[b]So Michael woke up, and injected the prop. into the I.V.?[/b]where was the I.V.? In hand, which hand? In arm, which arm? Michael was very right handed, remember! It is not all that easy to perform this procedure by oneself. In the beginning of this hoax it was said Murray would go free, because he might have been in on the hoax. This is the best way to get him free. Still, no doctor should leave such medicine and needles near the patient.
The IV was in the left leg. (supposedly) Also..
COULD THE DECEDENT HAVE GIVEN PROPOFOL TO HIMSELF?
It is unknown where the Propofol physically came from.It would have been difficult for the patient to administer the drugs(others besides Propofol were administered) to himself,given the configuration of the IV set up. The IV catheter was in the left leg.The injection portof the IV tubing was 13.5 cm from the tip in the catheter.He would have had to bend his knee sharply or sit up to reach the injection port and push the syringe barrel,an awkward situation,especially if sleep was the goal.If only bolus injections via a syringe were used,sleep woul have not been mantained,due to the short action of Propofol.Someone with medical knowledgeor experience would have started the IV.Anyone could have drawn up and administered the medication after the IV was started.
Selma Calmes MD
Anesthesiology Consultant
Thank you Selma for this professional information. Emily.
tomorrow is the next step and its so silent out there, i know its easter, but still, this should be big news, but the family, associates and friends are silent
I agree. I wasn't expecting the family to come out and say anything as such but given most of the media spent their whole time following Michael you would expect something to be in the news.
@Raven
Then why Murrey just recalls that it might be Michael waked up and injected himself?
Will see whether he will be convicted or not. Family must support the hoax, we are talking too much about hoax <!-- s:) -->:)<!-- s:) --> in here and devil people most probably suspect it also. So , they have to support what they started. The only I don't like is that this means Michael is not planning to return or, if he returns, he will defend his family that they did not aware of hoax.
Maybe the Jacksons aren't in on it & this video was leaked on purpose TO hinder their wrongful death suit. As a way to "shut them up". That way Murray won't be convicted & the Jacksons won't be able to file a wrongful death suit against him. Who knows, I don't see any other reason to release that footage, only the estate & MJ's people would have access to it. Interesting.
Could they contradict themselves anymore? <!-- s:roll: -->:roll:<!-- s:roll: --> <!-- s --><!-- s -->
The BS they expect people to believe. What do they take us for? <!-- s:roll: -->:roll:<!-- s:roll: -->
tabloid junkies. that's what. and who isn't won't eat the sh!t that's served by them. like this total made-up-bs-unbelievable-crap-story! injected himself, right...after a truckload of sedatives, he was still able to administer propofol to himself...bvahahahahaaahhh...
they're just tryin' to get murray off the hook by all possible and pathetic means and try to get a hung jury cuz nobody is gonna know what to believe anymore. and there are no other witnesses, so it will all be twisted and turned into a nice mess for everyone. murray is gonna debunk everything he ever said up to now into the contrary, that's my take. and he did already, creating a new timeline and (twice) a new dosage of what he administered. everybody is gonna go: 'd'ooohhh...i dunno anymore...' bah! git outta here!!!
i expect any official (hospital, lafd, whatever) to declare under oath that he has actually seen michael jackson dying or dead and can testify to that in this trial. that could be one of the ucla-doctors who worked on him, not no nurse or anything, best the doctor who pronounced him 'dead'. other than that, i will continue to refuse to believe that mike died.
everything else 'newsworthy' is to be disregarded for being tabloid junk.
I wondered...if this was a real case (let s still hope it aint) wouldnt any of the prosecutors have asked for a gag order already? Cause there is no way MJ would ever get a fair trial with all those leaks. Knowing what his defence is gonna be b4 it starts and hearing Jose s reaction to it...the defence could immediately ask for the case to be dismissed cause no fair trial will ever happen..well i dont know....
Could they contradict themselves anymore? <!-- s:roll: -->:roll:<!-- s:roll: --> <!-- s --><!-- s -->
The BS they expect people to believe. What do they take us for? <!-- s:roll: -->:roll:<!-- s:roll: -->
tabloid junkies. that's what. and who isn't won't eat the sh!t that's served by them. like this total made-up-bs-unbelievable-crap-story! injected himself, right...after a truckload of sedatives, he was still able to administer propofol to himself...bvahahahahaaahhh...
they're just tryin' to get murray off the hook by all possible and pathetic means and try to get a hung jury cuz nobody is gonna know what to believe anymore. and there are no other witnesses, so it will all be twisted and turned into a nice mess for everyone. murray is gonna debunk everything he ever said up to now into the contrary, that's my take. and he did already, creating a new timeline and twice a new dosage of what he administered. everybody is gonna go: d'ooohhh...i dunno anymore...
bah! git outta here!!! <!-- s --><!-- s -->
Except.. if you think about it.. Dr Murray hasnt said anything.. nothing has come from his lips apart from that YouTube video... everything else has come from TMZ and "sources" and lawyers, etc.
Could they contradict themselves anymore? <!-- s:roll: -->:roll:<!-- s:roll: --> <!-- s --><!-- s -->
The BS they expect people to believe. What do they take us for? <!-- s:roll: -->:roll:<!-- s:roll: -->
tabloid junkies. that's what. and who isn't won't eat the sh!t that's served by them. like this total made-up-bs-unbelievable-crap-story! injected himself, right...after a truckload of sedatives, he was still able to administer propofol to himself...bvahahahahaaahhh...
they're just tryin' to get murray off the hook by all possible and pathetic means and try to get a hung jury cuz nobody is gonna know what to believe anymore. and there are no other witnesses, so it will all be twisted and turned into a nice mess for everyone. murray is gonna debunk everything he ever said up to now into the contrary, that's my take. and he did already, creating a new timeline and twice a new dosage of what he administered. everybody is gonna go: d'ooohhh...i dunno anymore...
bah! git outta here!!! <!-- s --><!-- s -->
Except.. if you think about it.. Dr Murray hasnt said anything.. nothing has come from his lips apart from that YouTube video... everything else has come from TMZ and "sources" and lawyers, etc.
I wondered...if this was a real case (let s still hope it aint) wouldnt any of the prosecutors have asked for a gag order already? Cause there is no way MJ would ever get a fair trial with all those leaks. Knowing what his defence is gonna be b4 it starts and hearing Jose s reaction to it...the defence could immediately ask for the case to be dismissed cause no fair trial will ever happen..well i dont know....
that is exactly what happened to michael during his own trial. including the whole legal apparatus in full swing and they had NO base for that. that was a joke, not a trial and it still became one, made out of thin air. just rumors, hearsay, speculation = presumed guilty. everybody had an opinion already before the thing even started. same smell here...just with the tables turned.
<!-- s --><!-- s -->
I wondered...if this was a real case (let s still hope it aint) wouldnt any of the prosecutors have asked for a gag order already? Cause there is no way MJ would ever get a fair trial with all those leaks. Knowing what his defence is gonna be b4 it starts and hearing Jose s reaction to it...the defence could immediately ask for the case to be dismissed cause no fair trial will ever happen..well i dont know....
that is exactly what happened to michael during his own trial. including the whole legal apparatus in full swing and they had NO base for that. that was a joke, not a trial and it still became one, made out of thin air. just rumors, hearsay, speculation = presumed guilty. everybody had an opinion already before the thing even started. same smell here...just with the tables turned.
<!-- s --><!-- s -->
yep that s what i meant.. should ntthere be a gag order as it s a high profile case..but i dont remember who asked for it last time? Defendant? Dont know how that works...
talk about thin air...lol... i like it...no victim in 2005, no body in 2010...
Okay, hold on lemme see if i can get all these inconsitencies correct. the Jackson family believe there was a murder plot against MJ but there are others involved but they can't talk about it b/c there is an ongoing investigation!? Janet was on Oprah stating nothing of this but only discussed the various interventions they had w/ MJ and how he was an addict. Yet no mention from Janet (who was at one time so close to him) about how the media rediculed him for years and ruined him even though he was VINDICATED and nearly killed him and his spirit?! Then Murray's defense says MJ was dead, oh wait, no he had a pulse at UCLA, and NOW they are claiming MJ administered propofol himself? are you effin kidding me?! I really wish the parties involved would get their stories straight.
Tomorrow is going to be an emotional day for us because we still don't know the truth! And the possibility that we may never makes me sick to my stomach <!-- s:( -->:(<!-- s:( -->
The I.V. was found in his leg was it? What if he die with his eyes open because of this?
But, no, I believe if it happen this way, there WAS another person there that administer
the fatal amount.
This is sad to me. I also remember that weird midnight milk person saying Michael
was going to commit suicide, do you remember that?
And when he first "died", that mnm was saying he wasn't dead yet, and then
Jermaine messed up and said when he died BEFORE or something like that?
So he went to the bathroom whilst talking to his gf on the phone?
So basically he would be saying that within these 2 minutes SOMEONE ELSE (since he didn't) administered the lethal dose of propofol, which he believes to be Michael. Why does he believe it to have been Michael?
If fingerprints were taken, it will become clear who touched the bottle and syringe, unless they were wearing gloves.
The following dramatic scenario would have been awful. I have hesitated to mention this since the beginning, since it involves the children. However one of the options to consider is that it could have been one of the elder children to 'help daddy sleep'. It would explain some cover-ups such as Kai Chase's contradicting story or Murray's urge to make them watch CPR and missing security tapes.
What if this is the reason Dr Murrays account isnt adding up and is changing? What if Murray is lying to protect someone else?? Well.. who else would he be prepared to lie for? Be prepared to go to jail for?? What if Murray is covering up for this reason.. because it was one of the children that administered the fatal dose on Michaels request?????
B: YOU FIND IT IMPOSIBLE TO NOT BE ON STAGE?
MJ: IT´S HARD
B: YOU DON´T REALLY LIVE YOUR LIFE OFF STAGE?
MJ: I´M ALWAYS... I LOVE IT... I TOLD YOU, I CAN´T SLEEP WITHOUT THE LIGHTS UP... I´M NOT REMEMBER NOT BEING ON STAGE...
B:BUT IT HAS TO BE DAMAGING, ISN´T IT?
MJ: NO... I LOVE IT! WHEN I CLOSE MY EYES IS SO WARM... I CAN SEE THE AUDIENCE, I CAN SEE THE PERFORMERS...I CREATE!
B: YOU LIVE IN AN IMAGINARIE WORLD...
MJ: YEAH, I LOVE THAT!
<!-- s;) -->;)<!-- s;) --> HE WILL COME BACK SOON!
i got the impression from that tape - (bashir helping again - because we have not seen maury's version)
that mike was taking the michael
I got this from the video as well.
Especially when you look at his eyes as he's talking.
So he went to the bathroom whilst talking to his gf on the phone?
So basically he would be saying that within these 2 minutes SOMEONE ELSE (since he didn't) administered the lethal dose of propofol, which he believes to be Michael. Why does he believe it to have been Michael?
If fingerprints were taken, it will become clear who touched the bottle and syringe, unless they were wearing gloves.
The following dramatic scenario would have been awful. I have hesitated to mention this since the beginning, since it involves the children. However one of the options to consider is that it could have been one of the elder children to 'help daddy sleep'. It would explain some cover-ups such as Kai Chase's contradicting story or Murray's urge to make them watch CPR and missing security tapes.
What if this is the reason Dr Murrays account isnt adding up and is changing? What if Murray is lying to protect someone else?? Well.. who else would he be prepared to lie for? Be prepared to go to jail for?? What if Murray is covering up for this reason.. because it was one of the children that administered the fatal dose on Michaels request?????
That's a thought too, but quite a sad one. <!-- s:( -->:(<!-- s:( -->
I'd almost prefer that Mike were murdered on purpose than to have it been an accident of one of his children...
But then again, how would one of the children know how to administer the medication?
And wouldn't Murray have heard or seen one of the kids go into the room?
Wouldn't someone have seen them?
Also, Randy was supposed to be there.
Where is he in all of this?
Was that report that Randy was there a lie?
If not, then he probably knows more about what happened that day.
But he isn't acting like all of this is a hoax or a joke....
Calm down people. As I posted at "Does Anyone go To Forest Laws 04/03" my yesterday trip to Forest lawn and conversation with french woman who stated TMZ is the source in France and TMZ most likely is with Jacksons. Now, if we base on this, then this must be only way to avoid conviction of Murrey as it was planned as part of hoax. Woman believes that Murrey speaks for Michael. Meaning, this idea came from Jacksons.
I AGREE WITH U ,THIS IS NOTHING BUT HOAX,,, MJ KILLING HIMSELF IS NOTHING BUT HOAX HOAX HOAX HOAX.... <!-- s:) -->:)<!-- s:) --> THIS IS A CRAP NOTHING ELSE.. THIS IS COMPLETELY A PREMEDITATED HOAX NOTHING ELSE . THE JACKSONS , MURRAY ALL R HAND IN GLOVE IN THE HOAX.... TILL YESTERDAY I WAS DOUBTFUL ABOUT THE HOAX ,I MEAN IWAS KIND OF 50/50 BUT NOW IAM 100% SURE THAT THIS IS A HOAX HOAX HOAX.... I THINK THIS IS AN ONLY PLAN TO LET MURRAY FREE BY JACKSONS N DEFENSE.... N KEEP WATCHING TOMORROW THEY WILL SAY THAT THE WHOLE FAMILY WITNESSED MJ COLLAPSING ... IT IS NONE OTHER THEN THE FAMILY LEAKING THESE TAPES..... COME ON PEOPLE WAKE UP...
tell us in simple words....some of us struggle to make sense of all this........thanks...xx
Someone is leaking these vidoes to help Murray in his defense... because in the leaked video, Michael has confirmed in his own words that he cant sleep without lights on him.
And now Murray is saying in his defence, that Michael said he liked activity in his room.. so thats why he had the lights on and cartoons blaring.. and that Murray spoke on his phone whilst in the room whilst Michael was trying to sleep. (so explains the phonecalls away)
And days before this statement is released from Murray.. this unseen footage pops up with Michael saying he cant sleep unless he has lights focused on him, like he is on a stage.
These leaks are not co-incidences.
No, leaks are not co-incidences all. I love how you strung this together, DancingTheDream. Very well done! <!-- s:D -->:D<!-- s:D --> Good observation on your part. God bless you for all the hard work and your insightful research. Thank you for your posting! <!-- s:D -->:D<!-- s:D -->
You guys are talking about leaked videos that says things about Michael not being able to sleep without the aid of lights and noise. This is not new to me. I have known this all along, I have read it and I believe seen video long ago about it.
Specifically cartoons was playing in his room to help him sleep.
tell us in simple words....some of us struggle to make sense of all this........thanks...xx
Someone is leaking these vidoes to help Murray in his defense... because in the leaked video, Michael has confirmed in his own words that he cant sleep without lights on him.
And now Murray is saying in his defence, that Michael said he liked activity in his room.. so thats why he had the lights on and cartoons blaring.. and that Murray spoke on his phone whilst in the room whilst Michael was trying to sleep. (so explains the phonecalls away)
And days before this statement is released from Murray.. this unseen footage pops up with Michael saying he cant sleep unless he has lights focused on him, like he is on a stage.
These leaks are not co-incidences.
No, leaks are not co-incidences all. I love how you strung this together, DancingTheDream. Very well done! <!-- s:D -->:D<!-- s:D --> Good observation on your part. God bless you for all the hard work and your insightful research. Thank you for your posting! <!-- s:D -->:D<!-- s:D -->
Ahh.. thanks.. it just immediately sprang to mind and made me think. I was suspicious about that video from the start because it came out of nowhere and for no specific reason. Has to be a reason.
The truth is here somewhere... if only i could see it.. i feel blinded by all of this. Its like i cant see the wood for the trees.
We are so close to finding out the truth.... so close....
Yes indeed, the truth is right there but we havent yet figured it out. I often watch a tv documentary called "the first 48 hours" or something like that anyway (just cause I want to name it I cant remember, figures!! <!-- s --><!-- s --> ). They always say that any true investigator knows that the clue to solving a crime is always there in the 1st 48 hours, but figuring it out can be a difficult task. So yes the evidence is already put out there, we just need to figure it out, that's all!! <!-- s --><!-- s --> <!-- s:? -->:?<!-- s:? -->
I would also like to say that I dont believe for a minute that Michael, within the 2 minutes of CM's absence, injected himself. I give myself a daily injection for MS and when I am really tired and mentally exhausted I just skip it because I just cant focus to do it right. So I dont believe that someone just waking up from anesthesia can pull it together enough to reinject themselves some anesthetic to go back to sleep it is inconceivable to me. It would have had to be an emergency situation with adrenaline kicking in for someone under those conditions to be able to pull something like that off so quickly. IMO, but I'm no doctor so.... <!-- s:?: -->:?:<!-- s:?: -->
If Murray was gone 2 minutes, and Michael injected himself, why would his eyes be open when Murray walked back in? Wouldn't his eyes be closed? And if sleep was your goal, why have cartoons blaring on TV?
Comments
Thank you Selma for this professional information. Emily.
I agree. I wasn't expecting the family to come out and say anything as such but given most of the media spent their whole time following Michael you would expect something to be in the news.
We are so close to finding out the truth.... so close....
Then why Murrey just recalls that it might be Michael waked up and injected himself?
Will see whether he will be convicted or not. Family must support the hoax, we are talking too much about hoax <!-- s:) -->:)<!-- s:) --> in here and devil people most probably suspect it also. So , they have to support what they started. The only I don't like is that this means Michael is not planning to return or, if he returns, he will defend his family that they did not aware of hoax.
tabloid junkies. that's what. and who isn't won't eat the sh!t that's served by them. like this total made-up-bs-unbelievable-crap-story! injected himself, right...after a truckload of sedatives, he was still able to administer propofol to himself...bvahahahahaaahhh...
they're just tryin' to get murray off the hook by all possible and pathetic means and try to get a hung jury cuz nobody is gonna know what to believe anymore. and there are no other witnesses, so it will all be twisted and turned into a nice mess for everyone. murray is gonna debunk everything he ever said up to now into the contrary, that's my take. and he did already, creating a new timeline and (twice) a new dosage of what he administered. everybody is gonna go: 'd'ooohhh...i dunno anymore...' bah! git outta here!!!
i expect any official (hospital, lafd, whatever) to declare under oath that he has actually seen michael jackson dying or dead and can testify to that in this trial. that could be one of the ucla-doctors who worked on him, not no nurse or anything, best the doctor who pronounced him 'dead'. other than that, i will continue to refuse to believe that mike died.
everything else 'newsworthy' is to be disregarded for being tabloid junk.
<!-- s
Except.. if you think about it.. Dr Murray hasnt said anything.. nothing has come from his lips apart from that YouTube video... everything else has come from TMZ and "sources" and lawyers, etc.
who do you think? <!-- s8-) -->8-)<!-- s8-) -->
<!-- s
exactly. it's all hearsay in the first place!
<!-- s
that is exactly what happened to michael during his own trial. including the whole legal apparatus in full swing and they had NO base for that. that was a joke, not a trial and it still became one, made out of thin air. just rumors, hearsay, speculation = presumed guilty. everybody had an opinion already before the thing even started. same smell here...just with the tables turned.
<!-- s
yep that s what i meant.. should ntthere be a gag order as it s a high profile case..but i dont remember who asked for it last time? Defendant? Dont know how that works...
talk about thin air...lol... i like it...no victim in 2005, no body in 2010...
Tomorrow is going to be an emotional day for us because we still don't know the truth! And the possibility that we may never makes me sick to my stomach <!-- s:( -->:(<!-- s:( -->
But, no, I believe if it happen this way, there WAS another person there that administer
the fatal amount.
This is sad to me. I also remember that weird midnight milk person saying Michael
was going to commit suicide, do you remember that?
And when he first "died", that mnm was saying he wasn't dead yet, and then
Jermaine messed up and said when he died BEFORE or something like that?
What if this is the reason Dr Murrays account isnt adding up and is changing? What if Murray is lying to protect someone else?? Well.. who else would he be prepared to lie for? Be prepared to go to jail for?? What if Murray is covering up for this reason.. because it was one of the children that administered the fatal dose on Michaels request?????
B: YOU FIND IT IMPOSIBLE TO NOT BE ON STAGE?
MJ: IT´S HARD
B: YOU DON´T REALLY LIVE YOUR LIFE OFF STAGE?
MJ: I´M ALWAYS... I LOVE IT... I TOLD YOU, I CAN´T SLEEP WITHOUT THE LIGHTS UP...
I´M NOT REMEMBER NOT BEING ON STAGE...
B:BUT IT HAS TO BE DAMAGING, ISN´T IT?
MJ: NO... I LOVE IT! WHEN I CLOSE MY EYES IS SO WARM... I CAN SEE THE AUDIENCE, I CAN SEE THE PERFORMERS...I CREATE!
B: YOU LIVE IN AN IMAGINARIE WORLD...
MJ: YEAH, I LOVE THAT!
<!-- s;) -->;)<!-- s;) --> HE WILL COME BACK SOON!
I got this from the video as well.
Especially when you look at his eyes as he's talking.
That's a thought too, but quite a sad one. <!-- s:( -->:(<!-- s:( -->
I'd almost prefer that Mike were murdered on purpose than to have it been an accident of one of his children...
But then again, how would one of the children know how to administer the medication?
And wouldn't Murray have heard or seen one of the kids go into the room?
Wouldn't someone have seen them?
Also, Randy was supposed to be there.
Where is he in all of this?
Was that report that Randy was there a lie?
If not, then he probably knows more about what happened that day.
But he isn't acting like all of this is a hoax or a joke....
No, leaks are not co-incidences all. I love how you strung this together, DancingTheDream. Very well done! <!-- s:D -->:D<!-- s:D --> Good observation on your part. God bless you for all the hard work and your insightful research. Thank you for your posting! <!-- s:D -->:D<!-- s:D -->
Specifically cartoons was playing in his room to help him sleep.
Ahh.. thanks.. it just immediately sprang to mind and made me think. I was suspicious about that video from the start because it came out of nowhere and for no specific reason. Has to be a reason.
Yes indeed, the truth is right there but we havent yet figured it out. I often watch a tv documentary called "the first 48 hours" or something like that anyway (just cause I want to name it I cant remember, figures!! <!-- s
I would also like to say that I dont believe for a minute that Michael, within the 2 minutes of CM's absence, injected himself. I give myself a daily injection for MS and when I am really tired and mentally exhausted I just skip it because I just cant focus to do it right. So I dont believe that someone just waking up from anesthesia can pull it together enough to reinject themselves some anesthetic to go back to sleep it is inconceivable to me. It would have had to be an emergency situation with adrenaline kicking in for someone under those conditions to be able to pull something like that off so quickly. IMO, but I'm no doctor so.... <!-- s:?: -->:?:<!-- s:?: -->