This is something Michael said about God. It's a huge different approach than what we've seen from TS/ Tim Simkin. To me it is a huge difference. That's what I'm trying to explain when I insist about being fed religion doctrines.<br />Michael sees God as the source of creation, not as Bible quotes and doctrines and literal Bible study.<br /><br />"It's strange that God doesn't mind expressing Himself/Herself in all the religions of the world, while people still cling to the notion that their way is the only right way. Whatever you try to say about God, someone will take offense, even if you say everyone's love of God is right for them.<br /><br />For me the form God takes is not the most important thing. What's most important is the essence. My songs and dances are outlines for Him to come in and fill. I hold out the form. She puts in the sweetness.<br /><br />I've looked up at the night sky and beheld the stars so intimately close, it was as if my grandmother had made them for me.<br />"How rich, how sumptuous," I thought. In that moment I saw God in His creation. I could as easily have seen Her in the beauty of a rainbow, the grace of a deer bounding through a meadow, the truth of a father's kiss. But for me the sweetest contact with God has no form.<br />I close my eyes, look within, and enter a deep soft silence.<br />The infinity of God's creation embraces me. We are one.<br /><br />Written By: Michael Jackson"
<br />Oh, so this is all a test, a mind game? I thought Michael had some serious reasons for this hoax, and now playing mind games and "testing" believers is one of them? That doesn't sound very likable at all.<br />
<br /><br />Well maybe you thought incorrectly. Or perhaps more accurately, maybe you are too short sighted in your assessment. I am personally of the opinion that this hoax is for many reasons; multiple serious agendas being fulfilled via an entertainment vessel. I do believe the ARG aspect is a game designed to promote spiritual (non-religious) awakening and self exploration/awareness. You want to call that mind games, fine. I disagree with you. <br /><br />But then perhaps I am thinking incorrectly as well.<br />
<br /><br />Seriously, if someone just wants to test me, play with me, manipulate me - or do this to other people, they can go eff themselves. Nothing justifies that, not even a death hoax for serious reasons. That is my honest opinion. And one of the reasons why I always questioned certain "insiders". And come on, if they themselves are saying "I'm testing you" - I don't want to be on the receiving end of this, in general and especially not if I don't even know who this person is, because it's just some anonymous username on the internet. I don't want to be the mouse running through the labyrinth while someone is watching me, may the intentions be good or bad. A decent human being doesn't use other human beings that way.<br />
<br />Sarah, I also think MJ will never say - I'm testing you. He's just not that kind of person.<br />But hey, do you remember Murray said in his documentary that Michael had been testing him for a pretty long time before he could trust him? So, does that mean that we are wrong in thinking that or Murray was lying?
@_Anna_<;br /><br />I appreciate you creating this thread and re-opening the discussion about TS's identity, because, although this might not be news for the hoax veterans (like myself, for example), for the new members it is.<br /><br />You did a great job and put a lot of effort in it. I hope this will help you to find the truth, and I suggest, apart from your findings, to trust your own instincts / your heart, because most of the times, it doesn't fail.<br /><br />As for the question "how to help Michael ?", just loving him should be enough, there's no need to S.T.U.D.Y. this or that in order for you to gain his trust or his L.O.V.E.. As for the hoax, he's smart enough to cover all the aspects, so what's left for us to do is really so simple - just love the man.
Sarah31. This is what I meant when I said it doesn't matter. This is just how I think about it but I know that everyone is different. I am trying to focus on the messages and trying to learn more and expand my horizons etc. I am not stressing about figuring out who everyone is but that's just me. It appears that Anna was worrying/stressing so I thought that advice may help. <br /><br />It appears to me that these people Front,Back,STUDY,TS,TS_Comments have proved their authenticiy and are knowledgeable, have a plan, and know what they are doing. That's enough for me. I'd rather focus on what they/he want us to learn/do. I don't really know, but I feel that Michael is the leader of this, although we really don't know who is who. <br /><br />It seems like this is extremely important and they are not just playing around. We are lead to things like the illuminati,end of the world, 2012 prophecies, bible prophecies, astrology, UFO's, alien technology, arc of the covenant, lightworkers, Syrians, quantum physics, government conspiracies, The Federal Reserve and much much more this year. <br /><br />So the point of this is to increase your consciousness, increase your knowledge, increase your awareness and spread information. That's what the Army of Love is supposed to do. Don't get caught up in just trying to figure out who is who. We have to unite and spread knowledge, spread love. That's the point.<br /><br />
I agree with you Dontwalkaway.<br /><br />It’s a matter of study, reflection and faith. How can we dismiss TS as some fake or mad preacher who has been playing with a few beLIEvers for 2.5 years? It doesn’t make sense you have to consider to big picture and not some initials. IF he is a preacher then where would he get the time to meticulously research MJ's life and put together these amazingly detailed posts and redirects for us? TS even made several predictions that came to happen, proving he has foreknowledge. As I understand it a preacher's life is extremely busy, so why would he be obsessed with a few MJ Hoax beLIEvers? I'm sorry but I cannot stop laughing at how ridiculous this sounds.<br />
<br />So, it doesn't matter if TS is a preacher or if it is Michael.<br />
<br /><br /><br />I don't get this, how does it not matter? The people who believe in "TS" also believe that he is either Michael or someone working for Michael or a family member giving clues for the hoax, etc. Now if it turns out none of that is true and it's just some preacher using the forum and the believers for his own agenda, claiming that he is an "insider" and close to Michael, when his agenda has nothing to do with Michael, how does that not matter, especially after doing this for 2.5 years? And without "TS", if he is just some preacher, a big part of the whole hoax theory is just breaking off and away. So how does this not matter?
<br /><br />Thanks for that question @Sarah31. If I understand @_ANNA_ correctly, this is what she's questioning. I remember in school, (oh, so long ago lol) when we had a test and didn't understand something, we would raise our hands and question it. The teacher would come and answer us. Not GIVE the answer, but help us understand it so we could apply it accordingly. We trusted and relied on our teacher to lead us. I would've really hated it if I found that my teacher lead me blindly. As YOU ask, I also ask, "So how does this NOT matter?"<br /><br />I think @_ANNA_ has a ligitimate question and wants/needs an answer. Therefore, she IS increasing her awareness. And I am sooooo not sayiing TS is a fake. Just that when someone asks a legitimate question, who are we to dismiss it :?:
To ME it DOES matter who it is I'm putting my beliefs about this hoax in. <br />To me it's like someone dropped me out in the woods with directions to get back.<br />Along the way people are coming to me giving me other directions to get where I want to go.<br />They are not right directions to get there. <br />So I wander on.<br />Again someone comes and some of the roads this next person gives me are correct....IT APPEARS...as I haven't got there <br />with their directions either.<br />On I go...on and on....getting no place.<br />Now, who's to say this person even knew the right direction? Who's to say they were not sending me off to a different<br />place for their own purpose?<br />I think, it is very important to know someone's directions..purpose...who they are when searching for things that are important <br />to you. AND actually, throwing in religion, not only effects the investigation of Michael Jackson death hoax, but it involves<br />your very SOUL if you believe in God. Especially, if you believe in a certain religion. You get other opinions on various religions<br />which could be good, but if you came here to learn about Michael and have your religious beliefs already, or you DO NOT believe <br />in God, then dealing with religion is NOT something you want. <br />Some may say, don't read it...but the PATH of the entire hoax is now hinged upon what TS gives us, or what religious path we are <br />taken upon.<br />Now, we have no way of knowing anyone from another. There's no way of knowing TS or myself or anyone will get us to where we<br />want to be...and JUST WHERE IS THAT??? In the meantime, we are learning and investigating things WE DO NOT BELIEVE IN.<br />It DOES matter who you follow. <br />It does matter as you could be lead where you never wanted to go and learning things you don't want or believe in because you<br />believe it will lead you to Michael or what Michael wants.<br />If Michael wanted us all to know something...he could've written it. LOOK his lyrics tell us what he believes. If you want to know<br />what he was taught or believed....research that. Is TS pointing us TO WHAT MICHAEL BELIEVED??? If he's not then why would it <br />be from Michael?<br />Also, like my Mom always said ... if I quote right..."every horse shows it's true colors in time". Study came here with preaching<br />in his posts. Changed his name, and is at it again. You can type in his words to google...and there you are!! You can say...well<br />it could be ARG or to cast off being known...BUT..you are still being led by who knows who, and learning and researching who knows<br />what...and who's to say it has anything to do with what MICHAEL believed.<br />I sure wish it did and will, but in the meantime, it's getting to where some of us can only participate in saying I doubt or I can't <br />participate...Or just stay away.<br />What can "I" do here? What can the agnostic do? HAVE to learn about what they don't believe in to be part of investigating the hoax?<br />What about the catholic who believes differently?? Or the JW? We can't get anyplace here if we don't follow and get to the same <br />road TS followers do?<br />See...there maybe threads for TIAI, but whatever some feel is THE definitive answer to whatever TS is offering, is the thought of<br />WHAT IS on all threads. There is no place to investigate outside of the TS rules anymore.<br />Someone came here and took over our investigation and we let them. And if we don't feel they are 100% (could be 99% sure) then<br />what do we do? And we are also left to be placed into the "corner" with "after all this time you can still not believe" sort of conversations.<br />There really is no answers to this I suppose.<br />We won't like the alternatives either way.<br />I really hope and pray that TS is Michael, but I never will, because he don't lead in the way as to what Michael believed....unless<br />Michael wrote songs about things he wasn't believing.<br />This is all said with love and also, hoping you all are right and it's me wrong. But, in my heart...I'm hearing...just hold tight to<br />what you believe and what you've learned from Michael for 43 years.
Anna, yes, Michael's writing about 'God', precisely shows TS/Back/Front's stance on God, the Bible, EOW! I've always said that Michael interprets the Bible his own unique way, not orthodox way, or JW way for that matter. The 'Messiah' I'm talking about is much broader than just the Bible, but encompasses all religions (including ancient Egypt), all people.<br /><br /><br />Tim Simkins mentions Ellen White:<br />
The Seventh-day Adventist Church and the teachings of Ellen G. White developed out of the Millerite movement organized by William Miller in the 1840's.
<br />That's another huge Bible-based faith group that I've studied, a parallel group to JW's, with their own slants on Scripture, and definately not Michael's.<br /><br /><br />[size=9pt]Thanks for finding it, Sarahli![/size]<br />
[size=small]TS[/size]<br />[size=small]For your information: I am familiar with the STUDY website. Does this mean that it is me, my website? Maybe; or maybe it’s someone I know; or maybe that website was used as a decoy. Regardless of which is the actual case: you are being tested, to see whether you can unbiasedly assess evidence based upon the evidence itself—and not on who the evidence came from, or who you think it came from, etc.[/size]<br />[color=rgb(64, 0, 64)][size=small]http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/smf2.0/index.php?topic=11061.0[/size][/color]<br />
<br /><br /><br />Anna<br />
Michael may love God but he's never ever shown any sign of wanting to become a Church figure, Gospel spreader, The Pope or Moses, etc., you understand it.
<br /><br />[size=9pt]Agreed. He doesn't fall into those categories, but of a Chosen One, born to lead the world through apocolypse and beyond, yes.[/size]<br /><br />[size=small]I love this post of TS's, so Michael:<br />[/size]
[size=9pt]Speculation About the Purpose of TIAI[/size][size=small]<br /> [/size][size=x-large]I love all of you hoax believers, even those who have opposed TIAI; and I also love the non-believers. In fact, I love all people of all races and all religions. [/size][color=rgb(64, 0, 64)][size=9pt]But many hoax believers have not taken TIAI seriously, based primarily or entirely on assumption—not on any solid evidence. Good investigators do not dismiss any avenue of investigation, unless there is very solid evidence that it’s not valid. Actually, TIAI is the farthest from goofing around as you can possibly get; anyone who reads all 9 parts will know this for certain, without a trace of doubt.[/size][/color]http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/smf2.0/index.php?topic=1924.msg27558#msg27558
[color=rgb(64, 0, 64)][size=9pt]IMO, Michael is still proselytizing. Did you come to the same conclusion?[/size][/color]
<br /><br /><br />[size=9pt]Yes, but it’s ‘Come to me (Michael)’, and not Jesus. Slight but BIG difference.[/size][size=9pt]How many other people out there do you see putting themselves on the same level as Jesus, who are not in a mental institution? Michael is telling the truth or he’s deranged. People are clinging to understanding of Scriptures that may be meant for the first century, but not in 2000’s.[/size]<br /><br />[size=9pt]Anna[/size]
<br />[size=9pt]But I'm sure and I've seen, that I am and they are ready to let aside their atheism and read Bible verses and stories even as literature, to understand Michael. But ONLY if it DOES come from Michael. Not from a Lord preacher.[/size]
<br /><br /><br />Michael is going to BAM, and that Bam is the return of the ‘Christ’—him, a fulfillment of Scripture and world history on many levels. The problem is, this is not how Christians think it is going to happen. Their minds are still wrapped around the Sunday School picture of brown-haired, blue-eyed Jesus, a complete and utter fabrication of the white-skinned western world. (See www.hebrewisraelites.org ) It is indeed one massive mind-f*ck, from God himself. If anyone cares to research there is so much out there on-line. And this is precisely what happened 2000 years ago, when Jesus was born and raised in Bethlehem and Nazareth—the religious people could not recognize him because their Messiah thinking was elsewhere.<br />[size=9pt]The message of TS, that I stated above, is the exact one of Michael’s, that I see/hear in Michael’s message in all of the places we all have public access to.[/size][size=x-large] It is consistent throughout all his years, even from when he was young, and still involved in JWism. This Chosen One identity is something he has carried secretly around inside of him, and at one point he had to make a choice to break off from the JW’s because he knew he had a higher calling, which has not been easy for him.[/size]<br /><br />IMO, you won't understand any of this until you start to think outside of the box, as Front says. Boxes can be religious, or other.<br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br />
Well this subject of Tim Simkins has been brought several times already with no conclusion and this time again with abslolutely no evidence, clue or dot to be connected. All the while we received many more clues validating TS and Front but people refuse to see the connections. I'm sorry but I am like this right now
> /pull hair/ <br /><br />TS has not taken over we believed in the Hoax before he came in and it's a free choice if one wants to "follow" his posts. No one is obliged so I don't understand why all the attacks against him. People are free to open their own threads and begin their own investigation. No?
<br />Well this subject of Tim Simkins has been brought several times already with no conclusion and this time again with abslolutely no evidence, clue or dot to be connected. All the while we received many more clues validating TS and Front but people refuse to see the connections. I'm sorry but I am like this right now
> /pull hair/ <br /><br />TS has not taken over we believed in the Hoax before he came in and it's a free choice if one wants to "follow" his posts. No one is obliged so I don't understand why all the attacks against him. People are free to open their own threads and begin their own investigation. No?<br />
<br />I'm CERTAINTY NOT attacking TS.<br />I never said a bad thing against him. I actually said I hope he IS Michael. I hope I am wrong. I love the people here and TS is one of us.<br />What I am saying is all of the hoax tends to be based upon his "rules" and if I don't follow them or research them, I'm totally lost on the <br />entire forum. Opening my own thread would lead to being lost as most believe TS is gospel. <br />I'm just saying, if some of us do NOT fully, entirely give our whole trust in TS, or ANYONE, then we hear things as you wrote.<br />If I have free will, which I do and do not follow most things now because of this..then I am lost on the whole site.<br />
<br />Oh, so this is all a test, a mind game? I thought Michael had some serious reasons for this hoax, and now playing mind games and "testing" believers is one of them? That doesn't sound very likable at all.<br />
<br /><br />Well maybe you thought incorrectly. Or perhaps more accurately, maybe you are too short sighted in your assessment. I am personally of the opinion that this hoax is for many reasons; multiple serious agendas being fulfilled via an entertainment vessel. I do believe the ARG aspect is a game designed to promote spiritual (non-religious) awakening and self exploration/awareness. You want to call that mind games, fine. I disagree with you. <br /><br />But then perhaps I am thinking incorrectly as well.<br />
<br /><br />Seriously, if someone just wants to test me, play with me, manipulate me - or do this to other people, they can go eff themselves. Nothing justifies that, not even a death hoax for serious reasons. That is my honest opinion. And one of the reasons why I always questioned certain "insiders". And come on, if they themselves are saying "I'm testing you" - I don't want to be on the receiving end of this, in general and especially not if I don't even know who this person is, because it's just some anonymous username on the internet. I don't want to be the mouse running through the labyrinth while someone is watching me, may the intentions be good or bad. A decent human being doesn't use other human beings that way.<br />
<br />Sarah, I also think MJ will never say - I'm testing you. He's just not that kind of person.<br />But hey, do you remember Murray said in his documentary that Michael had been testing him for a pretty long time before he could trust him? So, does that mean that we are wrong in thinking that or Murray was lying? <br />
<br /><br />I totally see Michael testing people. But this is just my perception.
<br />Well this subject of Tim Simkins has been brought several times already with no conclusion and this time again with abslolutely no evidence, clue or dot to be connected. All the while we received many more clues validating TS and Front but people refuse to see the connections. I'm sorry but I am like this right now
> /pull hair/ <br /><br />TS has not taken over we believed in the Hoax before he came in and it's a free choice if one wants to "follow" his posts. No one is obliged so I don't understand why all the attacks against him. People are free to open their own threads and begin their own investigation. No?<br />
<br />I'm CERTAINTY NOT attacking TS.<br />I never said a bad thing against him. I actually said I hope he IS Michael. I hope I am wrong. I love the people here and TS is one of us.<br />What I am saying is all of the hoax tends to be based upon his "rules" and if I don't follow them or research them, I'm totally lost on the <br />entire forum. Opening my own thread would lead to being lost as most believe TS is gospel. <br />I'm just saying, if some of us do NOT fully, entirely give our whole trust in TS, or ANYONE, then we hear things as you wrote.<br />If I have free will, which I do and do not follow most things now because of this..then I am lost on the whole site.<br />
<br /><br />Hi Ford, don't worry I'm just let's say passionate and I love the people here as well. I think that I can partly understand (lol) excuse me to not fully understand because for me it's obvious that TS is not deceiving anyone. Now, I don't think that opening a new investigative thread is a bad idea, on the contrary those who really doubt TS will be able to gather and contribute there without bringing TS's name in the mix.
I will just let it go and wait for things unfold itself. One thing is clear- WE HAVE BEEN HERE TO "INVESTIGATE"= FIND OUT WHETHER MJ IS ALIVE-IF SO , HOW HE DID IT; IF DEAD- WHO DID IT. THEN HOAX INVESTIGATION TURNS OUT TO BE DIFFICULT AND TO KEEP FAITH AND HOAX GOING, A NEW THEORY HAS DEVELOPED:GOD, BIBLE,ETC. <br />MICHAEL'S BELIEVE IN GOD AND HIS MESSAGE HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH HOAX AND REAL REASONS BEHIND IT. IF MJ KILLED IS ABOUT MONEY, IF MJ IS ALIVE AND HOXING, IT IS ABOUT REVENGE & THREAT TO LIFE.<br /> AS FOR TS, WHETHER HE IS TOM SIMKIN OR NOT, TO ME HE IS NOT MICHAEL NOR HIS INSIDER, NEVER WAS. THIS IS NOT A BIG NEWS FOR ME, BUT IT IS NOT AN HONEST GAME TO ONES WHO BELIEVED HE IS MJ OR "HIRED" BY MJ.
<br />Oh, so this is all a test, a mind game? I thought Michael had some serious reasons for this hoax, and now playing mind games and "testing" believers is one of them? That doesn't sound very likable at all.<br />
<br /><br />Well maybe you thought incorrectly. Or perhaps more accurately, maybe you are too short sighted in your assessment. I am personally of the opinion that this hoax is for many reasons; multiple serious agendas being fulfilled via an entertainment vessel. I do believe the ARG aspect is a game designed to promote spiritual (non-religious) awakening and self exploration/awareness. You want to call that mind games, fine. I disagree with you. <br /><br />But then perhaps I am thinking incorrectly as well.<br />
<br /><br />Seriously, if someone just wants to test me, play with me, manipulate me - or do this to other people, they can go eff themselves. Nothing justifies that, not even a death hoax for serious reasons. That is my honest opinion. And one of the reasons why I always questioned certain "insiders". And come on, if they themselves are saying "I'm testing you" - I don't want to be on the receiving end of this, in general and especially not if I don't even know who this person is, because it's just some anonymous username on the internet. I don't want to be the mouse running through the labyrinth while someone is watching me, may the intentions be good or bad. A decent human being doesn't use other human beings that way.<br />
<br /><br />Well see, but again, if that's how you feel, and I DO respect it, you have a choice to disregard and move on to something else you deem more worthy of your time. No one is trying to force you to watch and read and keep track of, least of all TS. You can click the red X and move on. Everyone makes a personal choice to participate in TS threads or not. They aren't pop ups when you visit the site or anything. There's plenty of other topics here, in addition, anyone can start a new topic at any time if they would like to discuss something not already being discussed. I just don't understand the complaint, much less the level of aggression over it?<br /><br />Free will; everyone here has freedom of will. Do what you want. Let others do what they want. Everyone is happy. <br /><br />
on 1326743647:
<br />Sarah, I also think MJ will never say - I'm testing you. He's just not that kind of person.<br />But hey, do you remember Murray said in his documentary that Michael had been testing him for a pretty long time before he could trust him? So, does that mean that we are wrong in thinking that or Murray was lying? <br />
<br /><br />I think it's profound that you said this, JT. I do strongly believe that we all need to seriously consider the possibility that Michael Jackson is absolutely nothing like the person we believed him to be for our entire lives. I don't know that I'm right about that, just that the notion is not that far out.<br /><br />@fordtocarr and alsmom, you make a choice, it's a leap of faith of sorts, it's not being afraid to be wrong, it's also moderation and an emotionally healthy self. If you are confident in yourself you aren't afraid to be wrong, because you know that whatever the future holds, you can deal with it!<br /><br />If you aren't willing to make that leap, it's ok! You don't have to. TS and TIAI are not the whole hoax. There are many many many other ways people can participate and many many many other things to be investigated. This is an open world, there are no boundaries. Much like life, the hoax is what YOU make of it.
It matters who one follows. We have to know who's behind.<br />But somehow I have a problem believeing TS is Tim Simkin. Can't explain why though.<br />To be honest for a while I thought TS is an FBI guy errrr<br /> WTF?? I don't know what to believe.
See the hidden picture. Leave your pre-conceived assumptions behind, enter into another realm. Do you really want to understand Michael and TS, or just keep beating a dead horse?<br /><br />
[color=rgb(69, 86, 156)]Piero di Cosimo's "The Discovery of Honey by Bacchus" revisited[/color]<br />[color=rgb(70, 70, 70)]<br />Posted by Sebastian Smee[/color] June 23, 2011 12:29 PM<br />After taking a look at Piero di Cosimo's "The Discovery of Honey by Bacchus" at the Worcester Art Museum in Tuesday's [color=rgb(69, 86, 156)]Frame by Frame column[/color], I received an email from a man named Donald Novak:<br />"One thing you didn't comment on but seems to jump out of the painting is that the tree trunk is a grotesque of a woman in labor. I don't understand how that image might belong to the story. But maybe just another manifestion of his [Piero's] strange personality. Or is it a figment of my diseased mind?"<br /><br />Decide for yourself, but I personally don't think Mr Novak's mind is diseased. I have no idea how much validity his interpretation has, but it does chime with an interpretation once offered in Art Bulletin by Fr Thomas Matthews of Boston College.<br />Where Panofsky's interpretation underplayed the significance of the discovery of honey, Matthews points out that honey had long been associated with the theme of love. <br />The multiple occurrence of couples in the painting and Pan's offering of a bunch of onions (a known aphrodisiac to the ancients) confirmed for him the amorous theme.<br />And so perhaps, with this interpretation in mind, Novak's observation about the tree makes sense? <br />There is, after all, an infant issuing forth from the hollow in the tree's base... Or, as Matthews put it: "For this gnarled and very striking tree which holds the hidden and desired honey is the same tree in whose hollow, as in a womb, we discover the child at play. In one bold stroke, the discovery of honey is thus identified with the discovery of love."
<br /><br /><br />I'm CERTAINTY NOT attacking TS.<br />I never said a bad thing against him. I actually said I hope he IS Michael. I hope I am wrong. I love the people here and TS is one of us.<br />What I am saying is all of the hoax tends to be based upon his "rules" and if I don't follow them or research them, I'm totally lost on the <br />entire forum. Opening my own thread would lead to being lost as most believe TS is gospel. <br />I'm just saying, if some of us do NOT fully, entirely give our whole trust in TS, or ANYONE, then we hear things as you wrote.<br />If I have free will, which I do and do not follow most things now because of this..then I am lost on the whole site.<br /> <br />
I agree with you MJonMind. I also get the feeling that Michael is trying to follow God's plan for the whole world. It's not about a particular group. That's why I'm trusting Michael with this plan because I think he is trying to follow God's plan. It seem's like this is huge and difficult and a big sacrifice. We have to help him because he can't do it by himself. It seem's like God has sent Michael and maybe a few others to help humanity and the world. We have to unite. This may be our last chance. Remember "We have four years to get it right, or it's irreversible". <br /><br />Love <br /><br />
OK call me paranoid but I think TS tested many of us...but he/she used various usernames for this suspicious//...I could name some but I know people would not agree with me...only TS knows if he/she did it or not.<br /><br />call it a training for the army of love errrr /pull hair/
There is no attack against anybody. people perceive it as attack because it doesn't fit to what image they have about some person.<br />So far all the discussions about this have been left in the air, forgotten, banned, people shut up. I just want to have a place where we are free to express our concerns, thoughts and opinions without being slammed. Some of us honestly don't want fights. Just answers and understanding. We are free and democratically we have the right to discuss this subject too, because no one bashed anyone. This is serious and real talk, not bashing.<br /><br />There is an obvious connection between TS and STUDY/Tim Simkin. At least, if you state you don't find ANY connection, this doesn't mean anything?- the name used, the slogan used, the religious aspect and the numerology. These are evidence of connection that in my opinion are stronger than other subtle clues. You see it with your eyes. From here all the questions and discussions, and debate over the entire purpose of all this.<br /><br />Like fordtocarr said, I put here my thoughts also- some of us can just stay away. Leave it all and stay away. But Michael fought all his life to bring people together, to not discriminate anyone, to not separate anyone. This context of "you don't believe, you don't belong" is discriminating. Is Michael's message really so much about religion? Is Michael's will to have so many people leaving? If anything, it should unite us, not separate us. It's obvious and everyone knows, that as long as you perpetrate a religious message there will be always a reason for separation. Because there are people with other convictions, other religions, others are atheists. <br /><br />It's true that TS/TIAI didn't have only religious subjects, but many are based on religious aspects and Bible study and Lord preaching, studying the Ark of the Covenant, etc. <br /><br />I really believe in my heart and you don't need to be his mother or brother to understand that a man like Michael, who tried to unite people as one allover the world, would not go with the principle of "you don't believe, you don't belong". TS said once something of this sort: "have you noticed how some are ready and willing to rather have MJ dead than accept they are wrong?" when it was a discussion about the numerology and how people questioned it. Have you really thought how much such statement hurts? How can one say something like that? It's making you to feel guilty for not accepting it. <br /><br />This is one of my concerns, others brought up other concerns. For me it's about what Michael WANTS. Like fordtocarr said- is this what Michael wants?<br /><br />
<br />I really believe in my heart and you don't need to be his mother or brother to understand that a man like Michael, who tried to unite people as one allover the world, would not go with the principle of "you don't believe, you don't belong". TS said once something of this sort: "have you noticed how some are ready and willing to rather have MJ dead than accept they are wrong?" when it was a discussion about the numerology and how people questioned it. Have you really thought how much such statement hurts? How can one say something like that? It's making you to feel guilty for not accepting it. <br /><br />This is one of my concerns, others brought up other concerns. For me it's about what Michael WANTS. Like fordtocarr said- is this what Michael wants?<br /><br /><br />
<br />I don't think TS meant what you say with that statement. In fact I agree with TS - some would prefer to have MJ dead than admit they were wrong. So very true.<br />To see what Michael would want we simply have to watch This is it again. There it is plain and clear what he wants.<br />
<br /><br /><br />I'm CERTAINTY NOT attacking TS.<br />I never said a bad thing against him. I actually said I hope he IS Michael. I hope I am wrong. I love the people here and TS is one of us.<br />What I am saying is all of the hoax tends to be based upon his "rules" and if I don't follow them or research them, I'm totally lost on the <br />entire forum. Opening my own thread would lead to being lost as most believe TS is gospel. <br />I'm just saying, if some of us do NOT fully, entirely give our whole trust in TS, or ANYONE, then we hear things as you wrote.<br />If I have free will, which I do and do not follow most things now because of this..then I am lost on the whole site.<br /> <br />
<br /><br />Yep. That's exactly what happens.<br />
<br /><br />Well there is another major hoax site that has zero TS influence that you could participate on if this is how you feel. I'm not being snotty, I really just don't get it.<br /><br />I don't understand the complaint. You chose to be here, you chose to participate, yet you have a multitude of complaints about it. I don't understand being unhappy and yet returning time after time again to complain some more and remain so perpetually unhappy by your own doing.<br /><br />
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<br />It matters who one follows. We have to know who's behind.<br />
<br /><br />I can appreciate that, but TS has made it pretty clear that his identity isn't going to be revealed until some later date. That being said, you then have to make a choice; to believe in leu of proof, or that you are not comfortable taking that leap of faith. There is no wrong answer but again we come back to choice.<br /><br />
I believe what Michael/TS is showing us/teaching us, is difficult to understand, and he completely understands this. But in the end it won't matter, everyone will eventually be brought up to speed, when the events unfold close to the end. In the meantime he's leaving it to us to search it out, with blood, sweat and tears if that's the case. Michael still loves all of us here, and has never shown otherwise. It's just the concepts are difficult to convey, but can only/better be understood in hindsight.<br /><br /><br />Mostly Jesus had followers after his ascension, and before his death there were few, who may have been tortured in spirit like many here.<br /><br /><br />
<br />John 6:55-71American Standard Version (ASV)<br /><br />[color=rgb(92, 17, 1)] 55 For my flesh is meat indeed, and my blood is drink indeed.[/color]<br />[color=rgb(92, 17, 1)] 56 He that eateth my flesh and drinketh my blood abideth in me, and I in him.[/color]<br />[color=rgb(92, 17, 1)] 57 As the living Father sent me, and I live because of the Father; so he that eateth me, he also shall live because of me.[/color]<br />[color=rgb(92, 17, 1)] 58 This is the bread which came down out of heaven: not as the fathers ate, and died; he that eateth this bread shall live for ever.[/color]<br />[color=rgb(92, 17, 1)] 59 These things said he in the synagogue, as he taught in Capernaum.[/color]<br />[color=rgb(92, 17, 1)] 60 Many therefore of his disciples, when the heard this, said, This is a hard saying; who can hear it?[/color]<br />[color=rgb(92, 17, 1)] 61 But Jesus knowing in himself that his disciples murmured at this, said unto them, Doth this cause you to stumble?[/color]<br />[color=rgb(92, 17, 1)] 62 What then if ye should behold the Son of man ascending where he was before?[/color]<br />[color=rgb(92, 17, 1)] 63 It is the spirit that giveth life; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I have spoken unto you are spirit, are are life.[/color]<br />[color=rgb(92, 17, 1)] 64 But there are some of you that believe not. For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were that believed not, and who it was that should betray him.[/color]<br />[color=rgb(92, 17, 1)] 65 And he said, For this cause have I said unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it be given unto him of the Father.[/color]<br />[size=small][color=rgb(92, 17, 1)]66[/color][/size] Upon this many of his disciples went back, and walked no more with him.<br />[color=rgb(92, 17, 1)]67 Jesus said therefore unto the twelve, Would ye also go away?[/color][color=rgb(92, 17, 1)] 68 Simon Peter answered him, Lord, to whom shall we go? thou hast the words of eternal life.[/color][color=rgb(92, 17, 1)] 69 And we have believed and know that thou art the Holy One of God.[/color][color=rgb(92, 17, 1)] 70 Jesus answered them, Did not I choose you the twelve, and one of you is a devil?[/color][color=rgb(92, 17, 1)] 71 Now he spake of Judas the son of Simon Iscariot, for he it was that should betray him, being one of the twelve.[/color]
<br />Oh, so this is all a test, a mind game? I thought Michael had some serious reasons for this hoax, and now playing mind games and "testing" believers is one of them? That doesn't sound very likable at all.<br />
<br /><br />Well maybe you thought incorrectly. Or perhaps more accurately, maybe you are too short sighted in your assessment. I am personally of the opinion that this hoax is for many reasons; multiple serious agendas being fulfilled via an entertainment vessel. I do believe the ARG aspect is a game designed to promote spiritual (non-religious) awakening and self exploration/awareness. You want to call that mind games, fine. I disagree with you. <br /><br />But then perhaps I am thinking incorrectly as well.<br />
<br /><br />Seriously, if someone just wants to test me, play with me, manipulate me - or do this to other people, they can go eff themselves. Nothing justifies that, not even a death hoax for serious reasons. That is my honest opinion. And one of the reasons why I always questioned certain "insiders". And come on, if they themselves are saying "I'm testing you" - I don't want to be on the receiving end of this, in general and especially not if I don't even know who this person is, because it's just some anonymous username on the internet. I don't want to be the mouse running through the labyrinth while someone is watching me, may the intentions be good or bad. A decent human being doesn't use other human beings that way.<br />
<br /><br />Well see, but again, if that's how you feel, and I DO respect it, you have a choice to disregard and move on to something else you deem more worthy of your time. No one is trying to force you to watch and read and keep track of, least of all TS. You can click the red X and move on. Everyone makes a personal choice to participate in TS threads or not. They aren't pop ups when you visit the site or anything.<br />
<br /><br />bec, now what makes you think that just because I don't believe in those "insiders", I'm not interested in investigating them? In watching what they are doing? That is why I follow certain threads on here, I want to know who is doing this and why, some people just want to believe that Michael is behind the "insiders" and just don't want anyone doubting them for the simple reason that they themselves don't have 110 % trust in them, because there is no real proof, but there are things pointing in some other directions too. Those who believe in those "insiders" don't want to be reminded of that.<br /><br />I don't know about you, but I am here to investigate, and the things that point in other directions make a lot more sense than TS being an actual insider (and the same goes for Front, just because they "legitimized" each other doesn't have to mean they are Michael or close to Michael, it could be just one fake legitimzing the other fake).<br /><br />I am here to investigate and find the truth, not follow some anonymous users because they are good at being cryptic and writing like a horoscope (meaning, it can be interpreted in all kinds of ways, even in opposite ways, so you can read whatever you want into it). If you investigate something, you have to keep an open mind and look at all directions. Which I did. If you just look into one and then talk about "faith", that's the opposite of an investigation. This forum is not called "Michael Jackson Death Hoax Church".
Comments
> /pull hair/ <br /><br />TS has not taken over we believed in the Hoax before he came in and it's a free choice if one wants to "follow" his posts. No one is obliged so I don't understand why all the attacks against him. People are free to open their own threads and begin their own investigation. No?