<br />I was wondering if it matters to Michael’s fans what religion he practices if any, or perhaps religionS. If they love him, would it matter? Should it matter? And is it possible to be no religion at all and simply be a lover of God? Someone who finds God in all religions is called eclectic.<br /><br />Is it possible to bring all religions together under one banner? Is it possible to see beyond religious methodology and simply embrace the One God? <br /><br />It seems that it’s the different names we have that cause separation and division amongst the human race.<br /><br />For example:<br /><br />“Muslim” means “Submitted”<br />“Christian” means one who follows the teachings of the Christ<br />“Sikh” means “dsiciple”<br />“Buddha” means “the wise one”<br /><br />If we follow the One God, we become One in brotherhood and sisterhood. Isn’t that a wonderful vision of L.O.V.E? <br />
<br /><br />I don't think MJ's religion matters to his fans (it didn't matter to me from the beginning although I'm not JW) as long as he is what he "preaches" (LOVE), but it matters if he would try to establish through this hoax another religion. Humanity does not need another half-truth in the world.<br /><br />Deep down in my soul I believe Michael surpassed those days when he was conditioned by belonging to one religion, understanding that what really matters is more simple, pure and... boundless:<br /><br />"Love is the only reality and it is not a mere sentiment. It is the ultimate truth that lies at the heart of creation." - Rabindranth Tagore <br /><br />"Let us dream of tomorrow where we can truly love from the soul, and know love as the ultimate truth at the heart of all creation." - Michael Jackson<br /><br />Religious or not, the TRUTH is one, available to everyone.
<br />What you say makes a lot of sense, Sarahli. I see Michael as being Eclectic, although I'm not sure he proclaimed to be. <br />Blessings<br />
<br /><br />Thank you Voice. Indeed it's one possibility that Michael is an eclectic, I haven't heard him proclaim it either but who knows. We still have a lot to learn from him. <br /><br />
on 1332132967:
<br />[size=9pt]Yes, and it seems to me that an atheist loves, appreciates and is in wonder of -- nature, the human, science, math, intellect, history and the Universe itself. Does that not constitute a form of worship?[/size]<br />
<br /><br />I mentioned some of the religious denominations specifically because it corresponds to the theme being discussed here and the message of unity of all people regardless of their religions (Coexist). What they have in common is the worship of God.<br /><br />Concerning atheists we can consider that they are a certain kind of “worshippers” but not of the Source of all these creations which is God. They rather “worship” the varied creation but not the Creator—which is totally different. Now I believe we are all children of the same God -- atheists included -- even if they do not recognize this as truth. Therefore we should all live in peace and freedom because choosing God or not is a personal choice which shouldn’t be used to diminish, aggress or denigrate anyone.<br /><br />
on 1332167873:
<br />I don't think MJ's religion matters to his fans (it didn't matter to me from the beginning although I'm not JW) as long as he is what he "preaches" (LOVE), but it matters if he would try to establish through this hoax another religion. Humanity does not need another half-truth in the world.<br />
<br /><br />I do not think that Michael is trying to establish a new religion lol, his message for me is clear and is about unity despite differences. It's about loving each other and going beyond the illusions separating us, it's about awakening and changing the world for the better and for real.
I was optimistic to think I ca read and understand TS' Sign 2 in a week. I am still not done with it but I had to jump directly to the revelation part because the type-antitype part is still too much for me to digest for the moment.<br />I have to say one thing: TS synthesized the Revelation in an amazing way. I got to admit this person is very smart.<br /><br />TS made me read the Revelation with much more attention than before. This time I realize I don't really understand it and I never really did. Some parts of Revelation sound like actual facts that still have to happen in the future, like with the starts falling from the sky and killing 1/3 from people and things like that....are these allegories or solid facts that will happen in the future??? <br /><br />I'll keep reading but for the moment I have only questions instead of answers.<br />
while sitting in a baptist church as a young teen i noticed a large plaque up front. it read: ONE GOD, ONE FAITH, ONE BAPTISM. since that i began to question if there is only one GOD then why all of these different religions. while dabbling a little learning about other faiths i noticed many similarities, with also slight differences. these differences ARE what have caused divisions & wars. IMO, all faiths contain truth. i just think they have been compartmentalized (bits & pieces given to different belief systems), which makes dividing & conquering easier. there is only ONE UNIVERSAL CREATOR & ONE TRUTH. once humanity realizes this the world WILL become a better place filled with L.O.V.E.
<br />The Bible can be interpretated in so many ways, but only one is fully right.<br />Everyone can read it, but when it come to interpretations the line between reality and created illusion becomes very thin.<br />
<br /><br />"When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth. It is stupidity rather than courage to refuse to recognize danger when it is close upon you." -- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle<br />
"For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places."
<br /><br /><br />Deep down in my soul I believe Michael surpassed those days when he was conditioned by belonging to one religion, understanding that what really matters is more simple, pure and... boundless:<br /><br />
<br />The Bible can be interpretated in so many ways, but only one is fully right.<br />Everyone can read it, but when it come to interpretations the line between reality and created illusion becomes very thin.<br />
<br /><br />You are absolutely right! There is a very thin line!!!
just want to say props to believers who are not religious, for keeping up with these threads. they can be somewhat deep even for the religiously inclined... <br /><br />so yeah, props to you!<br /><br /><br />all for LOVE...
<br />I have a question ..<br /> Through the sacrifice of Jesus, God gave his people the gift of grace / forgiveness of sins. Is that the time when Lucifer was cast out from Heaven?<br />
<br /><br />Good question and I'm probably not the best one to even comment on it....but I do believe there is another verse in Revelation (?)...where the vision shows Satan falling to earth like a lightening bolt...and I think this occurs in the vision after Jesus' crucifixion/sacrifice. If someone who is better versed in the Bible can shed light on this or give their interpretation, that would help.<br /><br />I've been all over the place since TS posted the 2nd Sign lol....I start reading/researching one thing and end up on a completely different path (which is part of the reason why I love TS' posts....they lead to many wonderful paths ::P).<br /><br />What I'm getting confused over has to do with the significance of Jesus' sacrifice...precisely, what the 'act' itself fulfilled. If we take the OT as literal...then God asked for both an Ark and a sanctuary/tabernacle to be built so that He could 'dwell' among His people. Both were to be 'proof' of His existence for the people....i.e. God knew they needed these 'objects' in order to believe in Him. What confuses me is....didn't Jesus eliminate/replace/fulfill the meaning or necessity of these objects? Weren't these objects no longer necessary as 'proof' or as ways in which God could 'dwell' among people....since Jesus was the proof and the way? If so, then why would these objects 'reappear' before the end of times? It's almost like God would be taking a few steps back in the grand plan....i.e. He first used the objects as proof, He then sent His Son as proof...and now He's gonna 'resend' the objects again as proof? It just seems too confusing...and based on several passages I've read, God is not one to confuse....but rather, the (d)evil always aims at confusion and deception.<br /><br />So, I'm torn in my understanding as to whether TS is trying to show us Signs that will be appearing by God's will (i.e. God inspired)...or if he's trying to open our eyes to possible deceit/deception that will be used by the (d)evil powers to make us believe these Signs are, in fact, coming from God. <br /><br />Is there Bible passages that show that the physical objects (actual 'things) of the Ark and the sanctuary will 'reappear' at the end of times? I'm asking because I don't know...what I do know is that there is mention (in the visions) of both the Ark and God's sanctuary being seen in Heaven, not earth. And there's also mention that the devil will crank up the deception before Jesus' return. Does this deception have anything to do with what TS is trying to show us with these Signs (i.e. the Signs we will see ARE the deception, coming from the evil side)...or are these Signs our 'armor' that will help us see the deceit when/if it happens (i.e. the Signs are God's way of showing us His plan as 'proof' of His hand in the events to come)?. I don't know the Bible nearly as well as others here....so again, any insight/direction would help ease a discombobulated mind :?<br /><br />With L.O.V.E. always.<br />
<br /><br /><br />the death of christ and the banishment of satan and demons to earth was at two different times.<br /><br />death of christ was between (according to scholars) 30-36 AD. the banishment of satan from heaven... well there are several viewpoints. i personally belive that this was in 1914.<br /><br />here is why... but again, my belief only. i am sure there are others who think different...<br /><br />1914—A Significant Year in Bible Prophecy<br /><br />DECADES in advance, Bible students proclaimed that there would be significant developments in 1914. What were these, and what evidence points to 1914 as such an important year?<br /><br />As recorded at Luke 21:24, Jesus said: “Jerusalem will be trampled on by the nations, until the appointed times of the nations [“the times of the Gentiles,” King James Version] are fulfilled.” Jerusalem had been the capital city of the Jewish nation—the seat of rulership of the line of kings from the house of King David. (Psalm 48:1, 2) However, these kings were unique among national leaders. They sat on “God’s throne” as representatives of God himself. (1 Chronicles 29:23) Jerusalem was thus a symbol of Gods’s rulership.<br /><br />How and when, though, did God’s rulership begin to be “trampled on by the nations”? This happened in 607 B.C.E. when Jerusalem was conquered by the Babylonians. “God’s throne” became vacant, and the line of kings who descended from David was interrupted. (2 Kings 25:1-26) Would this ‘trampling’ go on forever? No, for the prophecy of Ezekiel said regarding Jerusalem’s last king, Zedekiah: “Remove the turban, and lift off the crown. . . . It will certainly become no one’s until he comes who has the legal right, and I must give it to him.” (Ezekiel 21:26, 27) The one who has “the legal right” to the Davidic crown is Christ Jesus. (Luke 1:32, 33) So the ‘trampling’ would end when Jesus became King.<br /><br />When would that grand event occur? Jesus showed that the Gentiles would rule for a fixed period of time. The account in Daniel chapter 4 holds the key to knowing how long that period would last. It relates a prophetic dream experienced by King Nebuchadnezzar of Babylon. He saw an immense tree that was chopped down. Its stump could not grow because it was banded with iron and copper. An angel declared: “Let seven times pass over it.”—Daniel 4:10-16.<br /><br />In the Bible, trees are sometimes used to represent rulership. (Ezekiel 17:22-24; 31:2-5) So the chopping down of the symbolic tree represents how God’s rulership, as expressed through the kings at Jerusalem, would be interrupted. However, the vision served notice that this ‘trampling of Jerusalem’ would be temporary—a period of “seven times.” How long a period is that?<br /><br />Revelation 12:6, 14 indicates that three and a half times equal “a thousand two hundred and sixty days.” “Seven times” would therefore last twice as long, or 2,520 days. But the Gentile nations did not stop ‘trampling’ on God’s rulership a mere 2,520 days after Jerusalem’s fall. Evidently, then, this prophecy covers a much longer period of time. On the basis of Numbers 14:34 and Ezekiel 4:6, which speak of “a day for a year,” the “seven times” would cover 2,520 years.<br /><br />The 2,520 years began in October 607 B.C.E., when Jerusalem fell to the Babylonians and the Davidic king was taken off his throne. The period ended in October 1914. At that time, “the appointed times of the nations” ended, and Jesus Christ was installed as God’s heavenly King.—Psalm 2:1-6; Daniel 7:13, 14.<br />Just as Jesus predicted, his “presence” as heavenly King has been marked by dramatic world developments—war, famine, earthquakes, pestilences. (Matthew 24:3-8; Luke 21:11) Such developments bear powerful testimony to the fact that 1914 indeed marked the birth of God’s heavenly Kingdom and the beginning of “the last days” of this present wicked system of things.—2 Timothy 3:1-5.<br /><br />*From October 607 B.C.E. to October 1 B.C.E. is 606 years. Since there is no zero year, from October 1 B.C.E. to October 1914 C.E. is 1,914 years. By adding 606 years and 1,914 years, we get 2,520 years.<br /><br />Jesus Christ became King in heaven in the year 1914. (Daniel 7:13, 14) Soon after he received Kingdom power, Jesus took action. “War broke out in heaven,” says the Bible. “Michael [another name for Jesus] and his angels battled with the dragon [Satan the Devil], and the dragon and its angels battled.” Satan and his wicked angels, the demons, lost that war and were cast out of heaven to the earth. God’s faithful spirit sons rejoiced that Satan and his demons were gone. Humans, however, would experience no such joy. Instead, the Bible foretold: “Woe for the earth . . . because the Devil has come down to you, having great anger, knowing he has a short period of time.”—Revelation 12:7, 9, 12.<br /><br /><br /><br />hope this helps...
Is it possible to bring all religions together under one banner? Is it possible to see beyond religious methodology and simply embrace the One God?
<br /><br /><br />JMO, but the short answer is no.... although i wish it wasnt the answer. this is because religion is a tool from the devil... also some religions practice things that are blatantly against god and have satanic involvement... so no, they cant be credited to embracing one god.... for some religions, especially those with pagan roots, their god (perhaps saldly unbeknownst to them) is satan himself....<br /><br />so no. all religions can not be put under one banner....<br /><br />on another note <br />a sign of the end according to the bible is gov turning on religion.... watch this space.....<br /><br />this is when the BEAST (government world powers) turns on the harlot that is riding her.... (false religion)<br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br />sorry i know i know.... we are discussing festivals... my bad! :michael_jackson-1135: :michael_jackson-1135: :michael_jackson-1135: :michael_jackson-1135: :michael_jackson-1135:
R8. NINe 1nch Nai1s (Year Zero ARG)<br />{http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Year_Zero_(game)}<br /><br />Quoting from the Wikipedia redirect: “Year Zero is an alternate reality game (ARG) based on the Nine Inch Nails concept album of the same name ... Reznor stated that the concept behind Year Zero was partially inspired by his feelings toward the Bush administration. He further explained, ... I’m appalled by the behavior of our government, the direction that it has taken and the direction that it’s taken everyone else in the world and its arrogance ...”<br /><br />This redirect was chosen for several reasons. It is an ARG, and yet not an ARG that is simply a game for entertainment; it is an ARG with a very important message, and one that goes along quite well with the TIAI message—in fact, the TIAI redirects were actually one form of ARG.<br /><br />And like the “2012” film: the specifics of this Year Zero ARG are imaginary, but the concepts are very real. Notice this statement, which is about the related Year Zero album {http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Year_Zero_(album)}: “The album criticizes the American government’s policies, and ‘could be about the end of the world’. Reznor specifically cited what he labeled as the ‘erosion of freedoms’ and ‘the way that we treat the rest of the world and our own citizens’. Reznor had previously called the results of the 2004 US election ‘one step closer to the end of the world.’ ... the timeline of the album and alternate reality game mentions historical events, such as the September 11 attacks ... Regardless of being fictional, a columnist of The Hartford Courant commented, ‘What’s scary is that this doesn’t seem as far-fetched as it should, given recent revelations about the FBI's abuse of the Patriot Act and the dissent-equals-disloyalty double-speak coming out of Washington in recent years.”
<br /><br />Thought of quoting TIAI REVEALED for those that are surprised of where TS is going.<br />
<br />It's important to know the fesitivals and the sanctuary because God set this up so we will know the real event(s) when they happen.<br /><br />The festivals, sanctuary is meant to be practice for the real thing. (listed as the type) This is like a dress rehearsal or something.<br />The antiype is the real event. We have to know what to look for and what to do when the real event(s) happen.<br /><br />Some things in the bible already happened in history but some didn't happen yet. This is one of the only ways we could possibly figure out god's plan. It's there for us to use so we have to do our best to understand it and use it. <br /><br />I saw how the holidays,festivals, and major events were planned to coincide during certain times. For example, Easter and First Fruits is on the same day. Everything is perfectly planned.<br />
I just read SIGN 1 and SIGN 2 once again...<br /><br />I give up... HEEEEELLLLPPP :Pulling_hair:<br /><br />I don't understand a thing.<br />Or when I think I might start to understand something, then comes another paragraph that makes me lose everything again...<br /><br />The religious language is impossible for me to understand, especially in a foreign language!<br />There are too many unknown terms, too many notions...feasts that do not exist in my religion, so I don't know what they are...<br />Plus I am not really familiar with religious terms in my language either!<br />Though I've always believed in God, I've never been a "participant believer"... I don't go to church, don't read the Bible, nothing of the sort...<br />I just pray... and I feel HIM! He's always there for me...<br />That's pretty much my whole "religious life-experience" so far, to which I can add all the religious texts/threads/topics that I've been reading on this forum.<br />So understanding religious texts, doesn't come "over night"... It takes years of reading and getting familiar with everything... and most certainly someone to teach you and guide you through the coded biblical text.<br />So the SIGNS so far are like "foreign language" to me! At this point even Chinese would seem easier to understand lol :icon_lol:<br /><br />Regarding SIGN 1 and SIGN 2 : in most cases if I have the luck to find the unknown words in a dictionary, then it's a new word for me even in my language... so again something very unfamiliar to me, which altogether with the rest of the "obstacles" makes the process of understanding the text even harder!<br />Even if these texts were written in my native language , I would still NOT understand a thing...<br />It's not a translation that is needed, it's an EXPLANATION of the WHOLE text, paragraph by paragraph, with parallels drawn to the hoax and what exactly this EOW is supposed to be... and what SALVATION (Ark of the covenant) is supposed to symbolize here, because it is clearly stated that it will not be a physical ark, nothing material!<br /><br />Ok, I can make suppositions and interpret them as a "metaphor for the hoax" , with the Bible as a "hoax-scenario"... but what if it isn't that?<br />Then what is it?<br />I really feel like on a dead-end street regarding the first 2 Signs...<br /><br /><br />I will quote below, some parts of the SIGNS...that at some point seemed clear to me or looked like possible clues/links to the hoax, but then again, if I think at the whole context, then again nothing makes sense at all...<br />Anyway I just thought to post them, maybe your attention was drawn by the same things as me!<br /><br />SIGN 1 - section: 4. Who Is Michael the Archangel?<br />http://www.michaelsarmyoflove.com/forum/index.php?topic=56.0<br />
The word “angel” does not mean “created”; instead, it means “messenger” (see Strong’s Hebrew #4397, and Greek #32). Our English word “evangelist” refers to a public speaker, or messenger, and “angel” is the root word. So does Christ qualify as a messenger? Certainly, because He is the “Word” (John 1:14; 6:63,68), He is the “mediator” (1 Timothy 2:5), and He is the “messenger of the covenant” (Malachi 3:1).<br />1 Timothy 2:5, “… one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;”<br />Since Jesus is called an “angel” many times in Scripture, could He also be referred to as the “archangel”? The word “archangel” comes from two words: archo (#757, meaning: rule, reign, chief, lead), and “angel”
<br />Malachi = messenger = angel ---> I found that interesting, especially with the voice-impersonator Jason Malachi!<br />archo = rule, reign, chief, lead --- > made me think of the KING of Pop and KO's phrase in This is it: "May we continue with Michael leading the way"<br /><br /><br />SIGN 1 - section: 7. “In the Hebrew Tongue Armageddon”<br />
So Satan got kicked out of heaven, for demanding a seat on God’s throne. But that was in heaven. Does God have a throne on earth, or anything on earth that represents His throne in heaven? Yes, He does; and you can probably even guess what it is: the ark of the covenant! God’s throne is the mercy seat, on the ark: “… the mercy seat, which is upon the ark … for I [the LORD] will appear in the cloud upon the mercy seat.” (Leviticus 16:2).<br />[....]<br />So the battle of Armageddon is the same battle which Lucifer started in heaven; it’s going to come full circle, and end up where it all started: the battle over God’s throne, the ark of the covenant! And this also fits perfectly with the fact that Yom Kippur illustrates the ark becoming the focal point at the EOW.<br />But it’s not going to be a fight over who gets their hands on the ark; God has full control of the ark. Also, this is not a message to worship the ark itself, as if it were inherently magical. [size=12pt]The battle of Armageddon is a battle over the truth which the ark represents. [/size]And it’s not a physical war, except to the extent that the enemies of truth will use persecution and violence, just as they have done many times down through history (see John 16:2). But those defending the truth will have no need or desire to engage in any type of physical battle. Well then, if the battle of Armageddon is all about the ark of the covenant, and the truth that it is designed to represent, then it’s high time we figure out how to distinguish the true ark from the many counterfeit arks out there.
<br />- I've never heard of Yom Kippur until the SIGNS. I don't know what this feast exactly means, I don't even know what the equivalent translation in Romanian language or if it can even be translated ... I need to search more on it as it seems so important.So from the start everything related to this Yom Kippur feast becomes hard, if not impossible for me to understand!<br />- Armageddon = "battle of truth" ----> reminded me of Michael's words: "TRUTH always prevails" and how he always fought for HIS truth to come out! which is also one of the purposes of his hoax<br />- "the true ark" versus "the many counterfeit arks" ----> could these "counterfeit arks" symbolize all the story versions fabricated by the tabloid media about MJ and his life? If not, what else do they mean??<br />- "throne on earth" versus "throne in heaven" ... <br /><br /><br />SIGN 1 - section: 21. The Truth Will Prevail<br />
For those who choose Michael’s side, Michael Himself has made this amazing promise, “To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne …” (Revelation 3:21; see 22:1-5; 1 Samuel 2:7,8; Matthew 25:31; 20:21-23; Mark 10:37-40). Yes, Lucifer got kicked out of heaven for demanding a seat upon God’s throne; he failed the test of faith. But for those who pass the test of faith, Jesus will give them the very same thing which Lucifer demanded, and yet never received—the privilege to sit on God’s throne! This is not a message of fear, it’s a message of faith, a faith that will conquer Lucifer and all who take sides with him. This is what the final battle is all about; [size=12pt]the battle where faith and only faith will win the victory and prize: to sit with God on His throne[/size]—this is the battle, the final battle, the battle of Armageddon!!!!!!!
<br />Ok, maybe what I'll say/ask here, will sound stupid, anyway I'll still say it: what is this strange battle for God's throne?? and "the privilege to sit on God’s throne!?" :animal0017: I mean ok, who wouldn't be honored, right? But to fight for it?<br />Frankly, I would be satisfied to even be somewhere around that "throne", I don't feel that much eager to actually "sit on the throne"!! or fight for it! loll It sounds so childish! If Satan was cast out of heaven for that, then he was so stupid!! lmao :icon_lol: :icon_lol:<br /> But is this really about a physical throne?? Or is the throne a symbol of something more DEEP?? WHAT??<br /><br /><br />For SIGN 2, I was like reading 2 words, then looking in the dictionary for the next 3!! I couldn't make anything of it...<br /><br />Here's a selection of what I did manage to understand though (not as meaning), but at least regarding the "division/classification" of furniture and festivals. But don't ask me what each means or what is the overall picture, 'cause I have absolutely NO idea!<br /><br />SIGN #2: FURNITURE REPRESENTS FESTIVALS<br />http://www.michaelsarmyoflove.com/forum/index.php?topic=72.0<br /><br />
1. A Very Solid Foundation<br />This sign is about the 6 main pieces of furniture, which were in the sanctuary: <br />1. sacrifice altar, <br />2. laver, <br />3. candlestick, <br />4. showbread, <br />5. incense altar, <br />6. and ark of the covenant. <br /><br />These pieces of furniture parallel directly with the yearly festivals, which God established as part of the sanctuary system: <br />1. Passover, <br />2. Wave Sheaf, <br />3. Pentecost, <br />4. Trumpets, <br />5. Yom Kippur, <br />6. Tabernacles. <br /><br />The parallels are even in the same sequence—such as the first furniture (sacrifice altar) parallels with the first festival (Passover); this makes it very clear that all these parallels were planned by God, to teach important truths.<br />[...]<br /><br />3. Sanctuary Basics<br /><br />We should start with a basic understand of the sanctuary system—including the 3 divisions <br />1. the court, and the two apartments in the tabernacle,<br />2. the 6 pieces of furniture (listed already), <br />3. and the 6 yearly festivals (listed already). <br /><br />Everything in this study is listed as it was originally given by God, found in the Pentateuch (books of Moses). In later years, the Jews modified things somewhat; so we should examine what God originally gave, for the clearest representation of His way in the sanctuary.<br /><br />-The “court” was surrounded by a linen fence or border, and was open or outdoors; the two main articles of furniture were the altar of sacrifice (made of brass), and the laver (also of brass). <br />-The “tabernacle” was basically a tent, and it did have a roof; it had two separate rooms, or two apartments. <br />-The first apartment had the table of showbread, the candlestick, and the altar of incense (all three made of gold); <br />- The second apartment had the ark of the covenant (also made of gold). <br />- The word “sanctuary” refers to the whole system (court, tabernacle, and related services).<br />- Everything in the earthly sanctuary system is often referred to as the “type” (or shadow); :icon_eek: and information about the type is found mainly in the Old Testament. <br />- Information about the “antitype” (or reality) is found mainly in the New Testament, including but not limited to statements about the heavenly sanctuary.<br /><br />Information about the annual festivals can be found in various places throughout the Bible; however, the most complete list is found in Leviticus 23. <br />- The first 3 were in the spring (in type), and relate to the first Advent (in antitype); <br />- The last 3 were in the fall (in type), and relate to the second Advent (in antitype). <br /><br />This cycle was repeated yearly in the type; the antitype goes through the same sequence as the type, but only one time (it’s never repeated). The gap of time between the spring and fall festivals represents the gap of time between the first and second Advents.<br /><br />[ . . . ]
Was watching a thing on the historical Jesus and the original Christians last night and the documentary discussed how the original Christians were Jews and how circumcision (and baptism) was a requirement for becoming a follower of Jesus Christ, as it was said to be a covenant between God and followers (much like observing the Sabbath). <br /><br />Years after Jesus's death, the early Christians relaxed this requirement in the interest of attracting new followers as the circumcision turned men off and made them reluctant to become Christians. Lol. Gee, imagine that. They kept baptism because it was not scary and drastic.<br /><br />But all jokes aside, this topic evoked the thought-- if observance of the Sabbath being Saturday is direct from God, and MAN changed it over to Sunday, and we should be smart enough to recognize how it became bastardized, should not the ceremony of circumcision be adhered to as well?<br /><br />AND<br /><br />If MJ himself thought all of this was so deeply important, meaning direct translation of the Bible and keeping of original customs as preordained by God himself, why did he not arrange himself to be circumcised? <br /><br />I mean, not to get too personal or anything, but it was one of the key pieces of evidence that exonerated MJ in the 2005 trial; that MJ was not circumcised and that the accuser described him as such=FAIL. <br />
Awwwww.... Sim; I didn't know you were dealing with Romanian. :-\ <br /><br />Did any of the videos I posted make any sense to you? Feel free to pm me with questions; I'll try to do my best. All the feasts & festivals are still a learning curve for me as they are with most Christians because we have forgotten the Jewish roots of our faith. Christianity is a sect of Judaism... the Roman Church is the once that changed things once the Apostles and their proteges died off. <br /><br /> :bearhug:
Is it possible to bring all religions together under one banner? Is it possible to see beyond religious methodology and simply embrace the One God?
<br /><br /><br />JMO, but the short answer is no.... although i wish it wasnt the answer. this is because religion is a tool from the devil... also some religions practice things that are blatantly against god and have satanic involvement... so no, they cant be credited to embracing one god.... for some religions, especially those with pagan roots, their god (perhaps saldly unbeknownst to them) is satan himself....<br /><br />so no. all religions can not be put under one banner....<br /><br />on another note <br />a sign of the end according to the bible is gov turning on religion.... watch this space.....<br /><br />this is when the BEAST (government world powers) turns on the harlot that is riding her.... (false religion)<br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br />sorry i know i know.... we are discussing festivals... my bad! :michael_jackson-1135: :michael_jackson-1135: :michael_jackson-1135: :michael_jackson-1135: :michael_jackson-1135:<br />
<br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br />The initials are in the host stands for the Egyptian Trinity, Isis, Horus, and Seb. (in some hosts change "I" by a "J" to hide the true meaning) When Jesus Institute dinner, he left the bread into pieces, therefore they could not be round by magic. Used bread and wine as symbolic elements of his body and his blood. God forbade the Jews worship the Sun God. (Chronic 2 33: 4). Catholic worship (Catholic = universal) the only Christian element is the name of Jesus.<br />
<br />QUESTION: “I am almost 21 years old, and a relatively new Christian. I haven’t read the Old Testament yet, but I have read the New Testament. I am confused on whether or not as a Christian you have to be circumcised, because I am not. The New Testament confused me though, I can’t figure out if I need to be physically circumcised… I guess the question short and sweet is: Do I need to get circumcised to get into heaven?”<br /><br />No, you most certainly do NOT have to be circumcised to get into heaven. This issue was resolved long ago by the apostle Paul and the early Church. Circumcision has absolutely nothing to do with your salvation. It is one of many Old Testament requirements that ended the moment that Jesus Christ died for our sins. Circumcision had to do with the Old Testament relationship between God and the Jews. (See: Circumcision) It has never been a requirement for Christians.<br /><br />The primary reason this subject is discussed in the New Testament is because of confusion in the early Church among some Jews that had become Christians. At one point, some tried to pressure Titus, a Greek Christian friend of Paul, into being circumcised. (See: Titus) In reality, this was only the beginning of the demands of the Judaizers; they wanted him and all other Christians to practice ALL the other requirements of Jewish law, as well. In a council meeting in Jerusalem, Paul and Barnabas convinced the Jewish Christians of the very dangerous error in this kind of thinking (Acts 15). Thereafter, the Church took a strong stand against requiring circumcision.<br /><br />First Corinthians 7 makes it clear that if an uncircumcised man becomes a Christian, he is not to have himself circumcised (at least not for religious reasons) (1 Corinthians 7:18). To do so would be a bad testimony to others, as it tends to indicate that the person believes that circumcision is a requirement of Christianity. It is not. To claim that any work of man is required for salvation is heresy. Salvation is by grace, not by works (Ephesians 2:8-9). Circumcision means nothing to God, since Christ’s death (see Acts 6:15; 1 Corinthians 7:19).<br /><br /> “For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God—not by works, so that no one can boast” (Ephesians 2:8-9, NIV).
Aussie, Revelation 12 with the story of Satan kicked out of heaven is, according to The Sign, something that happened thousands of years ago, but only there to explain the coming end time events.<br /><br />Your 1914 date kinda reminds me of the date the Seventh Day Adventist focus on—the William Miller calculations from the Great Pyramid’s inner measurements representing historical time in years. This whole article is a helpful read on predictions concerning 1914 from a critical standpoint, that numerology can and has been used for many theories.<br />
http://www.jehovahswitnesstruth.com/1914.htm<br />"So, then, if we measure backward down the 'First Ascending Passage' to its junction with the 'Entrance Passage,' we shall have a fixed date to mark upon the downward passage. This measure is 1542 inches, and indicates the year B.C. 1542, as the date at that point. Then measuring down the 'Entrance Passage' from that point, to find the distance to the entrance of the 'Pit,' representing the great trouble and destruction with which this age is to close, when evil will be overthrown from power, we find it to be 3457 inches, symbolizing 3457 years from the above date, B.C. 1542. This calculation shows AD. 1915 as marking the beginning of the period of trouble; for 1542 years B.C. plus 1915 years AD. equals 3457 years. Thus the Pyramid witnesses that the close of 1914 will be the beginning of the time of trouble such as was not since there was a nation -- no, nor ever shall be afterward. And thus it will be noted that this 'Witness' fully corroborates the' Bible testimony on this subject. {Thy Kingdom Come 1910 edition pg. 342.}
<br /><br />It’s interesting that so far, I find no-where does anyone link the feasts to Sanctuary furniture to events related to Jesus, in quite the same way that The Sign does. This is from one of the videos MsTrinity333 posted.<br /> /><br /><br /><br />Bec, I love your dry sense of humor!<br />Yep, lots of irony in MJ’s “state”. Apostle Paul teaches it is not necessary for Christians. Although we got our boys done right after birth (seemed right at the time).<br />
"Since we have heard that some who went out from us have troubled you with words, unsettling your souls, saying 'You must be circumcised and keep the law' - to whom we gave no such commandment - ...<br />"... it seemed good to the Holy Spirit, and to us, to lay upon you no greater burden than these necessary things:<br />"That you abstain from things offered to idols, from blood, from things strangled, and, from sexual immorality. If you keep yourselves from these, you will do well. Farewell."<br />http://www.circumstitions.com/Xy.html
<br /><br />MsTrinity333<br />
we have forgotten the Jewish roots of our faith. Christianity is a sect of Judaism.
<br />I respectfully disagree! Jesus was an Israelite from the tribe of Judah, and a Judean from the political land of Judea. He was not a ‘Jew’, who follows the religion of Judaism, coming from Pharisaism who came from Edomites, who came from Esau the brother of Jacob, the father of the 12 tribes of the Israelites IMO. It is a modern deliberate mistranslation and deception put into the Bible since the original King James Version and perhaps long before. Eventually all 12 tribes will be united. Again IMO.
Simpa, bless yo litl ol heart! I love your thoughts on the Signs! Please keep them coming! :woohoo2:<br /><br />
Sign 1, s.7<br />So the battle of Armageddon is the same battle which Lucifer started in heaven; it’s going to come full circle, and end up where it all started: the battle over God’s throne, the ark of the covenant! And this also fits perfectly with the fact that Yom Kippur illustrates the ark becoming the focal point at the EOW.<br />But it’s not going to be a fight over who gets their hands on the ark; God has full control of the ark. Also, this is not a message to worship the ark itself, as if it were inherently magical. The battle of Armageddon is a battle over the truth which the ark represents. And[size=12pt] it’s not a physical war[/size], except to the extent that the enemies of truth will use persecution and violence, just as they have done many times down through history (see John 16:2). But those defending the truth will have no need or desire to engage in any type of physical battle.<br />S. 21<br />This is not a message of fear, it’s a message of faith, a faith that will conquer Lucifer and all who take sides with him. This is what the final battle is all about; the battle where faith and only faith will win the victory and prize: to sit with God on His throne—this is the battle, the final battle, the battle of Armageddon!!!!!!!
<br />I’m relieved it’s not a physical battle, because I don’t believe Michael would ever endorse violence.<br /><br />Simpa<br />
- Armageddon = "battle of truth" ----> reminded me of Michael's words: "TRUTH always prevails" and how he always fought for HIS truth to come out! which is also one of the purposes of his hoax<br />- "the true ark" versus "the many counterfeit arks" ----> could these "counterfeit arks" symbolize all the story versions fabricated by the tabloid media about MJ and his life? If not, what else do they mean??<br />- "throne on earth" versus "throne in heaven" ...
<br />Makes me wonder how many more “true” this and “false” that modern understandings, there isn’t also from in the Bible besides the Ark of the Covenant. It's like a special 'key' is needed to understand the Bible as it relates to today and our future. Remember the painting of Michael holding the book with the key?<br />That's why I'm looking so forward to the next Signs!! TS :icon_razz: :icon_e_wink:<br />
<br />Awwwww.... Sim; I didn't know you were dealing with Romanian. :-\ <br /><br />Did any of the videos I posted make any sense to you? Feel free to pm me with questions; I'll try to do my best. All the feasts & festivals are still a learning curve for me as they are with most Christians because we have forgotten the Jewish roots of our faith. Christianity is a sect of Judaism... the Roman Church is the once that changed things once the Apostles and their proteges died off. <br /> :bearhug:
<br />Thank you , MsTrinity333, you're too kind... For now I only managed to read the 2 SIGNS several times... I didn't want to 'charge' my mind with any more additional information yet, as I find these first 2 SIGN already too much for me loll<br />But I keep watching the 2 threads and when I am prepared I'll 'dig" into the videos posted here and there, too....<br /><br />Instead of additional links and videos, I was more hoping for a group -analysis (brainstorming) , here on the threads, dissecting the SIGNS line by line! by those who are already able to understand some more of it than others... <br /><br />I think I need to read SIGN 2 a couple of more times.... besides the first sections where it is explained how this system of the sanctuary is built/divided, well...the rest didn't make any sens to me ....<br />What is this sanctuary with furniture and all these parallels to festivals that I have never heard of before? type and anti-type ? :icon_eek: <br />Strangely enough , this ^^ type vs anti-type stuff made me think of the illusion aspect of the hoax: reality vs. illusion; real events vs. movie (hoax) events ... <br />Re-reading the SIGNS... I feel like a stupid lil' kid listening to grown ups discussions and not being able to understand a thing... :icon_lol: who then asks all the impossible questions about all the details :icon_lol: :icon_lol:<br /><br />
on 1333576495:
<br />Simpa, bless yo litl ol heart! I love your thoughts on the Signs! Please keep them coming! :woohoo2:
Well... thank you, dear, that's at least encouraging loll as I was already a bit afraid of sounding too ignorant or even stupid with regards to my ZERO knowledge in religion... Therefore I don't even trust my own thoughts on this... I frankly just throw them here with the hope that someone either helps me make any sense of them or just makes me understand what is wrong or good...<br /><br /><br />
on 1333576495:
<br />Simpa<br />
- Armageddon = "battle of truth" ----> reminded me of Michael's words: "TRUTH always prevails" and how he always fought for HIS truth to come out! which is also one of the purposes of his hoax<br />- "the true ark" versus "the many counterfeit arks" ----> could these "counterfeit arks" symbolize all the story versions fabricated by the tabloid media about MJ and his life? If not, what else do they mean??<br />- "throne on earth" versus "throne in heaven" ...
<br />Makes me wonder how many more “true” this and “false” that modern understandings, there isn’t also from in the Bible besides the Ark of the Covenant. It's like a special 'key' is needed to understand the Bible as it relates to today and our future. Remember the painting of Michael holding the book with the key?<br />That's why I'm looking so forward to the next Signs!! TS :icon_razz: :icon_e_wink:
Especially because of these fears and doubts about how well the Bible was translated...i always hesitated to read it... I've always thought what good breaking my head trying to understand a text ...already dual and subtle in meaning, only to discover later that it wasn't even the original meaning intended!!??<br />Ok, a good part of the Bible may be correctly translated, but who knows what parts are wrong!? And are they wrong by human error? or because 'someone" had an interest? And who knows who to trust when it comes to Bible - texts explanations?? this is so complicated...<br />We can't trust religions.... we can't trust priests, we can't trust the Bible (being well translated), then my only FULL, complete TRUST goes to GOD and only HIM!<br /><br />And I really hope these SIGNS are posted in relation to the hoax, because if they are exclusively posted for a religious purpose, then I'm afraid they won't help me much... I don't know how much they help others, but so far, for me ... no sense at all! I hope the next signs will bring more light in here!
Jesus was Born a Jew<br /><br />Jesus is a real, historical person, born in the Land of Israel, during the Roman occupation, in approximately the year 3 BCE. However, at the time His name was actually pronounced, "Yeshua," and that is the name used in this article.<br /><br />That Yeshua was born Jewish is one of the least contested truths of the Bible. The very first verse of the New Covenant reads: The book of the genealogy of Messiah Yeshua ("Jesus Christ"), the son of David, the son of Abraham (Matt. 1:1). Who were Abraham and David?<br />(Cont)... <br /><br />Nevertheless, according to the Bible, the Messiah must be descended from the tribe of Judah (Gen. 49:10) as King David was (1Sam. 17:12, 1Ch. 28:4) and descended from King David himself (2Sam. 7:12-13, Isa. 9:6-7, Jer. 23:5-6). That is why the Messiah is called Son of David (Matt. 21:9).<br /><br />Yeshua (Jesus) is from the Tribe of Judah (Heb. 7:14). His earthly father was descended from David (Matt. 1:6-16) and His mother was as well (Luke 1:27, 32-34, 3:23-31).<br /><br />In addition, Yeshua was born King of the Jews (Matt. 2:2). The King of the Jews must Himself be Jewish (Deut. 17:15). His aunt Elizabeth was Jewish (a descendant of Aaron, Moses' brother) and His uncle Zacharia was a Jewish priest (Luke 1:5, 36). Yeshua was circumcised according to Jewish law (Luke 2:21, Lev. 12:2-3), and redeemed according to Jewish law (Luke 2:22-23, Num. 18:15). His mother atoned according to Jewish law (Luke 2:24, Lev. 12:6-8). He is called The Consolation of Israel (Luke 2:25) and The Glory of Thy People Israel (Luke 2:32). Jesus was born a Jew.<br />http://jesusisajew.org/Jesus_is_a_Jew.php<br /><br />Question: "Was Jesus a Jew?"<br /><br />Answer: One needs only to search the internet today to determine that there is great controversy and disagreement over the question of whether Jesus of Nazareth was actually Jewish. Before we can answer this question adequately, we must first ask another question: who (or what) is a Jew?... http://www.gotquestions.org/was-Jesus-a-Jew.html<br /><br />http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/religion/jesus/bornliveddied.html<br /><br />Was Jesus a Jew?<br />Discovering the Jewish Jesus<br />http://www.biblicalarchaeology.org/daily/people-cultures-in-the-bible/was-jesus-a-jew/<br />
[size=12pt]Considering that April 5th is Nisan 14, I coridally invite all on the forum to attend an event...<br />Details are here: http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/forum/index.php/topic,22463.msg396716/topicseen.html#new<br /><br />Its short notice I know. Apologies. But that is why I am posting in the two most popular threads, so that if you are interested you dont find out late.<br /><br />well wishes to all<br /><br />[/size]
<br />And yet again I throw my hands in the air and give up on this topic, because the truth depends on who you listen to... and The Sign ain't talking.<br />
<br />And yet again I throw my hands in the air and give up on this topic, because the truth depends on who you listen to... and The Sign ain't talking.<br />
<br /><br />the sign is mute >:( >:( >:(<br />
<br /><br />ok ok yes I realize that's how the whole hoax is set up, yes yes I get the irony of my statement.<br /><br />*bec wanders off muttering to herself*
Comments
"For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places."