked even the Vatican being involved. The crime rings of pedophilia involve world leaders and the most wealthy/powerful on earth. I feel there’s another layer involved that simply cannot be easily revealed to us by TS. Obviously I wouldn't be here if I truly believed the first option.<br />
1.Protect the United States from terrorist attacks (see counter-terrorism);
<br /><br />See right there is the first involvement in deception. Are they supporting that Arab terrorists with newly acquired flying licenses commandeered planes into the Trade towers. Ever since then, the US government has had the excuse/okay to up security everywhere. The many engineers/demolition/pilot experts who spoke against the official story, would agree the US Commission to look into 911 was a farce and further cover-up. Of course the whole media world was complicit.<br />
Thanks Jono, I watched much of the video. Thousands of educated professionals in related fields were unanimous --all 3 buildings controlled demolition. <br /><br />Yet the FBI ignored scientific evidence. They may even be part of the perpetrators.<br /><br />http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/history/famous-cases/9-11-investigation<br />
They were the most lethal terrorist attacks in history, taking the lives of 3,000 Americans and international citizens and ultimately leading to far-reaching changes in anti-terror approaches and operations in the U.S. and around the globe.<br /><br />Our ensuing investigation of the attacks of 9/11—code-named “PENTTBOM”—was our largest investigation ever. At the peak of the case, more than half our agents worked to identify the hijackers and their sponsors and, with other agencies, to head off any possible future attacks. We followed more than half-a-million investigative leads, including several hundred thousand tips from the public. The attack and crash sites also represented the largest crime scenes in FBI history.<br />For more information:<br /><br />Press Release of September 27, 2001 with photographs of the 19 hijackers<br />American Airlines #11<br />American Airlines #77<br />United Airlines #93<br />United Airlines #175<br /><br />Zacarias Moussaoui: In April 2005, Moussaoui pled guilty to six charges against him related to his participation in the 9/11 conspiracy. In May 2006, he was sentenced to life in prison. <br />Director Mueller’s Statement on the Indictment on December 11, 2001<br /><br />Indictment<br />FBI Agent Lenny Hatton—who died in the 9/11 attacks—is presented the heroes medal of valor. Former FBI Special Agent in Charge John P. O’Neill also lost his life in the attacks.<br />
<br /><br />Here's a former FBI chief speaking out and saying CIA and FBI were behind the 911 attacks to bring in laws restricting our freedoms, and planning initially started in Great Britain.<br /><br /><br /><br />So if one former FBI chief can speak out against his own group, are there others who work inside that could be MJ's key person? Almost seems possible to me.
<br />Thanks Jono, I watched much of the video. Thousands of educated professionals in related fields were unanimous --all 3 buildings controlled demolition. <br /><br />Yet the FBI ignored scientific evidence. They may even be part of the perpetrators.<br /><br />http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/history/famous-cases/9-11-investigation<br />
They were the most lethal terrorist attacks in history, taking the lives of 3,000 Americans and international citizens and ultimately leading to far-reaching changes in anti-terror approaches and operations in the U.S. and around the globe.<br /><br />Our ensuing investigation of the attacks of 9/11—code-named “PENTTBOM”—was our largest investigation ever. At the peak of the case, more than half our agents worked to identify the hijackers and their sponsors and, with other agencies, to head off any possible future attacks. We followed more than half-a-million investigative leads, including several hundred thousand tips from the public. The attack and crash sites also represented the largest crime scenes in FBI history.<br />For more information:<br /><br />Press Release of September 27, 2001 with photographs of the 19 hijackers<br />American Airlines #11<br />American Airlines #77<br />United Airlines #93<br />United Airlines #175<br /><br />Zacarias Moussaoui: In April 2005, Moussaoui pled guilty to six charges against him related to his participation in the 9/11 conspiracy. In May 2006, he was sentenced to life in prison. <br />Director Mueller’s Statement on the Indictment on December 11, 2001<br /><br />Indictment<br />FBI Agent Lenny Hatton—who died in the 9/11 attacks—is presented the heroes medal of valor. Former FBI Special Agent in Charge John P. O’Neill also lost his life in the attacks.<br />
<br /><br />Here's a former FBI chief speaking out and saying CIA and FBI were behind the 911 attacks to bring in laws restricting our freedoms, and planning initially started in Great Britain.<br /><br /><br /><br />So if one former FBI chief can speak out against his own group, are there others who work inside that could be MJ's key person? Almost seems possible to me.<br />
<br /><br />Yes, yes! Key people in the right places... Playing their own game against them (TPTB)... <br /><br />Btw. Now even seismic evidence implies controlled demolition on 9/11 - http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2012/12/seismic-evidence-prove-controlled-demolition-on-911.html<br /><br />As I can recall, TS confirmed the story of Michael canceling a meeting at the WTC the morning of 9/11? Pretty scary! :icon_pale:
Some amazing posts guys in the past couple of days. I'm reading a lot but haven't been posting as I didn't want to keep repeating myself!<br /><br />This recent turn in discussions regarding the FBI has resonated loudly with me and gone a long way to explain, in my own mind, why I've been uneasy about things since TS's DWD posts.<br /><br />Let me say a bit more: The FBI has never equalled 'the good guys' in my eyes. It is part of the system and as such will contain corrupt agents and officials as well as honest ones. Rather than the knowledge of probable FBI involvement in MJ's hoax giving me 'comfort', for want of a better word, it actually fills me with suspicion and doubt.<br /><br />Then I learn that they may have orchestrated June 25th in everything but date and time, included a DWD patient, and I cannot fathom out the reason for this, because if they decided they needed a corpse (which I don't believe they did, IF they were merely executing MJ's faked death, but that's another subject altogether) there would surely have been 'easier' ways to acquire one.<br /><br />Which leaves me not knowing if any FBI involvement has MJ's best interests at heart or if taking control away from him for the events of 25th June, is a sign of a hidden agenda behind it all.<br /><br />Do I trust MJ? More to the point do I trust that he knows who HE can trust? At this point I feel I can only wait and see and hope that indeed he did out think 'them' and use 'them' for his own purposes.<br />
<br /><br />curls, I know exactly what you mean about the FBI. They are part of the "Establishment". I remember TS saying that it wouldn't be the whole FBI involved. I think if the FBI is actively helping MJ then it would be a few honest agents. What I'm not sure is if they can keep what they're doing on the DL from their superiors, unless it's a specific office where the Assistant Director is aware and is able to cover it up somehow. Sort of like how AD Skinner in the X Files did what he could for Mulder and Scully. That show is a good example of the corruption in the upper echelons of the FBI and the agents who hoped to expose them. I know it's fictional but you know what they say - truth is stranger than fiction.
<br />Some amazing posts guys in the past couple of days. I'm reading a lot but haven't been posting as I didn't want to keep repeating myself!<br /><br />This recent turn in discussions regarding the FBI has resonated loudly with me and gone a long way to explain, in my own mind, why I've been uneasy about things since TS's DWD posts.<br /><br />Let me say a bit more: The FBI has never equalled 'the good guys' in my eyes. It is part of the system and as such will contain corrupt agents and officials as well as honest ones. Rather than the knowledge of probable FBI involvement in MJ's hoax giving me 'comfort', for want of a better word, it actually fills me with suspicion and doubt.<br /><br />Then I learn that they may have orchestrated June 25th in everything but date and time, included a DWD patient, and I cannot fathom out the reason for this, because if they decided they needed a corpse (which I don't believe they did, IF they were merely executing MJ's faked death, but that's another subject altogether) there would surely have been 'easier' ways to acquire one.<br /><br />Which leaves me not knowing if any FBI involvement has MJ's best interests at heart or if taking control away from him for the events of 25th June, is a sign of a hidden agenda behind it all.<br /><br />Do I trust MJ? More to the point do I trust that he knows who HE can trust? At this point I feel I can only wait and see and hope that indeed he did out think 'them' and use 'them' for his own purposes.<br />
<br /><br />wonderful post curls, it's true that FBI involvement may lead to 'somewhere else', healing the world, or having a criminal investigation may after all be only our assumptions.<br /><br />Even if there are some honest people within the FBI helping MJ, that won't work out for too long, because the bad guys will soon discover it. FBI is definitely part of the system...and I don't know where that leaves us.<br /><br />
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<br /><br /><br />curls, I know exactly what you mean about the FBI. They are part of the "Establishment". I remember TS saying that it wouldn't be the whole FBI involved. I think if the FBI is actively helping MJ then it would be a few honest agents. What I'm not sure is if they can keep what they're doing on the DL from their superiors, unless it's a specific office where the Assistant Director is aware and is able to cover it up somehow. Sort of like how AD Skinner in the X Files did what he could for Mulder and Scully. That show is a good example of the corruption in the upper echelons of the FBI and the agents who hoped to expose them. I know it's fictional but you know what they say - truth is stranger than fiction. <br />
<br /><br />No Andrea, i don't think the honest agents would be able to hide their assistance to MJ. it would found out easily...
We can assume all we want about the FBI but regardless of whether or not they are involved with the hoax...IMO it's an incorrect assumption to conclude that 'they' are all bad. It would be the same as translating a 'distrust' of religion or religious groups into concluding that ALL people involved in/with religion are 'bad' or 'evil'. That is simply not true. I also don't think that the 'inner workings' of the FBI, or any other high-level govt agency, will be laid out on their websites lol. <br /><br />There was discussion awhile back on the forum of 'the two factions'...Im_convinced had some really great posts about this 'theory'. Much like a lot of other things, and ESPECIALLY if true....it would be difficult to prove with 'hands-on'/concrete evidence. However, based on 'world events' and how things have been, and are, playing out on the world stage...there is a lot of 'common sense' that can be applied to support the theory. For those interested in reading/researching the 'two factions' (what they are, what their plans are, etc)...here's a good starting point (if you google "two factions F1 F2" there's some more interesting links)... http://www.rumormillnews.com/cgi-bin/archive.cgi?read=41807<br /><br />Of course, none of this may be true or really going on...but research I've done tells me there's some (or a lot of lol) truth to it...and my 'gut' tells me that Mike has been part of F2 for a very long time. All of it does tie in with TS/The Sign's focus on 'good vs evil', 'a war going on', 'choosing sides', 'the NWO/Illuminati', and a whole bunch more 'dots' we've had along the way. At the least, it's an interesting 'theory'.<br /><br />Edited to add this link about the 'factions' and 'Pepsi' and 'Coke' ties, which is interesting considering the product placements we've had along the way at different times... http://www.shout.net/~bigred/mc030209.html<br /><br />With L.O.V.E. always.<br />
<br />We can assume all we want about the FBI but regardless of whether or not they are involved with the hoax...IMO it's an incorrect assumption to conclude that 'they' are all bad. It would be the same as translating a 'distrust' of religion or religious groups into concluding that ALL people involved in/with religion are 'bad' or 'evil'. That is simply not true. I also don't think that the 'inner workings' of the FBI, or any other high-level govt agency, will be laid out on their websites lol. <br /><br />There was discussion awhile back on the forum of 'the two factions'...Im_convinced had some really great posts about this 'theory'. Much like a lot of other things, and ESPECIALLY if true....it would be difficult to prove with 'hands-on'/concrete evidence. However, based on 'world events' and how things have been, and are, playing out on the world stage...there is a lot of 'common sense' that can be applied to support the theory. For those interested in reading/researching the 'two factions' (what they are, what their plans are, etc)...here's a good starting point (if you google "two factions F1 F2" there's some more interesting links)... http://www.rumormillnews.com/cgi-bin/archive.cgi?read=41807<br /><br />Of course, none of this may be true or really going on...but research I've done tells me there's some (or a lot of lol) truth to it...and my 'gut' tells me that Mike has been part of F2 for a very long time. All of it does tie in with TS/The Sign's focus on 'good vs evil', 'a war going on', 'choosing sides', 'the NWO/Illuminati', and a whole bunch more 'dots' we've had along the way. At the least, it's an interesting 'theory'.<br /><br />Edited to add this link about the 'factions' and 'Pepsi' and 'Coke' ties, which is interesting considering the product placements we've had along the way at different times... http://www.shout.net/~bigred/mc030209.html<br /><br />With L.O.V.E. always.<br />
<br /><br /><br />I just read the outlines of the post, F1 being illuminati and f2 being descendants of King of Bavaria. But in today's context, how far is it possible that Michael, if he belongs to F2, pulled off this hoax without any of their knowledge or interference... ?
@Thriller...based on what I've researched, F1 is well aware of F2...and is very aware that they (F2) keep throwing 'stumbling blocks' in their NWO plan. <br /><br />Whether or not these 'factions' even exist (IMO, they do...although I wouldn't bet on all the info about them being 100% accurate)...if we have been able to figure out that Mike is alive, I'm pretty sure 'they' (whoever 'they' are) have too. <br /><br /><br />With L.O.V.E. always.
<br />@Thriller...based on what I've researched, F1 is well aware of F2...and is very aware that they (F2) keep throwing 'stumbling blocks' in their NWO plan. <br /><br />Whether or not these 'factions' even exist (IMO, they do...although I wouldn't bet on all the info about them being 100% accurate)...if we have been able to figure out that Mike is alive, I'm pretty sure 'they' (whoever 'they' are) have too. <br /><br /><br />With L.O.V.E. always.<br />
<br /><br />It is definite to me that the F1 knows Michael is alive, they might even have been the first to know. But if Michael is doing this hoax to turn the public against them, won't that be dangerous for Michael? Because Michael is doing all that he can to STOP NWO...and f1 at any cost would want a NWO established. And if they know already know MJ is against them, won't they try to stop him or even kill him? Why would they let him live and pursue in his plans with the hoax. <br /><br />
<br />We can assume all we want about the FBI but regardless of whether or not they are involved with the hoax...IMO it's an incorrect assumption to conclude that 'they' are all bad. <br />
<br /><br />I don't think anyone's assuming that BTC. Note that I said: " It is part of the system and as such will contain corrupt agents and officials as well as honest ones."
@Curls...point taken, although IMO we're all assuming things about the FBI. But still, if we 'know' that 'they' all not all 'bad', then I don't see how we can use that to determine whether or not they have any involvement with Mike or the hoax. We still end up with they could be helping Mike or maybe they're not.<br /><br /><br />With L.O.V.E. always.
<br />@Thriller...based on what I've researched, F1 is well aware of F2...and is very aware that they (F2) keep throwing 'stumbling blocks' in their NWO plan. <br /><br />Whether or not these 'factions' even exist (IMO, they do...although I wouldn't bet on all the info about them being 100% accurate)...if we have been able to figure out that Mike is alive, I'm pretty sure 'they' (whoever 'they' are) have too. <br /><br /><br />With L.O.V.E. always.<br />
<br /><br />It is definite to me that the F1 knows Michael is alive, they might even have been the first to know. But if Michael is doing this hoax to turn the public against them, won't that be dangerous for Michael? Because Michael is doing all that he can to STOP NWO...and f1 at any cost would want a NWO established. And if they know already know MJ is against them, won't they try to stop him or even kill him? Why would they let him live and pursue in his plans with the hoax.<br />
<br /><br />How you know for sure Michael trying to do that?<br /><br />of course they would try to kill anyone who's against there agenda, I know there are a few people in our government who are good, and im sure they do their best to protect Michael
This entire topic of discussion is us making assumptions. We are straying very far from facts. Not that's there's anything wrong with that, we have time to kill, so we might as well kick some stuff around.<br /><br />The fact that we have is 333 pages of FBI files on MJ were released on 12/21/09. We collectively agree this indicates some level of FBI participation (the alternative is massive coincidence). Beyond this fact is all speculation. The point I wanted to make originally is that TS_comment's DWD theory relies on a foundation of this speculation, and that's shaky ground for any theory to rest upon.
<br />@Thriller...based on what I've researched, F1 is well aware of F2...and is very aware that they (F2) keep throwing 'stumbling blocks' in their NWO plan. <br /><br />Whether or not these 'factions' even exist (IMO, they do...although I wouldn't bet on all the info about them being 100% accurate)...if we have been able to figure out that Mike is alive, I'm pretty sure 'they' (whoever 'they' are) have too. <br /><br /><br />With L.O.V.E. always.<br />
<br /><br />It is definite to me that the F1 knows Michael is alive, they might even have been the first to know. But if Michael is doing this hoax to turn the public against them, won't that be dangerous for Michael? Because Michael is doing all that he can to STOP NWO...and f1 at any cost would want a NWO established. And if they know already know MJ is against them, won't they try to stop him or even kill him? Why would they let him live and pursue in his plans with the hoax.<br />
<br /><br />How you know for sure Michael trying to do that?<br /><br />of course they would try to kill anyone who's against there agenda, I know there are a few people in our government who are good, and im sure they do their best to protect Michael<br />
<br /><br />I was just explaining in case Michael was against them, then he would be against their plans too...that's just an assumption though...<br /><br />@Bec, i understand what you are trying to emphasize upon. But it really hard to prove that FBI is not just covering up but helping with a sting. I had made a list of less than half a dozen points ( only 5 points) that could prove FBI's sting operation...which I'm still not sure of.<br /><br />1) Michael's speech at the end before Man In The Mirror, where he says that 'we have 4 years to get it right'. I believe he's not just talking about the environmental issue, but something bigger, supposedly a sting on someone.<br /><br />2) Latoya has been constantly saying 'They murdered my brother' and they know who they are'...referring to TBTP (perhaps). I mean why would she if Michael was in collaboration with them.<br /><br />3)There was Jermaine's interview, where he said, some American Conspiracy :<br /><br /><br /><br />4) Then there was Marlon's FBI cap<br /><br /><br /><br />5) This point is probably nothing (but just stating) The fans (non-believers) did believe the newspapers which said Michael Jackson died...so sting on media and fans is included.<br /><br />The FBI files are genuine, they are available on their website :<br /><br />http://www.fbi.gov/news/stories/2009/december/jackson_122209<br /><br />EDIT: FBI involvement can also be explained because many people are co-operating...if this was all an individual effort would there be so many people (paramedics, ucla, coroner etc) in on it?
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