Are we supposed to be put in our place? As in, investigators? Yeah right, investigate this... <!-- s:?: -->:?:<!-- s:?: --> <!-- s:arrow: -->:arrow:<!-- s:arrow: --> <!-- s:| -->:|<!-- s:| -->
It's her
Is it just me, or does anyone else think it is a strange coincidence that Tom Sneddon BECAME (that is, was put in place) as county prosecutor, with jurisdiction over Neverland, the year all this started, when THRILLER came out??
What are you suggesting?
Hi MJonmind, I'm sorry, I haven't been in this thread for a while and missed your post, until today. <!-- s:( -->:(<!-- s:( -->
I'm not suggesting anything, yet. <!-- sconfused/ -->confused/<!-- sconfused/ --> Just wondering about things. All kinds of things. Wondering if a guy who has the patience to plan a very complex involved Hoax over a period of twenty some years, had anything at all to do with the CONVENIENT placement of one of the intermittently most mentioned characters in the story of Michael Jackson and His Completely Fantastic Life, Tom Sneddon, IN the very jurisdiction MJ would soon own property, and become engulfed in such deep frightening drama. It's probably just a fantastic coincidence. Yep.
It's just that, I read somewhere, and someone may have posted it right here on this board somewhere, about how it was ruled in court <!-- s:o -->:o<!-- s:o --> that the media cannot be held accountable for fabricating parts of the news to make it a better story for ratings, or for quoting "truth" told to them by any source, because NO one REALLY knows the TRUTH... <!-- s:shock: -->:shock:<!-- s:shock: -->
This means that Tom Sneddon and ALL his press conferences about pursuing and prosecuting "that pervert Michael Jackson"....COULD be faked. I didn't see any of the trial, but I remember Sneddon flapping his lips on the TV evening news, as I was walking through the room. I remember cough-saying: <!-- s:x -->:x<!-- s:x --> "Bull$#!!!"
The gut KNOWS crap at first hearing. I was just thinking the charges were trumped up. I wonder now if <!-- ssuspicious// -->suspicious//<!-- ssuspicious// --> MJ built a crankable Magical Hoax machine from P.T. Barnum's books, and was cranking things out, THAT far back? <!-- spale/ -->pale/<!-- spale/ --> <!-- s:o -->:o<!-- s:o --> <!-- s:shock: -->:shock:<!-- s:shock: -->
Naturally, if I were prosecuting someone SO loved, I would have wisely hidden myself as well, and let an actor portray me before the public, to keep from getting shot. But...how could Sneddon know he was going to NEED a standin, in 1983?
I'm wondering if something far more horrible was going on, and the story which was given to the public was a front, a diversion, to enable the FBI to swoop in and get the REAL people terrorizing MJ from another direction? More than we think, things are kept from the public to prevent PANIC and mass hysteria.
If I am suggesting anything, it is that I need help, just playing with the puzzle pieces. <!-- serrrr -->errrr<!-- serrrr --> <!-- s:? -->:?<!-- s:? --> They keep forming a picture that wasn't on the box MJ <!-- s:ugeek: -->:ugeek:<!-- s:ugeek: --> gave us.... <!-- scrash/ -->crash/<!-- scrash/ --> <!-- s;) -->;)<!-- s;) -->
Thanks for answering my question, and I 'think' I know what you mean. I have also these thoughts sticking in my mind that won't go away, but then I say, "Nah", it just can't be, so I shove them back.
Im_convincedmjalive » Thu May 19, 2011 11:54 pm
This is MY opinion. This thread has gone straight into the crapper ....This thread is not about The Royal wedding, Tohme Tohme, Princess Diana, etc. Ya think maybe that is why TS hasn't made a comment? I do.
We didn't come to conclusions with any of the other levels, and suddenly TS would announce that we're ready for the next level, which is what I think he will do now, IF he comes soon, since we never have gaurantees he will visit ever again. My feeling is that the natural direction of our attempts to answer his question led us to these precise topics you felt weren't warranted. Without some vital information we are endlessly speculating on who the targets of the sting court would be. But in these 18 pages has been lots of helpful info that I've learned from, and I think that's more TS's goal anyway--our learning collectively with his questions as a guide to discussion.
WHY is it that whenever I have stated very clearly that this is MY opinion someone goes on the defense? Everyone states their opinion and most do not get feedback or comments saying personal/feely reaction comments.
@MJonmind IF you feel the last 7 pages were of help then WHAT conclusion have you decided; STING court or HOAX court? That is what the bottom line is. IF the info is relevant for you and anyone else to decide then say it, present a theory so it can be challenged. The way the thread is now there is info but most aren't making a decision and stating it on the record or forming a theory of their decisions.
Let me have my opinions without the defensive comments in reply. I read this thread everyday even if I haven't commented alot lately. Step out of the comfort zone and just say what it is you think and don't be afraid to be wrong. It may turn out your right but you will never know if you strattle the fence.
WHY is it that whenever I have stated very clearly that this is MY opinion someone goes on the defense? Everyone states their opinion and most do not get feedback or comments saying personal/feely reaction comments.
@MJonmind IF you feel the last 7 pages were of help then WHAT conclusion have you decided; STING court or HOAX court? That is what the bottom line is. IF the info is relevant for you and anyone else to decide then say it, present a theory so it can be challenged. The way the thread is now there is info but most aren't making a decision and stating it on the record or forming a theory of their decisions.
Let me have my opinions without the defensive comments in reply. I read this thread everyday even if I haven't commented alot lately. Step out of the comfort zone and just say what it is you think and don't be afraid to be wrong. It may turn out your right but you will never know if you strattle the fence.
I've already said I think it's predominately a hoax court, but if it is also a sting court then it's more likely international not local. Please don't be annoyed with me--I'm not a strong 'digger' for evidence and facts like you--I just contribute the best I can. Can we really get to the bottom of this hole/question? <!-- ssuspicious// -->suspicious//<!-- ssuspicious// --> <!-- s8-) -->8-)<!-- s8-) -->
WHY is it that whenever I have stated very clearly that this is MY opinion someone goes on the defense? Everyone states their opinion and most do not get feedback or comments saying personal/feely reaction comments.
@MJonmind IF you feel the last 7 pages were of help then WHAT conclusion have you decided; STING court or HOAX court? That is what the bottom line is. IF the info is relevant for you and anyone else to decide then say it, present a theory so it can be challenged. The way the thread is now there is info but most aren't making a decision and stating it on the record or forming a theory of their decisions.
Let me have my opinions without the defensive comments in reply. I read this thread everyday even if I haven't commented alot lately. Step out of the comfort zone and just say what it is you think and don't be afraid to be wrong. It may turn out your right but you will never know if you strattle the fence.
Peace
I agree with what you said though...also when we go off topic it is hard to understand what we are really supposed to be doing but even when we are on topic, it is hard when we have shared our theories and then it's kinda like a, what next?
Today I saw this quote outside a church and I thought it fit in with what you said earlier...it was something like "Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere"...it made me think, if MJ fixes the justice, in say, the L.A court system, although it won't fix it everywhere, it will make more people aware and maybe even help other places where there is injustice, like get the ball rolling so to speak.
WHY is it that whenever I have stated very clearly that this is MY opinion someone goes on the defense? Everyone states their opinion and most do not get feedback or comments saying personal/feely reaction comments.
@MJonmind IF you feel the last 7 pages were of help then WHAT conclusion have you decided; STING court or HOAX court? That is what the bottom line is. IF the info is relevant for you and anyone else to decide then say it, present a theory so it can be challenged. The way the thread is now there is info but most aren't making a decision and stating it on the record or forming a theory of their decisions.
Let me have my opinions without the defensive comments in reply. I read this thread everyday even if I haven't commented alot lately. Step out of the comfort zone and just say what it is you think and don't be afraid to be wrong. It may turn out your right but you will never know if you strattle the fence.
Peace
I am going to get defensive here as well. As bec already said, we do not have enough knowledge of how the FBI operates and it's only guessing who the focus of the sting would be. People did give their opinions on it and explained why, which is also why the Diana and Tohme comments were posted. The Diana discussion is just to show why for example the royal establishment could be a focus. Others think Tohme might have the answers, that is why Tohme is also discussed. There have been many comments with arguments about why it would be a hoax or sting court TS could have commented on, so in my opinion the fact that this thread has gone somewhat off topic is not the reason TS hasn't commented yet. This thread is nearly 3 weeks old, so it's not really that strange. We are simply stuck here since we can't think of something else, or are still thinking and trying to get there by discussing matters that seem off topic. I really don't think that that is why TS hasn't commented yet, most definitely since people said 10+ pages back that they were stuck. In my opinion there is a chance he won't comment on it at all, if this sting is still on-going. Why make some people wiser than they already are? I bet he didn't only made himself believable to many of us.
Besides that, TS can get everyone back on topic in a blink of an eye if he wants, as he did before. And we must not forget that TS is also just a human being, who might have other important things coming his path which need to be dealt with first.
"For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places."
In this thread May 1 i´m lost anyway, because I´m not in the FBI thing at all, and as a non-native English speaker i´m coming to my edge sometimes.
But even when I can´t post here at the moment, I´m reading carefully and I personally don´t wait for TS, in the meantime I re - read all his posts, redirects, updates because maybe I haven´t found an important detail yet.
And half of the time they were married they weren't living together, if it's true what they said.
But were they married for good? Because the marriage certificate is on Michael Joseph , not Michael Joe.
She says he was surrounded by leeches. Was he that naive to not see ?
Was she wrong?
We'll never solve the mistery named Michael Jackson. Summing up what I know about him returns a blank page....again....
There were so many vampires and leeches on your back we already know, or else Michael would not have suffered so much. Michael seemed innocent, but do not know if he was naive enough to not realize anything. But if he had noticed, would he have been charged again in 2003?
This statement of Liza, confirms what Latoya and Joe said about conspiracy and horrible people who were controlling Michael's life. If it were so, then it isn't difficult to accept the theory of murder!
It is very difficult to know. Believers see him as a hero and non believers as victim. Which one is correct?
Do you remember of a phrase spoken in the movie V? "I'm more of a demon when I act like an angel"[/b] <!-- s:twisted: -->:twisted:<!-- s:twisted: -->
That is correct, Michael?[/quote]
interesting that you point this out. that is the very feeling i get sometimes watching him in certain circumstances.
this is funny <!-- spenguin/ -->penguin/<!-- spenguin/ --> i don't think we have ever had a thread that went more than one page that didn't get off topic. i can't for the life of me see how one can put together a puzzle without one part of the picture slopping over onto another peice of the puzzle and then that one becoming a part of the next. it is the process that has gone on the intire time.maybe what you are really looking for is for people to commit to a conclusion, perhaps in the hopes that it will provoke ts to return and give us a grade.
how does that work exactly , someone writes a script and then it plays out in real life? doesn't that leave an awful lot to luck or whatever? guess it could be but it is a very risky sounding venture for everyone involved not just it's creater.
I agree. The clues have all pointed to this conclusion from the beginning. Our original instincts were probably the most accurate ones... whenever I read back... ancient hoax history threads and blogs... the good theories from then are largely all still standing. As we progressed further, the theories start to get a little more out there, a little more fantastical, and much more likely to be debunked with time.
I laid out my theory for hoax court, with supporting evidence, 4 or 5 pieces of supporting evidence, on page 1... and I'm sticking with it. I have no reason to change my mind, we have had no developments since then that caused me to do so. We can only turn it over so many times. We are working with 100% pure speculation... and that's a very soft vantage point to work from.
As far as being off topic, I know I feel a need to keep this thread on page one of new posts, because I want TS to see that we are actively interested in his discussion... keeping the home fires burning if you will. Surely others have posted from time to time for the same reason. I am experiencing a great deal of anxiety in regards to TS's absence. This thread is the only link to him that we have at current.
And half of the time they were married they weren't living together, if it's true what they said.
But were they married for good? Because the marriage certificate is on Michael Joseph , not Michael Joe.
She says he was surrounded by leeches. Was he that naive to not see ?
Was she wrong?
We'll never solve the mistery named Michael Jackson. Summing up what I know about him returns a blank page....again....
There were so many vampires and leeches on your back we already know, or else Michael would not have suffered so much. Michael seemed innocent, but do not know if he was naive enough to not realize anything. But if he had noticed, would he have been charged again in 2003?
This statement of Liza, confirms what Latoya and Joe said about conspiracy and horrible people who were controlling Michael's life. If it were so, then it isn't difficult to accept the theory of murder!
It is very difficult to know. Believers see him as a hero and non believers as victim. Which one is correct?
Do you remember of a phrase spoken in the movie V? "I'm more of a demon when I act like an angel"[/b] <!-- s:twisted: -->:twisted:<!-- s:twisted: -->
That is correct, Michael?[/quote]
interesting that you point this out. that is the very feeling i get sometimes watching him in certain circumstances.
yes the same here but I can't decide if he really was playing little hoaxes - playing the victim role - or he simply is not very good at being persuasive. You know there are people who have a real talent to get in trouble all the time and what if Michael is one of them?
WHY is it that whenever I have stated very clearly that this is MY opinion someone goes on the defense? Everyone states their opinion and most do not get feedback or comments saying personal/feely reaction comments.
@MJonmind IF you feel the last 7 pages were of help then WHAT conclusion have you decided; STING court or HOAX court? That is what the bottom line is. IF the info is relevant for you and anyone else to decide then say it, present a theory so it can be challenged. The way the thread is now there is info but most aren't making a decision and stating it on the record or forming a theory of their decisions.
Let me have my opinions without the defensive comments in reply. I read this thread everyday even if I haven't commented alot lately. Step out of the comfort zone and just say what it is you think and don't be afraid to be wrong. It may turn out your right but you will never know if you strattle the fence.
Peace
I am going to get defensive here as well. As bec already said, we do not have enough knowledge of how the FBI operates and it's only guessing who the focus of the sting would be. People did give their opinions on it and explained why, which is also why the Diana and Tohme comments were posted. The Diana discussion is just to show why for example the royal establishment could be a focus. Others think Tohme might have the answers, that is why Tohme is also discussed. There have been many comments with arguments about why it would be a hoax or sting court TS could have commented on, so in my opinion the fact that this thread has gone somewhat off topic is not the reason TS hasn't commented yet. This thread is nearly 3 weeks old, so it's not really that strange. We are simply stuck here since we can't think of something else, or are still thinking and trying to get there by discussing matters that seem off topic. I really don't think that that is why TS hasn't commented yet, most definitely since people said 10+ pages back that they were stuck. In my opinion there is a chance he won't comment on it at all, if this sting is still on-going. Why make some people wiser than they already are? I bet he didn't only made himself believable to many of us.
Besides that, TS can get everyone back on topic in a blink of an eye if he wants, as he did before. And we must not forget that TS is also just a human being, who might have other important things coming his path which need to be dealt with first.
WHY is it that whenever I have stated very clearly that this is MY opinion someone goes on the defense? <!-- sfresse/ -->fresse/<!-- sfresse/ -->
Again why is it that I can't have MY opinion on something without people getting defensive. I never named names and pointed fingers at any of you who have commented to me after I posted MY recent opinion based on MY observation. I never said Souza you are...or MJonmind you are...
I do not agree with what bec said about not having enough knowledge about the FBI. I do think we have enough info to form a theory and opinion of what we (collectively), you, me or anyone else thinks this STING or HOAX court is. I do not think we need to have every detail down to exactly who (names) in order to have a good idea of who (many entities, systems) the majority of the sting operation is meant for. I do not think this is as international as you do.
The main point of this thread and question from TS was about the LOCAL (USA) court in LA. This question of whether or not it is a STING court or HOAX court is based on Murray's trial and again that is in the USA and LA.
I obviously think differently and I respect everyones right to their thoughts, theories, and opinions. Why can't I have the same respect? I specifically said the last 7 pages of info was not what this topic was about. I didn't say the first 11 pages (minus the panic comments) didn't have good info regarding STING vs HOAX court. I do think in those pages we were on topic and had just begun to debate the 2 theories and then it went south, east, west and north as far as the topics being discussed; which in my opinion have nothing to do with a LOCAL LA court system problem when it comes to Murray.
Of course TS could turn this thread around in an instant but again that was not what I was saying. I stated my opinion on why I thought he hasn't commented. I am very aware of TS being human and having other obligations so that was not what I was referring to when I stated why I thought he hasn't commented. I am taking a break again and will just go to read only in this thread.
Why can't I post MY opinion on it? Yes, we have enough to come up with a THEORY, you state that right. Theory aka speculation.
But anyways, I am not going to have a discussion over it. I'm too busy already with other members 'discussing'.
"For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places."
I think that maybe TS hasn't been around because there HAS been progress made in this thread, as off topic as it may seem to have gotten. Is gotten a word? <!-- s:? -->:?<!-- s:? --> Anyways, the way I see it is - we have a hoax (Michael's "death") and we have a sting (FBI involvement). So that's why I think the whole court thing is a combination of both, which I've said before in this thread. It doesn't necessarily HAVE to be one or the other, in fact, that makes the least sense to me.
And even if this thread has gone off topic or way out there, I don't see anybody de-bunking the research and information that members have given. I do realize that it's hard to debunk a "conspiracy theory" but when there are so many coincidences and eyebrow-raising questions (like the Princess Di stuff), it's hard to just dismiss it. And I do think the sting goes beyond Michael's immediate circle. Remember, the main question posed by TS in this thread:
We are now at the most important level: who is the focus of The Sting? Keep in mind the possibility that more than one person or entity is the focus.
I don't think we'll just be told straight out who The Sting is focused on but I'm sure TS will come back and comment at an appropriate TIME.
Why can't I post MY opinion on it? Yes, we have enough to come up with a THEORY, you state that right. Theory aka speculation.
But anyways, I am not going to have a discussion over it. I'm too busy already with other members 'discussing'.
Souza I have said already I respect others opinions and I will say again, you do have a right to your opinion too. I am already a strong believer in everyone having that right so why would I think you have no right?
My main point in what I have said is: the basic simple questions and area of focus is whether or not the court is a STING or HOAX court. I am basing that thought on what TS said from the start. While I agree with the findings of Princess Diana and the film exposing The Royal Family being behind her death; I do not think that was where we were supposed to go in this thread. Tohme is a relative character if one wants to say he is part of the focus regarding the sting. As for theories some do turn out to be true so it is beyond speculation sometimes. All the dirty shit and secrets about the world I am very aware of. I was suggesting what the MAIN point of this thread was supposed to be about.
Peace
It’s time for another level. <!-- s8-) -->8-)<!-- s8-) -->
We are now at the most important level: who is the focus of The Sting? Keep in mind the possibility that more than one person or entity is the focus.
Most specifically, though, we need to investigate whether the entire court is in on the hoax, or could the court itself be the focus of the FBI investigation (or part of the investigation). Some have already proposed this possibility, while others have summarily dismissed it. As always, please do not dismiss any theory until it has been thoroughly debunked. And whatever theory you personally believe, try to debunk your own theory; many hoax investigators are still not doing this.
In favor of the court sting theory, let me point out a few things. Some say that the court did the right thing back in the 2005 acquittal, so why would it be investigated? The reality is that the defense and jury did the right thing, but what about the prosecution? We already know about Aphrodite’s testimony, and Tom Sneddon (TS <!-- s --><!-- s --> ), etc.
We also know that for years the FBI investigated MJ, and the pedophile claim; but they found nothing against MJ. Could it be that in the process of this investigation, the FBI found evidence of corruption in the LA prosecution and the MJ trial? Could it be that as a result, the FBI in cooperation with MJ decided to make the LA court system the focus of a sting operation? Please remember that the “top priority” of the FBI is “public corruption” in government agencies; and their investigation specifically includes “verdicts handed down in courts”
{http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/investigate/corruption}.
We are also at the point, which I mentioned earlier, of running two different coherent theories in parallel. And as we try to put all the pieces together—including the research of previous levels, as well as the new information that we will get during the hearings—hopefully one of the two theories will fall into place, and the other one will fall apart.
Although there are endless minor variations within these two main coherent theories, for the purpose of this level we are only examining two basic theories: the court is in on the hoax, or the court is not in on the hoax (other than the defense, and maybe a few other key people). For the sake of discussion, we can refer to these two theories as “hoax court” and “sting court”.
In level one, we found that the ambulance photo was staged in advance. In level two, we found that at least a few key people in the FBI are helping with the hoax (and cooperating with one or more in the LAFD). In level three, there are still a few different ideas about who or what (if anything) went in the ambulance on the stretcher to UCLA; most agree however that a corpse was not used.
Even though level three is still unresolved, yet we can and should start investigating level four (The Sting). Actually, level three and four are closely related—so much so that if we get a clear answer to level four, then level three will probably be easy to resolve (and vice versa).
To be more specific: if it’s hoax court, then there would be little if any need to use a corpse; but if it is sting court, then the corpse theory has a strong case. This would not only reduce the people who would need to be in on it, but it would also allow witnesses to testify truthfully in real court under oath (both witnesses who are in on it, and those who are not).
It has been suggested that this would constitute entrapment; but sting versus entrapment does not depend on using a dummy versus a corpse. It would be possible to use a dummy, and still qualify as entrapment, if the job was done so airtight that nobody could figure it out. On the other hand: it would be possible to use a corpse, and not qualify as entrapment, as long as there are plenty of clues and evidence that MJ is still alive. If the hoax forums can figure out that MJ is alive, when most of the members are not even professional investigators, then what excuse would the LA prosecution have for not figuring it out?
Please do not let this thread become the primary discussion for all the things that happen during the hearings; there will be other threads for that purpose. Just bring into this thread discussion and evidence related to the focus of The Sting, and especially whether it is hoax court or sting court.
Ok, i use a different logic. If it were a sting court and TS knows it, he wouldn't even bring it up on a highly rated forum for security reasons (i don't think anyone on this board is ill intent). So...no, if TS is an insider i don't believe it's a sting operation.
But even if it were, we wouldn't have a clue because that would be the opposite of what a sting operation is: TOP SECRET. In my small opinion this is the reason why you are stucked. It's a problematical question from the start.
Well I can't speak for everyone but I think you put people on the defensive, Im_convinced, when you said the thread has gone in the crapper, which it is a small step from that to say that everyone's comments (and thus OPINIONS) are shit... so to come back and complain that you're not allowed to share your comment and opinion comes across as disingenuous. Not judging, just providing a possible explanation as to why you feel as though your opinion is attacked: it's because you put things in a way that make people feel as though you're attacking their opinions first. You also have a habit of joining a long running convo to drop bombs on the unsuspecting. I think if you had removed that line about the thread going in the crapper and left the rest, you would have gotten much different responses. Whatever, just own it and realize that your action gets an equal and opposite reaction, doesn't matter to me, I just want to point out that I think you're wrong to say you're being treated unfairly.
I do however appreciate your sentiment of wanting to stay on topic, and quoting the OP, it's a good reminder, and so I agree with you there.
Ps. heartphantom, TS covered entrapment, which addresses your concern, during the last level.
Ok, i use a different logic. If it were a sting court and TS knows it, he wouldn't even bring it up on a highly rated forum for security reasons (i don't think anyone on this board is ill intent). So...no, if TS is an insider i don't believe it's a sting operation.
But even if it were, we wouldn't have a clue because that would be the opposite of what a sting operation is: TOP SECRET. In my small opinion this is the reason why you are stucked. It's a problematical question from the start.
Makes sense. So, it's like chasing our own tails....keeps us busy....but we don't really accomplish anything.
Well I can't speak for everyone but I think you put people on the defensive, Im_convinced, when you said the thread has gone in the crapper, which it is a small step from that to say that everyone's comments (and thus OPINIONS) are shit... so to come back and complain that you're not allowed to share your comment and opinion comes across as disingenuous. Not judging, just providing a possible explanation as to why you feel as though your opinion is attacked: it's because you put things in a way that make people feel as though you're attacking their opinions first. You also have a habit of joining a long running convo to drop bombs on the unsuspecting. I think if you had removed that line about the thread going in the crapper and left the rest, you would have gotten much different responses. Whatever, just own it and realize that your action gets an equal and opposite reaction, doesn't matter to me, I just want to point out that I think you're wrong to say you're being treated unfairly.
I do however appreciate your sentiment of wanting to stay on topic, and quoting the OP, it's a good reminder, and so I agree with you there.
Ps. heartphantom, TS covered entrapment, which addresses your concern, during the last level.
Ok bec I will say that you are entitled to your thoughts on why people get defensive. I have also seen other people say some down right rude and obvious comments towards people and most of the time no one says shit to them. I am not the only one who has said the topic was off. There are a few comments on other pages and no one said diddle to them.
I did not say people's thoughts/opinions were shit. I said this THREAD has gone in the crapper which is my way of observing it. I do not comment towards you in a defensive manner when you say some rude things and even when you said rude things to me directly in the level 3 thread. I don't always agree with everything people write and I don't always agree with what you write but I do not say that you or others are wrong in their feelings.
Not one time did I say I was being treated unfairly or complaining about it. I was pointing out a trend when it concerns my opinions. It has always gone that way since I joined this forum. I think differently than the majority of people and I do not say things for sympathy. bec you have loudly expressed your feelings on the TIAI threads when you felt angry or frustrated about things you thought were correct and you didn't understand why you weren't being acknowleged.
As for dropping in once and a while: I didn't post on the other subjects being discussed because I felt it wasn't necessary or relevant to the original topic. Had people said something that was directly related to the original topic I would have posted based on whether someone had a good theory or bad theory based on the info presented.
Believe me this isn't the first time my opinions have been attacked. Did anyone say anything about the comments posted by TS back on level 3 thread regarding some theories people should look at? What happened was people who felt strongly towards the no body theory, it is all a movie, and no ambulance was there that day went immediately on the defense. Did anyone even read or take into consideration the links TS posted regarding the cadaver theory?
Comments
LOL bec !!
could TS be that cynical ?
We didn't come to conclusions with any of the other levels, and suddenly TS would announce that we're ready for the next level, which is what I think he will do now, IF he comes soon, since we never have gaurantees he will visit ever again. My feeling is that the natural direction of our attempts to answer his question led us to these precise topics you felt weren't warranted. Without some vital information we are endlessly speculating on who the targets of the sting court would be. But in these 18 pages has been lots of helpful info that I've learned from, and I think that's more TS's goal anyway--our learning collectively with his questions as a guide to discussion.
@MJonmind IF you feel the last 7 pages were of help then WHAT conclusion have you decided; STING court or HOAX court? That is what the bottom line is. IF the info is relevant for you and anyone else to decide then say it, present a theory so it can be challenged. The way the thread is now there is info but most aren't making a decision and stating it on the record or forming a theory of their decisions.
Let me have my opinions without the defensive comments in reply. I read this thread everyday even if I haven't commented alot lately. Step out of the comfort zone and just say what it is you think and don't be afraid to be wrong. It may turn out your right but you will never know if you strattle the fence.
Peace
Oops please delete this quoted double goof comment Souza. thanks. <!-- sfresse/ -->fresse/<!-- sfresse/ -->
I agree with what you said though...also when we go off topic it is hard to understand what we are really supposed to be doing but even when we are on topic, it is hard when we have shared our theories and then it's kinda like a, what next?
Today I saw this quote outside a church and I thought it fit in with what you said earlier...it was something like "Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere"...it made me think, if MJ fixes the justice, in say, the L.A court system, although it won't fix it everywhere, it will make more people aware and maybe even help other places where there is injustice, like get the ball rolling so to speak.
I am going to get defensive here as well. As bec already said, we do not have enough knowledge of how the FBI operates and it's only guessing who the focus of the sting would be. People did give their opinions on it and explained why, which is also why the Diana and Tohme comments were posted. The Diana discussion is just to show why for example the royal establishment could be a focus. Others think Tohme might have the answers, that is why Tohme is also discussed. There have been many comments with arguments about why it would be a hoax or sting court TS could have commented on, so in my opinion the fact that this thread has gone somewhat off topic is not the reason TS hasn't commented yet. This thread is nearly 3 weeks old, so it's not really that strange. We are simply stuck here since we can't think of something else, or are still thinking and trying to get there by discussing matters that seem off topic. I really don't think that that is why TS hasn't commented yet, most definitely since people said 10+ pages back that they were stuck. In my opinion there is a chance he won't comment on it at all, if this sting is still on-going. Why make some people wiser than they already are? I bet he didn't only made himself believable to many of us.
Besides that, TS can get everyone back on topic in a blink of an eye if he wants, as he did before. And we must not forget that TS is also just a human being, who might have other important things coming his path which need to be dealt with first.
"For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places."But even when I can´t post here at the moment, I´m reading carefully and I personally don´t wait for TS, in the meantime I re - read all his posts, redirects, updates because maybe I haven´t found an important detail yet.
TS, take your time.
There were so many vampires and leeches on your back we already know, or else Michael would not have suffered so much. Michael seemed innocent, but do not know if he was naive enough to not realize anything. But if he had noticed, would he have been charged again in 2003?
This statement of Liza, confirms what Latoya and Joe said about conspiracy and horrible people who were controlling Michael's life. If it were so, then it isn't difficult to accept the theory of murder!
It is very difficult to know. Believers see him as a hero and non believers as victim. Which one is correct?
Do you remember of a phrase spoken in the movie V? "I'm more of a demon when I act like an angel"[/b] <!-- s:twisted: -->:twisted:<!-- s:twisted: -->
That is correct, Michael?[/quote]
interesting that you point this out. that is the very feeling i get sometimes watching him in certain circumstances.
Chappie
how does that work exactly , someone writes a script and then it plays out in real life? doesn't that leave an awful lot to luck or whatever? guess it could be but it is a very risky sounding venture for everyone involved not just it's creater.
I agree. The clues have all pointed to this conclusion from the beginning. Our original instincts were probably the most accurate ones... whenever I read back... ancient hoax history threads and blogs... the good theories from then are largely all still standing. As we progressed further, the theories start to get a little more out there, a little more fantastical, and much more likely to be debunked with time.
I laid out my theory for hoax court, with supporting evidence, 4 or 5 pieces of supporting evidence, on page 1... and I'm sticking with it. I have no reason to change my mind, we have had no developments since then that caused me to do so. We can only turn it over so many times. We are working with 100% pure speculation... and that's a very soft vantage point to work from.
As far as being off topic, I know I feel a need to keep this thread on page one of new posts, because I want TS to see that we are actively interested in his discussion... keeping the home fires burning if you will. Surely others have posted from time to time for the same reason. I am experiencing a great deal of anxiety in regards to TS's absence. This thread is the only link to him that we have at current.
yes the same here but I can't decide if he really was playing little hoaxes - playing the victim role - or he simply is not very good at being persuasive. You know there are people who have a real talent to get in trouble all the time and what if Michael is one of them?
Again why is it that I can't have MY opinion on something without people getting defensive. I never named names and pointed fingers at any of you who have commented to me after I posted MY recent opinion based on MY observation. I never said Souza you are...or MJonmind you are...
I do not agree with what bec said about not having enough knowledge about the FBI. I do think we have enough info to form a theory and opinion of what we (collectively), you, me or anyone else thinks this STING or HOAX court is. I do not think we need to have every detail down to exactly who (names) in order to have a good idea of who (many entities, systems) the majority of the sting operation is meant for. I do not think this is as international as you do.
The main point of this thread and question from TS was about the LOCAL (USA) court in LA. This question of whether or not it is a STING court or HOAX court is based on Murray's trial and again that is in the USA and LA.
I obviously think differently and I respect everyones right to their thoughts, theories, and opinions. Why can't I have the same respect? I specifically said the last 7 pages of info was not what this topic was about. I didn't say the first 11 pages (minus the panic comments) didn't have good info regarding STING vs HOAX court. I do think in those pages we were on topic and had just begun to debate the 2 theories and then it went south, east, west and north as far as the topics being discussed; which in my opinion have nothing to do with a LOCAL LA court system problem when it comes to Murray.
Of course TS could turn this thread around in an instant but again that was not what I was saying. I stated my opinion on why I thought he hasn't commented. I am very aware of TS being human and having other obligations so that was not what I was referring to when I stated why I thought he hasn't commented. I am taking a break again and will just go to read only in this thread.
Peace
But anyways, I am not going to have a discussion over it. I'm too busy already with other members 'discussing'.
"For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places."And even if this thread has gone off topic or way out there, I don't see anybody de-bunking the research and information that members have given. I do realize that it's hard to debunk a "conspiracy theory" but when there are so many coincidences and eyebrow-raising questions (like the Princess Di stuff), it's hard to just dismiss it. And I do think the sting goes beyond Michael's immediate circle. Remember, the main question posed by TS in this thread:
I don't think we'll just be told straight out who The Sting is focused on but I'm sure TS will come back and comment at an appropriate TIME.
Souza I have said already I respect others opinions and I will say again, you do have a right to your opinion too. I am already a strong believer in everyone having that right so why would I think you have no right?
My main point in what I have said is: the basic simple questions and area of focus is whether or not the court is a STING or HOAX court. I am basing that thought on what TS said from the start. While I agree with the findings of Princess Diana and the film exposing The Royal Family being behind her death; I do not think that was where we were supposed to go in this thread. Tohme is a relative character if one wants to say he is part of the focus regarding the sting. As for theories some do turn out to be true so it is beyond speculation sometimes. All the dirty shit and secrets about the world I am very aware of. I was suggesting what the MAIN point of this thread was supposed to be about.
Peace
But even if it were, we wouldn't have a clue because that would be the opposite of what a sting operation is: TOP SECRET. In my small opinion this is the reason why you are stucked. It's a problematical question from the start.
I do however appreciate your sentiment of wanting to stay on topic, and quoting the OP, it's a good reminder, and so I agree with you there.
Ps. heartphantom, TS covered entrapment, which addresses your concern, during the last level.
Makes sense. So, it's like chasing our own tails....keeps us busy....but we don't really accomplish anything.
I did not say people's thoughts/opinions were shit. I said this THREAD has gone in the crapper which is my way of observing it. I do not comment towards you in a defensive manner when you say some rude things and even when you said rude things to me directly in the level 3 thread. I don't always agree with everything people write and I don't always agree with what you write but I do not say that you or others are wrong in their feelings.
Not one time did I say I was being treated unfairly or complaining about it. I was pointing out a trend when it concerns my opinions. It has always gone that way since I joined this forum. I think differently than the majority of people and I do not say things for sympathy. bec you have loudly expressed your feelings on the TIAI threads when you felt angry or frustrated about things you thought were correct and you didn't understand why you weren't being acknowleged.
As for dropping in once and a while: I didn't post on the other subjects being discussed because I felt it wasn't necessary or relevant to the original topic. Had people said something that was directly related to the original topic I would have posted based on whether someone had a good theory or bad theory based on the info presented.
Believe me this isn't the first time my opinions have been attacked. Did anyone say anything about the comments posted by TS back on level 3 thread regarding some theories people should look at? What happened was people who felt strongly towards the no body theory, it is all a movie, and no ambulance was there that day went immediately on the defense. Did anyone even read or take into consideration the links TS posted regarding the cadaver theory?
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